Work Issues

[prancer53]

I now do supply teaching which has been seriously affected by education cuts. Recently I was sent to a school & informed, only when I arrived there, that I would have to do lunch duty as well. Lunch was 30 minutes & I was expected to be in the dining room at the correct time (no time for loo to do test & jab & had to go through dining room to get to it so would probably have been stopped by another member of staff). I rushed to the staff room, reached into a locker for my handbag & had a jab then & there. No one said anything & I got into the dining room only a couple of minutes late--they did provide me with a lunch which was cold by the time I waited for porcine insulin to work.....happy days......!!!

I was never asked back there....

 

[prancer53]

Under this government, modern slavery is rife... workers no longer have rights, written into the law or not- there is no one to implement and enforce it. The companies are too powerful and the workers are too scared to take action to be left out of a job and end up on welfare which doesn't meet your needs along with the stigma attached to it! Seems like we are back in the Dickensian era! Sad!

No longer any regulation.......

 

[DCUKMod]

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I worked in the civil service and my employer was very good, it was the lower level managers who were the problem, trying to assert their little bit of power !

Employees with a long term health problem now have the legal right to ask for 'reasonable adjustments' to allow then to manage their ilness. Having medication with you is not an unreasonable request to make, nor is it unreasonable to expect them to agree to.

But as I said, ask for an independent health assessment and the assessor will inform the employer of their responsibilities. Again, if you have no luck, speak to citizens advice; they have vast experience of these sort of events and can you advise on how to proceed in your local area.

I'm not challenging that anyone having a disabling condition shouldn't be accommodated, within reasonable parameters, provided the core business can still run, in a profitable state, with those adjustments in play, my point is it is reasonable that any person requesting such changes allow their employer to ascertain the state of their health and the actuality of any conditions claimed.

I'm not suggesting this is the case, but there are some naughty people out there whose claims can transpire to be a bit inflated. To be clear again - I am not suggesting this is the case for this OP.

 

[prancer53]

In a similar vein, I can go one step further with reference of an Employer's ignorance of illness. Last year, after an Internal transfer from one division to another, involving moving a total of 500 miles, I discovered a Management Bullying & Intimidation culture at my new place of work. The previous 3.5 years counted for nothing and despite my best efforts to beat their "systematic bullying and humiliation" processes, within 4 months I was diagnosed by my GP with Severe Stress and Depression, and placed on medications to combat it.

However, my Medications regime effectively went out of the window as I battled to combat not only the stress but a totally disrupted Sleep pattern, when sometimes I'd go without sleep for up to 48 hours at a time! Luckily, I had Union representation; I say luckily, as my Employers worked on the format that not only did they not recognise Stress and Depression as illnesses, but also didn't allow for Diabetes - to them, these 3 illnesses (amongst others) were "all in the mind!".

Part of their bullying was to disallow me to have my Blood Testing Meter, strips etc., plus snacks which I had discreetly hidden away in a purpose made pouch in a coat pocket; meal times were disrupted oe even taken away by an utterly crazy shift pattern which was designed to seriously impact with me medically.

I was stuck deep in the Highlands of Scotland, couldn't afford to get away for job searching but equally couldn't afford to be out of work and it was a vicious circle. Ultimately, I walked out after the company tried to ban my Union Rep and legal team from representing me at hearings brought into the equation when illness, including Diabetic episodes, caused me to miss work.

My next move to an altogether utterly different employer demonstrated how the whole scenario could be and was handled. I am only sorry, in hindsight, that I didn't get out sooner than I did; equally, a great number of those colleagues I left behind have suffered in a similar way, such that some left under medical duress but some are still there to this day. Others in the same company at other sites are bullied to be back at work or face dismissal, literally days after having major medical surgery. Regrettably, some companies still exist in this day and age..... and seem to get away with it!

