I'm so new to this forum, I don't know how to send a private message to @Geordie lass. When I was reading another thread I did notice that someone else referred to their bariatric weight loss support group but I failed to take a note of their name and can't find it again.
Weight loss surgery, anyone any experience?
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ManUtdGal!
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Hi Janice, I have been Type 1 since I was 3 and stayed pretty slim but after my youngest was born I had complications which resulted in a Hysterectomy and removal of the wall of muscle in my abdomen. This means I can not tone my stomach at all. I have limited mobility after a car crash and with arthritis in my back, neck and shoulders am unable to exercise other than slow walks with my crutches or sticks. I have an under active thyroid also and that puts weight on if not at the right dose of meds. Due to all this I put on a lot of weight and went up to 17st 1lb so I had a Gastric Sleeve done. It's the best thing I ever did as I have lost 5 stone in 9 months!!!!! Woo hoo!!! I say go for it as you only get one life and it can improve it substantially..
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Hi @Janice2209
To send a message to a member click on the little envelope symbol, then select 'start a new conversation' on the drop down tab.
As for having bariatric surgery, I was offered it, but decclined. Instead deciding to use the Newcastle diet method. I lost 42 kg very quickly and after 3 years have regained around 12kg.
I do know several people who have had the surgery. 4 had gastric bypass, 1 had gastric band. The person with the band seems happiest with the result, and has lost eight stones. Those with the bypass have mixed feelings. All have lost weight, but all but one have experienced difficulties, such as depression at 'losing identity'. That was a man, who had come from a family where everyone had been obese, and none had lived beyond 59. He had feelings of guilt when he reached his 60 th birthday. Also had always thought of himself as the fat, happy man, referring to himself as Mr Blobby. The others were women, 2 had discomfort and trouble with digestion. The other still craved the food she had always used, and started to liquidise cake and cream, ice cream and such. She gained much of the weight she had lost. Another did similar, and had an inoperable abdominal hernia. Surgery is not an easy fix, and you need to consider the psychological effect too. Also, the fact that you are not able to eat amounts you could previously and the need to take digestive enzyme medications afterwards. Sorry this sounds so negative, and it is not my personal experience, just observations of members of a weight management group. From my limited understanding, it looks as if the gastric band has been most successful, and least devastating of the surgical methods. Maybe someone on forum will give info on their personal experience.
Hope this helps. You have a lot to consider in making the decision.
Best wishes, Pipp
ManUtdGal!
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Hi Janice, the gastric band is not a permanent thing and bands have caused people a lot of problems like twisting etc. Also when it is removed your stomach will be the same size and you are likely to overeat again. That is why I had the Sleeve as it is permanent with fewer side effects than the bypass. They do keyhole surgery and remove between 60 - 70% of your stomach so you are UNABLE to eat much. You will only eat what your body NEEDS not what it Wants. You have liquids only for 3 weeks after then you have puréed food for 2 - 3 weeks and then eat normal food. My dinner plate is a side plate and that even holds too much! You will lose a fair bit quite quickly due to fluid etc but then it will slow down. You do have to take a multi vitamin for life after and if you eat too much you can be sick but other than that I personally have had no problems. It is a far less invasive procedure too. Hope this helps.
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Thanks, @hld1904
That information is useful to me too.
What effect did the surgery have on your diabetes?
Thank you hid1904 and Pipp. The surgeon has recommended the gastric bypass so I don't have the option of the gastric band.
I've asked for a psych consult as well. My weight gain is to do with bereavement, stress and disability so I have some emotional issues to take care of before I make a decision. Oh, and overeating and not moving enough to sort out.
Yes I know moving and more and eating less will fix it. I know the mathematics that eating 500 calories fewer than you need every day will result in a 1lb weight loss each and every week.
I've achieved that through low fat diets with the Canadian fitness programme (2 stone); I've achieved it through Low fat cooking and aerobics (3 stone), I've achieved through breaking my ankle (2 stone), I've achieved it through serious infection (3 stone in 3 weeks).
