Dear Girl Guides, All our daughter wants for Christmas, is to be included

[phoenix]

Actually,I agree with much of what you have said Brunneria. As I said at the beginning it would have been scary for me prior to having had T1. (still would be because it's a big responsibility looking after any child and probably the technology of the pump and the libre makes it sound even more complicated; not so long ago T1 children just had 2 injections a day and far less testing.)

If what we are told is true though ,it does seem that at the very least there has been some degree of procrastination and what sounds like deceit (or a big misunderstanding)
There are though ways of getting round the problem rather than exclusion. with parents popping in, at the end of a phone or even kipping down in the church office !
I would have thought that a risk assessment was necessary for this event in any case. (it would have been 10 years ago and I doubt things have changed)

 

[Brunneria]

Yes.

The whole thing is a real mess, isn't it?

Poor kid, caught in the middle, too.

 

[Robinredbreast]

Is it fair for anyone to be excluded from activities they want to do, because of a health condition or disability?

Nope.

Is it fair that this situation has been handled so badly by the Girl Guide organisation, on both a local and national level?

Nope

But... Before we hang, draw and quarter the individual volunteers who made the local decisions, please remember two things:

The Girl Guides is a charity staffed by volunteers. They give up their free time to herd small excitable children through fun and educational activities. They don't necessarily volunteer to take responsibility to monitor the health of type 1 diabetic children. Nor should they have to. They are volunteers.
Since the Girl Guides is a charity, maintained by donations, it is very unlikely they have the local facilities, rapid risk assessment capacity and so on to cope with this without a great deal of adjustment and planning. The prep, training and cost may have been considered to exceed reasonable adjustment.

We don't know what training (or lack of) has been offered to the local volunteers, or whether they have refused it because it went beyond what they felt able to offer.

My view is that, as a type 2 diabetic I know just enough about type 1 diabetes to be deeply intimidated by the prospect of taking responsibility for a small child, without her parents within earshot, who may need urgent medical attention. As a non-expert I find this scary. Doesn't matter if it is justified or not. It is scary, and I probably wouldn't volunteer to get more training to overcome my fear. Because it's scary.

How many parents of type 1s do we get arriving on this forum, scared out of their wits? They have had help and training from doctors, nurses, consultants, diabetic clinics, they've had training in hypos, hypers, injections, 24 hr telephone numbers, and they've been living with the child for months or years, yet still arrive at this forum terrified, stressed and tearing their hair out.

The only thing we can be sure of about this entire situation is that we only have one side of the story.

Hi, firstly the Guide leaders are not just 'volunteers' they are in the Guide Association and throughout the school terms and during activity breaks away. These leaders are commintted members. At our guide pack, we have a mother leader and her daughter. The leader in charge is trained in many things regarding the wellbeing and safety of children in their care. A medical form must be filled in and signed, with at least two contact numbers for the parent/guardian.
They have to have a first aider, also we, as parents are given a separate number to phone (the leaders mobile number is already known) or if we need to phone, it's a number of another associated guide member. Every possible safe guard is put into place for the girls, whatever their age, to have an active, stimulating, and a safe night away from home.

My teenagers leader is good fun, but strict, and her word goes. So , I believe, the girl could of gone and had a fantastic fun night.
Different parts of the country will have slightly different variations. My daughter srarted in the Rainbows, the Brownies and now a Guide and I hope she will continue.

RRB

 

[Brunneria]

Hi, firstly the Guide leaders are not just 'volunteers' they are in the Guide Association and throughout the school terms and during activity breaks away. These leaders are commintted members. At our guide pack, we have a mother leader and her daughter. The leader in charge is trained in many things regarding the wellbeing and safety of children in their care. A medical form must be filled in and signed, with at least two contact numbers for the parent/guardian.
They have to have a first aider, also we, as parents are given a separate number to phone (the leaders mobile number is already known) or if we need to phone, it's a number of another associated guide member. Every possible safe guard is put into place for the girls, whatever their age, to have an active, stimulating, and a safe night away from home.

My teenagers leader is good fun, but strict, and her word goes. So , I believe, the girl could of gone and had a fantastic fun night.
Different parts of the country will have slightly different variations. My daughter srarted in the Rainbows, the Brownies and now a Guide and I hope she will continue.

RRB

All very laudable. Really.
But not enough for me to feel confident taking on that level of responsibility.