My company needed extra cash for a new building and decided to make redundancies in order to save money--I was one of those made redundant. Fellow teachers told me I should visit the doctor in order to be signed off with stress for the rest of the academic year. I didn't but later understood their advice as my life became very, very difficult. However I am resilient and was determined to get my students through their qualifications (they all got distinctions) and so end my time at this college well (for me & students). They did attempt the diabetes card--without success--with the help of the NUT I would have taken them to court (this had already happened to my manager after having given a kidney to his sister--he won his case). After I left the college they failed OFSTED so had less money from the local authority for student funding. RESULT--a brand new building which was virtually empty because there were hardly any students (unfortunately most of my colleagues were made redundant the following year because the college could no longer afford to pay them). Apart from redundancies the result c/b summed up in 1 word: KARMA..... This happened in 2011 & I have taught ever since however education is in such a mess, because of all the cuts, so I am thinking about going for early retirement (s/b March 2018 but have had enough....frankly....). Sorry not really about my diabetes but really to illustrate that with lack of money and cuts employers go to unbelievable lengths to get rid of staff & if you are vulnerable, in any way at all (eg diabetes) you are usually 1st in the firing line. So sad & awful!! I have had type 1 since I was 8 yrs (56 years going on 57) & it has never affected my ability to do a job well!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[prancer53]

In a similar vein, I can go one step further with reference of an Employer's ignorance of illness. Last year, after an Internal transfer from one division to another, involving moving a total of 500 miles, I discovered a Management Bullying & Intimidation culture at my new place of work. The previous 3.5 years counted for nothing and despite my best efforts to beat their "systematic bullying and humiliation" processes, within 4 months I was diagnosed by my GP with Severe Stress and Depression, and placed on medications to combat it.

However, my Medications regime effectively went out of the window as I battled to combat not only the stress but a totally disrupted Sleep pattern, when sometimes I'd go without sleep for up to 48 hours at a time! Luckily, I had Union representation; I say luckily, as my Employers worked on the format that not only did they not recognise Stress and Depression as illnesses, but also didn't allow for Diabetes - to them, these 3 illnesses (amongst others) were "all in the mind!".

Part of their bullying was to disallow me to have my Blood Testing Meter, strips etc., plus snacks which I had discreetly hidden away in a purpose made pouch in a coat pocket; meal times were disrupted oe even taken away by an utterly crazy shift pattern which was designed to seriously impact with me medically.

I was stuck deep in the Highlands of Scotland, couldn't afford to get away for job searching but equally couldn't afford to be out of work and it was a vicious circle. Ultimately, I walked out after the company tried to ban my Union Rep and legal team from representing me at hearings brought into the equation when illness, including Diabetic episodes, caused me to miss work.

My next move to an altogether utterly different employer demonstrated how the whole scenario could be and was handled. I am only sorry, in hindsight, that I didn't get out sooner than I did; equally, a great number of those colleagues I left behind have suffered in a similar way, such that some left under medical duress but some are still there to this day. Others in the same company at other sites are bullied to be back at work or face dismissal, literally days after having major medical surgery. Regrettably, some companies still exist in this day and age..... and seem to get away with it!

One manager I had reported me because she saw me using my BM meter in the staff room. Reason she reported me: she thought it was my phone.............

 

[prancer53]

Last year I had an interview, for a long term teaching supply job, during which not 1 health question was asked. Weeks into the job the manager told me that someone had told her I was diabetic (don't know how--hadn't mentioned it to anyone--was teaching in an NHS setting though) so she thought I wouldn't be suitable to do my job. I persuaded her otherwise but left after my "honourary" tenure expired. Since then she has attempted to get rid of another teacher-- with MS--again unsuccessfully--but this lady (who was a psychiatrist before going into teaching) has been successful in an interview for another job in her former field. Employment is going back to Victorian ways of employing people in this, our gig, economy. (From a prospective match girl phossy jaw occurs later.. LOL....!!! (although it isn't at all funny but have no wish to go political ......)