I have been overweight most of my adult life and morbidly obese for the last 5 years.
I've asked for a psych consult as well. My weight gain is to do with bereavement, stress and disability so I have some emotional issues to take care of before I make a decision. Oh, and overeating and not moving enough to sort out.
Yes I know moving and more and eating less will fix it. I know the mathematics that eating 500 calories fewer than you need every day will result in a 1lb weight loss each and every week.
I've achieved that through low fat diets with the Canadian fitness programme (2 stone); I've achieved it through Low fat cooking and aerobics (3 stone), I've achieved through breaking my ankle (2 stone), I've achieved it through serious infection (3 stone in 3 weeks).
I have been overweight most of my adult life and morbidly obese for the last 5 years.
ManUtdGal!
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Had to adjust my insulin but I have Type 1 I know from talking with several Drs that some Type 2 patients were back to normal and were rid of the diabetes after their weight loss. You will more than likely find it improves a lot or may even stop.
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Yes, T2 can be resolved within days. That was what the Newcastle diet was devised for, to mimic the effect of bariatric surgery, by a similar diet to the post surgery diet, but without the surgery.
For me the result has been non-diabetes blood glucose for the three years since doing the Newcastle diet. The weight loss is still a work in progress, but like Janice2209, I am disabled and have not been able to exercise much recently due to this and other health problems.
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I think you are wise to take your time making the decision. I feel for you, as I can empathise with the spiral of emotional distress, disability, bereavement etc, on ability to get control of weight and blood glucose etc.
However, it would seem imperative that you take action to reduce your weight soon. I do advocate the Newcastle diet for rapid weight loss. Some people have been even more successful than I have, and have lost all the weight they needed to lose and have returned to normal blood glucose control. I have had success in blood glucose control, but still need to lose around 5 stones.
In addition, many forum members use the low carb, high fat method. It it the carbs that cause high blood glucose and weight gain rather than fat. So the idea is to use very little carb in diet and get the calories from fat instead. Completely different to the recommendations, as low fat food has sugar added to replace the fat. Not good for diabetes. Confusing, I know. Why not read forum info, ask questions, do some research, have the psych consultation, then make an informed decision. The fact that you are hesitant may be a sign that you are not ready to take the drastic measure of surgery, but if after you have considered the options you will be able to make an informed decision.
I wish you well, please keep posting to let us know how you are and what you decide.
Pipp
I did use a low carb high fat diet to lose some weight about 33 years ago. It was successful but I put it back on +. I also tried a very low calorie diet when I was 17 or so. Again successful but weight went back on. I did low fat in my 30s, very successfully but put it back on +. In my 50s I've lost 3 stones 3 times but then put it back on +. I think I have a skewed relationship with food and the knocks in life have hit me in the stomach.
My failure to sustain weight loss in the past has made me scared to go on yet another diet with the fear that I'll only end up heavier again within a year or so.
I know I will feel far better when I lose weight. I know life would be better. I know all the theories and mathematics. I also think the current NHS guidelines on healthy eating include far too many carbs and in fact the post surgery diet is both a VLC and a H(Protein)LC diet. I'd like to think that I have above average intelligence (held down senior jobs in IT and management for many years).
I know all this stuff but still eat too much. Eating too much has made it so I can't do so many things. I am so fat I am a joke. I can't fit in booths in a restaurant. I can't fit in an airline seat without an extension belt. I've developed T2 diabetes. I need an appliance to wipe my own bottom. The excess weight is all so visible as soon as anyone looks at me I am embarrassed to meet anyone new and don't want to see any of my old friends because they would be shocked. My self confidence has plummeted. It is so painful and my head knows what to do about it (please, please don't any more nurses try to give me any more patronising education, for goodness sake, I probably know more about the subject than you do) but my emotions still eat.
I think my only realistic way of losing the excess weight is surgery but I am daunted by the prospect and would really like more experienced views here. (Not that I don't value any other views, please continue to offer suggestions, they may help me and they may help others).