 

[Robinredbreast]

There are ways around it, no reason that I can see of why, a child should be excluded. It's not etched in stone, so parents could of popped in or even stayed in another part of the hall, SOMETHING . The leaders work as a team, it's not just one staying there and dealing with everything. There is usually a way.
Poor girl, I do feel for her.

RRB

Added anothe sentence

 

[Snowy12]

I was not sure how to reply to this as it did upset me.
My son is in the royal marine cadets and we have to fill out forms on every trip,outing even yesterday he was packing bags at our local supermarket he needed to have all signed documents for emergency purposes.
I feel for the family as the organisers new her condition I hope they did not do it to be malicious maybe just scared.
I do hope the girl in question carries on with her activities and maybe the older leaders could get involved with looking into diabetics instead of running away from it.

 

[Robinredbreast]

I was not sure how to reply to this as it did upset me.
My son is in the royal marine cadets and we have to fill out forms on every trip,outing even yesterday he was packing bags at our local supermarket he needed to have all signed documents for emergency purposes.
I feel for the family as the organisers new her condition I hope they did not do it to be malicious maybe just scared.
I do hope the girl in question carries on with her activities and maybe the older leaders could get involved with looking into diabetics instead of running away from it.

View attachment 9975

My teenagers friend, was diagnosed Type 1 this year and she is in the Sea Cadets. She goes way for weekends and she does everything the others do, with no exceptions ( obviously older than a rainbow)
I agree with you Snowy, quite upsetting and an unsettling article too. I do hope something positive comes from all of this.

Best wishes RRB

 

[Snowy12]

My teenagers friend, was diagnosed Type 1 this year and she is in the Sea Cadets. She goes way for weekends and she does everything the others do, with no exceptions ( obviously older than a rainbow)
I agree with you Snowy, quite upsetting and an unsettling article too. I do hope something positive comes from all of this.

Best wishes RRB

Heartbreaking really mainly to think that a child wants to lead a normal life she obviously feels confident within herself,I don't want to bash anyway over it but it could be turned around as a positive outcome,she could do a talk about it let others ask her questions and maybe this will put everyone's minds at rest,surely the leaders have all undergone a first aid course.

 

[Robinredbreast]

Heartbreaking really mainly to think that a child wants to lead a normal life she obviously feels confident within herself,I don't want to bash anyway over it but it could be turned around as a positive outcome,she could do a talk about it let others ask her questions and maybe this will put everyone's minds at rest,surely the leaders have all undergone a first aid course.

Yes they have to have a first aider snowy It could be anything from a cut finger to being admitted into hospital It's a huge commitment to be a Guide leader and they are very dedicated and work hard too.

RRB

 

[Lenny3]

I think the bit that really annoyed me was the underhandness of telling them that the meeting was most definately cancelled. IF they had sat down with the parents and explained that it just wasn't possible/gonna happen for whatever reasons, that would have been so much better(not great) than lying to them.

 

[Brunneria]

I think the bit that really annoyed me was the underhandness of telling them that the meeting was most definately cancelled. IF they had sat down with the parents and explained that it just wasn't possible/gonna happen for whatever reasons, that would have been so much better(not great) than lying to them.

Absolutely.

 

[Robinredbreast]

Actually,I agree with much of what you have said Brunneria. As I said at the beginning it would have been scary for me prior to having had T1. (still would be because it's a big responsibility looking after any child and probably the technology of the pump and the libre makes it sound even more complicated; not so long ago T1 children just had 2 injections a day and far less testing.)

If what we are told is true though ,it does seem that at the very least there has been some degree of procrastination and what sounds like deceit (or a big misunderstanding)
There are though ways of getting round the problem rather than exclusion. with parents popping in, at the end of a phone or even kipping down in the church office !
I would have thought that a risk assessment was necessary for this event in any case. (it would have been 10 years ago and I doubt things have changed)

Hi Phoenix, are there any updates ?
Best wishes RRB

 

[Snowy12]

Yes they have to have a first aider snowy It could be anything from a cut finger to being admitted into hospital It's a huge commitment to be a Guide leader and they are very dedicated and work hard too.

RRB

I thought that they had to I know in the cadets they have,all the Sargent's are all ex marines and very strict.
Not had any dealings with guides ect,my daughter was more ballet and tap but then they still need to follow protocol.
@Lenny3 that was the bit I also didn't like,surely they knew they would get found out about it,I understand we all make mistakes but this is one that will not be forgotten anytime soon.