 

[prancer53]

Just to illustrate further the prevalence of getting rid of vulnerable staff: my husband is a C6/7 complete (neck break) tetraplegic & was extremely successful as a manager at BT. He was made redundant after contacting a former colleague for advice (reason for doing so was that he should not have contacted another dept for advice --without any examination of the context and/ or reasons why. Apparently BT were attempting to close down hubby's dept by giving ridiculously high targets which basically guaranteed failure and dismissal of all the people working there. Because of his hard work & excellent motivational skills his dept hit every single (impossible) target so BT had a go at hubby instead--they actually understood that his using his health as a reason would not stand up in a court or dismissal procedure so instead they manufactured a very "flakey" reason to make him redundant (as his work and target record showed how good he was at his job)....terrible but he immediately found another job, is now retired & loves it......

 

[prancer53]

Last year I had an interview, for a long term teaching supply job, during which not 1 health question was asked. Weeks into the job the manager told me that someone had told her I was diabetic (don't know how--hadn't mentioned it to anyone--was teaching in an NHS setting though) so she thought I wouldn't be suitable to do my job. I persuaded her otherwise but left after my "honourary" tenure expired. Since then she has attempted to get rid of another teacher-- with MS--again unsuccessfully--but this lady (who was a psychiatrist before going into teaching) has been successful in an interview for another job in her former field. Employment is going back to Victorian ways of employing people in this, our gig, economy. (From a prospective match girl phossy jaw occurs later.. LOL....!!! (although it isn't at all funny but have no wish to go political ......)

oh & manager in question asked me why I didn't tell her I was diabetic. My response was why didn't she ask me any questions about my health (normally I answer that I am diabetic but that it in no way impinges on my ability to teach & carry out my duties).

 

[prancer53]

@south869 what medication are you on for your diabetes? This goes into whether your type 2 diabetes is considered a disability under the equality act. The test for whether something is a disability for the purpose of the equality act is whether there is a long term condition that would have a significant adverse impact on your ability to conduct day to day activities without treatment. Now, under this test type 1 is definitely a disability as without treatment a type 1 would be dead. Whether your type 2 is a disability under this test depends upon how it is treated. An employment tribunal judge in one case said his type 2 diabetes was treated with diet alone and therefore wasn't a disability.

So diet treated type 2, not a disabiliy. Insulin treated type 2 is a disability. Then all the other medications will sit in the grey area in between from metformin (probably not a disability) to Gliclazide (probably is a disability).

If your type 2 is a disability then you get the benefits of the equality act protections against discrimination. Your employer has a duty to accommodate your disability by making reasonable adjustments. So for someone working in retail where there is a rule you can't have anything in your pocket on the shop floor it would be a reasonable adjustment to bend that rule to allow them to have test kit and hypo treatment. Whether this applies in your case in a factory depends on the reasons for the rule for no items in your work station: if there are safety or regulatory reasons that prohibit them, it might not be reasonable to bend the rule. But you might find that the body conducting the inspections are probably well aware of the diversity need to accommodate disability so may have made their own accommodation to the rules for the inspection, and actually your employer showing they have given you reasonable adjustments to keep you safe with access to test kit might give them brownie points in the inspection.

Equally, if you have difficulty with rules about time off due to a disability these rules can be adjusted so days off caused by your disability don't count against you.

Re type 1 being a disability: as I understand it it is whether I consider my condition t/b a disability---which I do not....

 

[prancer53]

Just to add some further information, I work in a factory on the shop floor and have a workstation (assembly ) with lin bins on racking, I normaly pop a snack bar and my meds (tablets + Accu-chek) in a spare bin to hide it away, we get 5s inspections and get rated, but the main issue is you dont eat or have unnecessary items at work, as a result of diabetes I now have lipodermatosclerosis and have been off work for some long periods, resulting in poor marks when the pay reviews come round.
I was ok to allow medical checks on my "current" illness however the new manager has taken an issue and demanded "I prove my diabetes"
Because of the breaks from work and what other see as being workshy, my old manager told me the team were wary of me as I didn't join in, "I should join in when the end of the week comes" as they let off steam on Fridays and mess about, getting the local sandwich shop to delivery rolls, ordering pizza for lunch, long story short, I joined in and then faced a disciplinary for "gross industrial missconduct" which was short for "we dont want you here with a gimpy leg and being of sick"

When I wasn't allowed to eat at work I used to go to the loo to eat......bit disgusting but it kept diabetes stable. I have since used cupboards in which to eat.......if anyone came in I would just make a joke. Probably got put off as an 8 year old (& upwards) when I used to have to eat every 2 hours (on 1 jab og mixed PZI & soluble daily) so school allowed me an extra bottle of milk (yes, that long ago in free school milk days...) in the afternoon as well as the morning. However to get the milk I had to walk right round the classroom, all the way back & then get a noisy paper bag out with 2 rich tea to have with it = 20g cho......didn't enjoy that but the school were brilliant & all without any legislation to dictate what they should/ shouldn't do.....