My failure to sustain weight loss in the past has made me scared to go on yet another diet with the fear that I'll only end up heavier again within a year or so.
I know I will feel far better when I lose weight. I know life would be better. I know all the theories and mathematics. I also think the current NHS guidelines on healthy eating include far too many carbs and in fact the post surgery diet is both a VLC and a H(Protein)LC diet. I'd like to think that I have above average intelligence (held down senior jobs in IT and management for many years).
I know all this stuff but still eat too much. Eating too much has made it so I can't do so many things. I am so fat I am a joke. I can't fit in booths in a restaurant. I can't fit in an airline seat without an extension belt. I've developed T2 diabetes. I need an appliance to wipe my own bottom. The excess weight is all so visible as soon as anyone looks at me I am embarrassed to meet anyone new and don't want to see any of my old friends because they would be shocked. My self confidence has plummeted. It is so painful and my head knows what to do about it (please, please don't any more nurses try to give me any more patronising education, for goodness sake, I probably know more about the subject than you do) but my emotions still eat.
I think my only realistic way of losing the excess weight is surgery but I am daunted by the prospect and would really like more experienced views here. (Not that I don't value any other views, please continue to offer suggestions, they may help me and they may help others).
Where are you HLD? The gastric sleeve wasn't offered to me. The gastric bypass is also a laporoscopic (sp) procedure. I've been told that the gastric sleeve doesn't have the same affect on T2 diabetes as the bypass does.
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@Janice2209 - I may not be saying anything you don't know, but unless you deal with your relationship with food, I don't believe you will get maximum benefit from any surgery.
Although after surgery your stomach will be significantly smaller than at present, it is still possible to consume large amounts of calories, if one still makes atrocious food choices. I haven't had this sort of surgery myself, but worked with someone who had it. She lost a massive amount of weight, but did actually manage to regain most of it by blending mega high calorie foods, including wall to wall chocolate, and eventually her tiny stomach stretched to accommodate more food than was initially planned, and so on it went. She went through hell regaining the weight because it made her quite ill. But, such was her destructive relationship with food. Last I heard she was considering further surgery to re-start the process. Very sad.
Have you been offered any help dealing with the underlying issues?
Although after surgery your stomach will be significantly smaller than at present, it is still possible to consume large amounts of calories, if one still makes atrocious food choices. I haven't had this sort of surgery myself, but worked with someone who had it. She lost a massive amount of weight, but did actually manage to regain most of it by blending mega high calorie foods, including wall to wall chocolate, and eventually her tiny stomach stretched to accommodate more food than was initially planned, and so on it went. She went through hell regaining the weight because it made her quite ill. But, such was her destructive relationship with food. Last I heard she was considering further surgery to re-start the process. Very sad.
Have you been offered any help dealing with the underlying issues?
Yes, I am down for a psych consult but the waiting time is up to six months (3 months in). I don't think I'm at risk of melting chocolate or making Ben & Jerry smoothies. I eat healthily, just too much. It's just the comfort of feeling full. Difficult to describe really.
When you've been on a diet for several weeks or days and you fall off the wagon, that feeling is so comforting.
When you've been on a diet for several weeks or days and you fall off the wagon, that feeling is so comforting.
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So, if it is the feeling of being full, rather than eating the wrong sort of foods can this be achieved by eating a lot of low calorie non-fattening healthy food? Or perhaps some sort of product like sugar free jelly?
Loobles
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Thanks for taging me @Totto, I hadn't seen this.
I completely understand what you're going through @Janice2209 as I'm in a similar situation (though not been offered bariatric surgery yet).
My history with food
I've been an over-eater and starver for years and my weight has always gone up or down (mostly up) depending on whether I'm in binge-mode or starve-mode. More recently, I've been in starve mode, because I have a lot of weight to lose after being in binge-mode for so long. Essentially I'm an "all or nothing" eater and rarely have any kind of balance. My thoughts and feelings about food are not normal, I feel guilty for eating anything, I obsess over counting calories and macronutrients, I am plagued by strong compulsions to eat, which can literally dominate my thoughts for days on end. These thoughts are intrusive, distressing, unhelpful and have destroyed my confidence and self esteem as they've made me lie to those I love, for one thing (secret eating/starving etc). I once asked my GP for help and was laughed out of the room, told I wasn't underweight so I couldn't get any help. I felt humiliated and ashamed.
