Dare I take metformin?

[pavlosn]

Two questions:
Have you never seen posts where some people, however small a minority complain that they failed to lose weight after going on LCHF.
Is there a suggestion that be lowering carbs and eating more fats one would automatically lose weight even if one actually ends up increasing calorific intake?

Pavlos

 

[jack412]

you're moving your goal posts now..well done

 

[pavlosn]

you're moving your goal posts now..well done

Not at all! I am only clarifying my argument that it is not necessarily true that with LCHF everybody can lose weight without taking their calorific intake in consideration.

 

[jack412]

your right it's not true that 'everyone' will lose weight without counting, I don't think that is the claim and for those that want to count the numbers are there to do so.
what is advised here is they enter their foods into a counter like myfitnesspal for a week. normally they come back with hidden carbs they didn't know about

this does include you @pavlosn ....but does anyone know of an example here, of someone on "no grain/product, potato and starchy veg, fruit and sugary stuff including milk" and normal protein... not losing weight because they ate too much fat?

the vast majority don't need to count and eat till they are satiated. as recommended by most LCHF Dr's and sites
fat fixes hunger

 

[pavlosn]

I think you just described the most extreme form of low carbing effectively no carbing.

Most people do not have to and do not wish to eliminate all the products you have described from their diet; they just limit them enough to get the readings they want from their meters.

I am not arguing against LCHF by the way, just against sweeping generalizations.

My point is that

 

[jack412]

eating to your meter isn't ketogenic LCHF so I guess this is the end of the conversation.

 

[douglas99]

@jack412

so why are you around 30kg over your target weight, on your HF diet?
You're satiated, you obviously don't overeat, why isn't it working?

Just asking, as you keep putting up links showing it does work for everyone?
What's going wrong?

Just asking.

 

[Andy12345]

ive never intensionally counted a calorie in my life, there are exceptions to every rule, but it seems LCHF means you can eat as much as you want for some, so heres hoping, give it a go

 

[douglas99]

Yes, your sig shows about a 20, maybe 25 kg weight loss over 8 months last year, then I guess it levelled off?

Jacks is about down to where you started from, but that's what, 10kg over 9 months?

I certainly need to keep my eye on it, I lost 30kg on my diet, I don't want it back.

 

[Enclave]

Think that we are going off topic here a little as the original question was is it ok to take a prescribed med if its not suitable for someone with heart failure .. as the person has heart failure ..

 

[pavlosn]

ive never intensionally counted a calorie in my life, there are exceptions to every rule, but it seems LCHF means you can eat as much as you want for some, so heres hoping, give it a go

The OP is concerned about having suffered heart failure two years ago. I wonder whether we know enough about such matters to be recommending LCHF or any other diet so unreservedly.

 

[Andy12345]

i ws 19 stone i am now 13, havent worked out my bmi since i last changed my sig, i would say jack is doing extremely well, what are you saying? 10kg weightloss over 9 months isnt very good?

 

[Andy12345]

why would lchf not be a good way of eating with heart failure? i believe it is a good way to eat for everyone, and if taking metformin isnt a good idea with heart failure, wouldnt lchf be a better idea?

to the OP im in no way medically trained, take what im saying with a pinch of salt

 

[Enclave]

The OP is concerned about having suffered heart failure two years ago. I wonder whether we know enough about such matters to be recommending LCHF or any other diet so unreservedly.

I have heart failure and do HCLF, it has worked for me, but everyone is different .. Just cutting out the carbs to 30gm a day and replacing low fat items with high fat ones is not leaving me hungry ..

 

[Andy12345]

The OP is concerned about having suffered heart failure two years ago. I wonder whether we know enough about such matters to be recommending LCHF or any other diet so unreservedly.

i thought the OP is looking for opinions? if as said it says not to take metformin i would say an alternative route maybe reducing the carbs, imo that also means increasing the fat, i dont believe fat is bad for the heart but im not a doctor, i can only go on wht ive read and believe to be the truth

 

[douglas99]

i ws 19 stone i am now 13, havent worked out my bmi since i last changed my sig, i would say jack is doing extremely well, what are you saying? 10kg weightloss over 9 months isnt very good?

Maybe for LCHF it is, I didn't do that, i lost a lot more on my diet.
Horses for courses I guess, if you're happy with it, go for it.

 

[pavlosn]

I have heart failure and do HCLF, it has worked for me, but everyone is different .. Just cutting out the carbs to 30gm a day and replacing low fat items with high fat ones is not leaving me hungry ..

I fully respect that you are speaking on the basis of your personal experience, which I am sorry to hear includes suffering heart failure. I am glad and reassured that you have found LCHF to be an appropriate diet in these circumstances as well.

I hope you appreciate that my original comment was simply a concern that a newly diagnosed would get the impression that LCHF is a free ticket to overindulge, which it is not.

I still feel that at times we are too quick to give advice to people here, particularly as regards LCHF, which fails to recognize that the person may have other medical conditions besides diabetes, on which most of us are not experts.

 

[Phub]

Hi Pavlosn.

If it's a rule, it will apply to everyone. Calories either count, or they don't.

All this nonsense we hear about energy in must equal energy expended (aka The First Law of Thermodynamics') is supposed to apply to us. But it doesn't. It only applies in a closed system, and the human body and metabolism don't constitute a closed system. The theory also falls over because we consume energy even as we sleep. It's here that we probably differ most, and some of us will use more stationary energy than others.

When we start exercising to increase energy usage, is when we create the demand for more fuel. If we take in the right kind of fuel, no problems. But if we stuff ourselves with stodgy starchy foods 'for energy', we are immediately in trouble. Then we have to run even more, because we don't burn rubbish so well as we do our proper food.

All running every day did for me was improve my circulation, and stamina, whilst also making me feel hungry. Not knowing any better in those days, I ate lots of bread and pasta as a fill up, in the mistaken belief wheat was a natural product, and thereby healthy. I think we all know better now.

Wheat might be natural, insofar as it's a growing plant, but bread is a processed food, no better than any other form of junk.

Phub (John)

 

[Andy12345]

Maybe for LCHF it is, I didn't do that, i lost a lot more on my diet.
Horses for courses I guess, if you're happy with it, go for it.[/QUOTE

i dont understand restricting or experiences, i would say we help more than we hurt, if we cannot share experience whats the point of saying anything? i havent read it in years but im pretty sure theres something when you come to the sight that states this is only our personal experiences, Phub certainly dosent sound like he will have trouble distinguishing between the wheat and the chaff

 

[Andy12345]

oops sorry i wasnt replying to you douglas with that post, i was going to then changed my mind and meant to respond to Pav