 

[prancer53]

I haven't personally had any issues such as you describe, but from time to time we have members reporting they have issues carrying kit or any form of food with them. Often that's relating to either employer's policy - often in secure areas, food or retail environments.

I have a waist belt with a purse which I wear at work in which I keep sweets/ glucose. Can wear it under clothes so is unobtrusive

 

[south869]

Just popped back to check and thanks for the replies, some good advice, some of it already taken, yes I am a union member and they are next to useless, union rep turned up for a meeting without knowing what it was about no notes no info and no help.
His presence made it worse, I have use the relevant legislation, but I know I will get "We looked into this and found nothing"

They are now claiming is was not said, I miss understood the supervisor, he never said I could not have anything there, I did use the fridge in the canteen before until someone took my food, for most its no problem but as I follow a low carbs, low salt, low sugar diet its not easy to just get another snack, I am being sent to Hull at the moment, it's like Coventry but smells worse, no one will come near me as despsite it spos to be "confidential" everyone knows, no one wants to be too close as the smelly stuff flies around, there looking into my mental state as it must be the only thing left to cause this, my supervisor denies any wrong doing and the manager keeps telling I am imagining it and miss heard.

I am using the Equalities Act 2010 as there are other factors which have being brewing, as far as it goes the job it's gone this is the last option and I will continue to follow through until a tribunal, for those who have replied I thank you and feel your pain, I have laid in bed in a cold sweat having flash backs of the days events (everyday something is wrong, but their not picking on me honest guv) I sit in the car lunchtimes as I cant stand being in the factory wondering who or whats happening next, it's getting to the point..... well I dont want to think about it but it's always lurking I wonder why the hell do I bother there are quick ways to end this.

 

[busydiabeticmum]

Just popped back to check and thanks for the replies, some good advice, some of it already taken, yes I am a union member and they are next to useless, union rep turned up for a meeting without knowing what it was about no notes no info and no help.
His presence made it worse, I have use the relevant legislation, but I know I will get "We looked into this and found nothing"

They are now claiming is was not said, I miss understood the supervisor, he never said I could not have anything there, I did use the fridge in the canteen before until someone took my food, for most its no problem but as I follow a low carbs, low salt, low sugar diet its not easy to just get another snack, I am being sent to Hull at the moment, it's like Coventry but smells worse, no one will come near me as despsite it spos to be "confidential" everyone knows, no one wants to be too close as the smelly stuff flies around, there looking into my mental state as it must be the only thing left to cause this, my supervisor denies any wrong doing and the manager keeps telling I am imagining it and miss heard.

I am using the Equalities Act 2010 as there are other factors which have being brewing, as far as it goes the job it's gone this is the last option and I will continue to follow through until a tribunal, for those who have replied I thank you and feel your pain, I have laid in bed in a cold sweat having flash backs of the days events (everyday something is wrong, but their not picking on me honest guv) I sit in the car lunchtimes as I cant stand being in the factory wondering who or whats happening next, it's getting to the point..... well I dont want to think about it but it's always lurking I wonder why the hell do I bother there are quick ways to end this.

What you said.... it really touches me.... this is exactly what I used to think when I suffered with depression! Easier isn't better!
It is easier to lay down and allow them to treat you badly... but is it better? What about the effects it has on other people who may suffer the same fate because they got away with it.
Easier may be ending it all... but what about the deep deep heart ache for the people you leave behind? Go back to your doctor and tell them how you are feeling, PLEASE. Don't take the easy route... it may seem easy, but truly it isn't.
You have to fight that thought. Go to you MP, go to Jeremy corbyn... have them raise your issue, use this to turn this around, not just for you but for others who don't have a voice or the ability.
Please don't just leave it. Please get help.