Fast forward to July 2014
I kept getting recurrent abscesses, one of which required emergency surgery under GA and I got another one in June. This abscess again resulted in surgery, but 6 weeks later it still hadn't healed and was still constantly re-infecting itself. I saw my GP, who did a finger prick test (8mmol/l after not eating for 12 hours). That started me on a journey down the diabetes investigations (eventually came back prediabetic range).
I went to Occ Health to see if they couldsupport me in asking my manager to allow me to work from home for part of the working day (logistically easier as the abscess was draining a lot and neededa lot of soaking and cleaing etc). I told her I was being investigated for diabetes and broke down in tears telling her I felt so ashamed of the damage I'd done to my own body and went into my odd relationship with food. She referred me for some CBT with an eating disorder specialist. That's the short version of the story.
CBT
I'm currently doing CBT and a self guided eating disorder recovery programe which is managed by the CBT therapist. I could also have got this through my GP but would probably have needed a Psych diagnosis first. I could also have paid for it privately at about £100 a session. However, my employer agreed to pay for 12 sessions as they want me to be well and healthy. I have a fantastic manager and employer who are really supportive ad can't do enough to help; I'm lucky! I'm only 1 week into the programme, and I do have a thread about it in the Mind, Body and Spirit forum here.
However, in the meantime...
I saw the endocrinologist last week ad it became apparent that I probably have PCOS, which isn't helping the weight gain and insulin resistance, so I'm going through investigations fr that now. I also mentioned me relationship with food and asked him what help was available through them. Our hospital has a weight management clinic at the Diabetes Centre, but it's GP referral only, so he's writing to my GP to ask her to refer me. The weight management clinic has dieticians and psychologists. Obviously, I'm interested in the psychological approach. I'm hoping to have a referral in by the time I finish the CBT, because I'd rather have something set up for longer term support. It's a 3-24 month programme, which may result in being referred for bariatric surgery.
My opinion on bariatric surgery
My opinion is written with respect to my own experience, so may differ from yours, but it might give you something to think about.
I believe that unless I address the disordered eating patterns, I am never going to be healthy. I may be in the healthy weight range, but I can only achieve nutritional health if I eat with some kind of balance. I don't believe bariatric surgery will help me because it doesn't actually address the cause of my disordered eating (my thoughts and behaviours).
Also, I feel bariatric surgery is not an easy option. There's risks involved in the surgery itself, long term nutritional risks and it does nothing to address head-hunger. My mum had a gastric band and is constantly vomiting, can't eat salad, but can eat stuff that's unhealthy like chocolate, she doesn't find social functions enjoyale now because she can't eat, her teeth are falling out (probably nutritional status is poor) and being unable to satisfy head hunger makes her miserable. She's a good, healthy weight, but she's far from healthy, mentally or physically.
I know you won't take the decision lightly, but I feel I need to say that you could do with speaking to people who've had this done. Maybe your doctor can put you in touch with somebody, or join some forums or facebook groups and ask them their thoughts. Make sure you speak to people who are a long time post-op, not just in the early "everything is hunky-dorey cos I'm losing weight" phase.
If you'd like to talk to me, you're welcome to message me any time.
Hugs, Lou x
I completely understand what you're going through @Janice2209 as I'm in a similar situation (though not been offered bariatric surgery yet).
My history with food
I've been an over-eater and starver for years and my weight has always gone up or down (mostly up) depending on whether I'm in binge-mode or starve-mode. More recently, I've been in starve mode, because I have a lot of weight to lose after being in binge-mode for so long. Essentially I'm an "all or nothing" eater and rarely have any kind of balance. My thoughts and feelings about food are not normal, I feel guilty for eating anything, I obsess over counting calories and macronutrients, I am plagued by strong compulsions to eat, which can literally dominate my thoughts for days on end. These thoughts are intrusive, distressing, unhelpful and have destroyed my confidence and self esteem as they've made me lie to those I love, for one thing (secret eating/starving etc). I once asked my GP for help and was laughed out of the room, told I wasn't underweight so I couldn't get any help. I felt humiliated and ashamed.