 

[Robinredbreast]

I thought that they had to I know in the cadets they have,all the Sargent's are all ex marines and very strict.
Not had any dealings with guides ect,my daughter was more ballet and tap but then they still need to follow protocol.
@Lenny3 that was the bit I also didn't like,surely they knew they would get found out about it,I understand we all make mistakes but this is one that will not be forgotten anytime soon.

If it is all to be believed, then it is very underhand, sly and deceitful and not at all fitting for the Guide movement

RRB

 

[Snowy12]

If it is all to be believed, then it is very underhand, sly and deceitful and not at all fitting for the Guide movement

RRB

True it could all just be here say,and a lot of Chinese whispers.

 

[Robinredbreast]

True it could all just be here say,and a lot of Chinese whispers.

I do believe it, but sometimes things get said out of context or someone else embelishes on the truth a little, you know how these things happen, human nature.
However, I do hope the little girl has a truly magical and a wonderful Christmas

RRB

 

[Pipp]

I thought that they had to I know in the cadets they have,all the Sargent's are all ex marines and very strict.
Not had any dealings with guides ect,my daughter was more ballet and tap but then they still need to follow protocol.
@Lenny3 that was the bit I also didn't like,surely they knew they would get found out about it,I understand we all make mistakes but this is one that will not be forgotten anytime soon.

It was the underhanded deceit that I found so disturbing. What sort of message is that giving to the little girls in the group. It is ok to tell lies? That is why if my daughter had been in that group she would have been out of there, fast.

It is not just the excluded child affected by this sad situation, but all the other little girls who are learning that anyone with an impairment is too much of a burden, and can be excluded.

Admittedly, we do not have the full story, and people give their time freely to the Guides Association, but someone within that organisation should be making sure their group leaders are trained to deal with such a situation. No reason why one of the parents or other nominated person could not have been on hand to provide the care needed. There wee all sorts of ways this little girl could have been included and seen to be a valued member of the group.

 

[Snowy12]

I agree about the deceit as that was the part I do not like but I would not of pulled my child out,why should I especially if she has made new friends she may like going,It is easy to run away from situations but she needs to along with her family stand up and be counted think it is just ignorance on the leaders part,the whole situation seems to be turning into a witch hunt and not a pleasant one at that.

 

[loulou99782]

This is crazy. I am a Girl's Brigade leader and am registered disabled. We have got 6 - 8 girls and 3 leaders in our company who have health problems e.g 6yr old with major heart problems servely asthmatic leader people on special diets and a child in a wheelchair. We have all parents contact details spare asthma meds and care plan copies. We also have lists of allergies and GP contact details on permission slips for weekly meetings.
All activities are risked assessed and parents are asked about any health problems and what we need to do if their child becomes ill.

Mum have a look at girls.org.uk the Girl's Brigade website and look at the company finder. There may be a company near you. Our girls aged 5 - 8 are called explorers.
GB is also a charity ran by volunteers and is Christian based. We have lots of fun and do our best to make sure ALL children are included in ALL activities events and trips out.

Hope little one has a lovely happy and INCLUDED Christmas and that Father Christmas brings her lots of lovely surprises

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

 

[Robinredbreast]

This is crazy. I am a Girl's Brigade leader and am registered disabled. We have got 6 - 8 girls and 3 leaders in our company who have health problems e.g 6yr old with major heart problems servely asthmatic leader people on special diets and a child in a wheelchair. We have all parents contact details spare asthma meds and care plan copies. We also have lists of allergies and GP contact details on permission slips for weekly meetings.
All activities are risked assessed and parents are asked about any health problems and what we need to do if their child becomes ill.

Mum have a look at girls.org.uk the Girl's Brigade website and look at the company finder. There may be a company near you. Our girls aged 5 - 8 are called explorers.
GB is also a charity ran by volunteers and is Christian based. We have lots of fun and do our best to make sure ALL children are included in ALL activities events and trips out.


Hope little one has a lovely happy and INCLUDED Christmas and that Father Christmas brings her lots of lovely surprises

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

Hello, it's reassuring to hear from a Guide Brigade leader. What you have said says it all, absolutely correct

Merry Christmas RRB