 

[south869]

I do suffer sometimes and at the end of the day I can be at my lowest, I admit it can be very dark some days, I am in constant pain and feel so low because at my age I shouldn't be like this. Some days it's all I can do to get from the door to the car, I have some new antibiotics which seem to be helping my leg so I am hoping the pain will be soon less of a problem.

 

[busydiabeticmum]

I do suffer sometimes and at the end of the day I can be at my lowest, I admit it can be very dark some days, I am in constant pain and feel so low because at my age I shouldn't be like this. Some days it's all I can do to get from the door to the car, I have some new antibiotics which seem to be helping my leg so I am hoping the pain will be soon less of a problem.

Do you have anyone else who can come and be with you?
You really need to have someone to visit you, make you a cup of tea and just have a chat. Try to have a special night each week to have something to look forward to... even if it is visiting a friend or relative for a meal or a movie night or something you enjoy. Having something to look forward to will raise your spirits a bit.
Don't just suffer in silence, speak to your doctor too, they may get you extra support and they can help you with all this work related stuff.

 

[first14808]

Just to add some thoughts from an employer's (and personal) point of view..

By the time things get to the state south869's describing, it's probably best to get out while you still can. If the employer/line manager has decided you're a problem, then they'll be looking for ways to manage you out. That can quickly become a personal thing if the manager's decided you're challenging their authority. Even though in this case, the manager is being a **** and opening up the company to liability issues.

Problem is that although the discrimination Act(s) provide protection from discrimination on grounds of health or disability, the result can be a lose/lose situation. So to 'win' you may need to go to tribunal, roll the dice with the panel and you might win the right to keep your job, or some compensation. But it can be incredibly stressful, expensive and time consuming, and if you win, you may find the employer's still going to try to manage you out.. Which leads to more stress, and sounds like depression is already setting in. That's not good or healthy. Sadly though, it's business, albeit bad business.

As for things like health questions at interviews.. That's part of the minefield. In my experience (and preference) it's best to do those in 2 stages. So first interview would be about whether the person can do the job, and how good a fit they seem to be for the role. If a candidate passes that interview, they're handed over to HR to ask the awkward questions. That's partly due to the risks in the discrimination act, ie dealing with any suggestion of discriminating against a candidate, and also a good HR person can better understand any adjustments that may be needed if they're hired. There's also data protection and privacy issues to consider.

But all I'm interested in is whether the candidate can do the job, or not. From my experience, diabetics have never been an issue as it's pretty much self-managed by the individual. Adjustments have also been minor, ie a bit of awareness.. Which I still think is a key issue, ie other staff may be nervous of seeing insulin in a fridge, but that's easily manageable. There's a wide range of first aid pouches to keep medical stuff in, and staff can be warned not to touch someone's snacks.

And being recently diagnosed myself, probably also opportunities to raise staff awareness. That may need some sensitivity, but might also encourage other staff to get checked. I suspect I've been diabetic for quite a while without realising it.

 

[lmc]

You are in a truly horrible situation and I feel so sorry for you. All you want to do is go to work, do your job and go home but there are some truly awful people who take a dislike to someone for reasons known only to them and will not leave them alone.

You can try and fight it but it is likely it will impact on your mental health. I made a complaint against my manager after he breached my confidentiality which was upheld. My union rep could not attend the meeting and did not seem interested. I have since found out you can ask for another rep. My manager wanted to get rid of me. He had no grounds to do so but made it his mission to try to wind me up regularly. I knew he would win eventually so got the first job I could and left.. I regret leaving as I loved my job but it was having a serious effect on my mental health. Many people left after me due to him and eventually he was asked to leave.

People like that will use any reason they can find and unfortunately diabetics are vunerable. We try to work but are still judged against able bodied people if we differ from their idea of normal. Disability legislation is often lip service.

If you want to fight this case, you have to have that mental strength to do so. If not, please look for another job. It may be less money but it would get you out.

Also, please see your doctor for help.