Fast forward to July 2014
I kept getting recurrent abscesses, one of which required emergency surgery under GA and I got another one in June. This abscess again resulted in surgery, but 6 weeks later it still hadn't healed and was still constantly re-infecting itself. I saw my GP, who did a finger prick test (8mmol/l after not eating for 12 hours). That started me on a journey down the diabetes investigations (eventually came back prediabetic range).
I went to Occ Health to see if they couldsupport me in asking my manager to allow me to work from home for part of the working day (logistically easier as the abscess was draining a lot and neededa lot of soaking and cleaing etc). I told her I was being investigated for diabetes and broke down in tears telling her I felt so ashamed of the damage I'd done to my own body and went into my odd relationship with food. She referred me for some CBT with an eating disorder specialist. That's the short version of the story.
CBT
I'm currently doing CBT and a self guided eating disorder recovery programe which is managed by the CBT therapist. I could also have got this through my GP but would probably have needed a Psych diagnosis first. I could also have paid for it privately at about £100 a session. However, my employer agreed to pay for 12 sessions as they want me to be well and healthy. I have a fantastic manager and employer who are really supportive ad can't do enough to help; I'm lucky! I'm only 1 week into the programme, and I do have a thread about it in the Mind, Body and Spirit forum here.
However, in the meantime...
I saw the endocrinologist last week ad it became apparent that I probably have PCOS, which isn't helping the weight gain and insulin resistance, so I'm going through investigations fr that now. I also mentioned me relationship with food and asked him what help was available through them. Our hospital has a weight management clinic at the Diabetes Centre, but it's GP referral only, so he's writing to my GP to ask her to refer me. The weight management clinic has dieticians and psychologists. Obviously, I'm interested in the psychological approach. I'm hoping to have a referral in by the time I finish the CBT, because I'd rather have something set up for longer term support. It's a 3-24 month programme, which may result in being referred for bariatric surgery.
My opinion on bariatric surgery
My opinion is written with respect to my own experience, so may differ from yours, but it might give you something to think about.
I believe that unless I address the disordered eating patterns, I am never going to be healthy. I may be in the healthy weight range, but I can only achieve nutritional health if I eat with some kind of balance. I don't believe bariatric surgery will help me because it doesn't actually address the cause of my disordered eating (my thoughts and behaviours).
Also, I feel bariatric surgery is not an easy option. There's risks involved in the surgery itself, long term nutritional risks and it does nothing to address head-hunger. My mum had a gastric band and is constantly vomiting, can't eat salad, but can eat stuff that's unhealthy like chocolate, she doesn't find social functions enjoyale now because she can't eat, her teeth are falling out (probably nutritional status is poor) and being unable to satisfy head hunger makes her miserable. She's a good, healthy weight, but she's far from healthy, mentally or physically.
I know you won't take the decision lightly, but I feel I need to say that you could do with speaking to people who've had this done. Maybe your doctor can put you in touch with somebody, or join some forums or facebook groups and ask them their thoughts. Make sure you speak to people who are a long time post-op, not just in the early "everything is hunky-dorey cos I'm losing weight" phase.
If you'd like to talk to me, you're welcome to message me any time.
Hugs, Lou x
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Nope, what you say makes good sense. No sort of eating programme will work if the psychological reasons for eating disorder are not dealt with too.
In fact, IMHO, bariatric surgery without sorting the psychological need to misuse food will probably cause more problems than it solves. Which was why I refused to consent to surgery myself.
Loobles
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And it's precisely why I wouldn't consider bariatric surgery until at least having some kind of intensive psychological intervention. No point swapping one problem for another, in my eyes.
