Confused - diagnosed 'pre-diabetic'

[chrispepper]

Hi - recently I visited my doctors surgery after feeling quite run down. Blood tests were conducted and I was diagnosed 'pre-diabetic'. I was confused by this and kind of decided it must be a mistake. I am not over weight, although recently my weight has dropped. I am 13st 7lbs and 6ft 1in. I rarely eat junk or fatty food. I don't drink sugary beverages and have never enjoyed large quantities of sweet or processed food. although I do not belong to a gym, I go for a stiff walk almost religiously - day in day out. I live in Sheffield, so the steep hills cause me to get out of breath when I walk. I do drink - 3 pints of beer and about 1.5 bottles of wine per week. Too much? Never been a smoker.
I have changed my diet and drastically reduced the amount of bread i eat. Switched to salads with Quorn during the day. Despite all this, my blood sugar level registered '6' when I woke up this morning. Sunday afternoon, it was 5.6. How can it have gone up over night?

Where am I going wrong? Any advice is greatly appreciated. BTW - I am 52 with 3 kids. Would like to get this sorted for their sake!

 

[PhilT]

It goes up because your liver produces / releases glucose into your blood stream to keep you going - there can be a "dump" in the morning on waking called the "dawn effect".

You don't have to be overweight to become diabetic, insulin resistance occurs in thin people too.

 

[chrispepper]

It goes up because your liver produces / releases glucose into your blood stream to keep you going - there can be a "dump" in the morning on waking called the "dawn effect".

You don't have to be overweight to become diabetic, insulin resistance occurs in thin people too.

Ok - thanks for this. I suppose the point of my question is - what can I do? I understood type 2 diabetes is usually related to obesity, which is why I quoted my weight. As I say, I'm currently sticking to salads during the day. I find some Quorn helps me feel less hungry, as do a few handfuls of unsalted nuts. Does this sound like a good diet?

Also, am I over doing it on the alcohol front? It would be a pity to stop drinking altogether, but I suppose if it's necessary, then I'll have to bite the bullet:-(

At the moment, it kind of feels like I've got no control over what is happening. Is that just something I'll have to live with?

 

[Bluetit1802]

Hi and welcome,

You are lucky, you have been caught before full blown diabetes develops, so you have every chance of keeping it at bay. Your diet doesn't sound too bad to me. It isn't just sugary stuff that raises blood sugar levels. Carbs do this. (sugar is just another carb). You need to be sensible with all major carbs such as bread, potatoes, cereals, pasta, rice, pastry and anything made with flour. Fruit and milk are also full of sugar, so care needs to be taken there, too.

It sounds like you have your own meter, which is good. What you can do is test out some of your normal meals. Test immediately before you eat, then again 2 hours after your first bite. See what the rise is. It shouldn't go above 2 mmol/l, ideally under 1.5mmol/l but that isn't always easy. If it goes beyond this, there is something in that meal causing it that needs attention next time. You can reduce the carb portion and try testing again another time. By testing this way you can work out what your body can or can't cope with. Everyone has different tolerance levels to different foods.

Have a good read round the forum and ask as many questions as you like.

By the way, no need to stop drinking, but try to stick to red wine or dry white if you can. Beer isn't a good choice for most people. Spirits are also OK if taken neat or with sugar free mixers.

 

[PhilT]

Perhaps you're a "TOFI" - thin outside, fat inside. Visceral fat around your organs (usually with a bit of a belly) might be part of the story.

What to do ? Well keep walking, for sure, and maybe do more. An exercised muscle consumes glucose. A walk before breakfast may help soak up the dawn phenomenon.

Diet is "controversial" ie not everyone agrees. Personally I see carbohydrate restriction as beneficial, as it's the carbohydrate you eat that becomes blood glucose in the main. So your nuts as a snack are good. Dunno why you chose Quorn, perhaps a vegetarian ? If you eat eggs and cheese they have no carbohydrate, so a cheese omelette is a glucose-friendly option.

Try testing your blood sugar 30,60 and 90 mins after a meal to learn about the effect of your meals on you.

The increased risk of heart disease in diabetes is in my opinion down to the effect of elevated blood sugars, so I think it is more important to reduce blood sugar levels than worry about alleged heart risk effects of a higher fat / lower carbohydrate diet.

 

[chrispepper]

Thanks for the advice. I have to say, I'm disappointed my efforts to reduce my sugar levels havn't been more successful. I was aware that carbs push up your levels, which is why I cut down on bread. Only bread I now eat is Rye, which I believe is better for you due to the fibre content. I've not even had much of that. We switched to brown rice and pasta, but its difficult to completely cut it out, as alternative staples seem hard to find.

Thing is, if my sugar levels become raised when I fast, I don't see how I can control this. It's starting to feel like all food is unhealthy and should be avoided!! Somehow don't think that's an option!

 

[phil1966]

Welcome to the forum! My liver stopped dumping on me after about 3 months and it was the last thing I got under control (and for some people it never really does).

As with all things, patience is the key and you need to count the victories in the little steps which will take you eventually to where you want to be

 

[chrispepper]

So what might be causing my liver to increase sugar levels? My doctor ran a series of blood tests, including checking liver function. I was told it was fine.

the irony is, at the moment I'm feeling quite a bit better than previously. Eating sandwiches during the day led to me feeling a lot of troughs in my energy levels. At the moment, this has more or less completely disappeared. Could it be I've already addressed the problem and this is just taking time to feed through my system?

 

[Clivethedrive]

Ok - thanks for this. I suppose the point of my question is - what can I do? I understood type 2 diabetes is usually related to obesity, which is why I quoted my weight. As I say, I'm currently sticking to salads during the day. I find some Quorn helps me feel less hungry, as do a few handfuls of unsalted nuts. Does this sound like a good diet?

Also, am I over doing it on the alcohol front? It would be a pity to stop drinking altogether, but I suppose if it's necessary, then I'll have to bite the bullet:-(

At the moment, it kind of feels like I've got no control over what is happening. Is that just something I'll have to live with?

Hi chrispepper, contrary to popular opinion diabetes can occur , Genetically, or through stress or illness, or even shock.have a read of the info from @daisy1 .

 

[Roytaylorjasonfunglover]

Hi - recently I visited my doctors surgery after feeling quite run down. Blood tests were conducted and I was diagnosed 'pre-diabetic'. I was confused by this and kind of decided it must be a mistake. I am not over weight, although recently my weight has dropped. I am 13st 7lbs and 6ft 1in. I rarely eat junk or fatty food. I don't drink sugary beverages and have never enjoyed large quantities of sweet or processed food. although I do not belong to a gym, I go for a stiff walk almost religiously - day in day out. I live in Sheffield, so the steep hills cause me to get out of breath when I walk. I do drink - 3 pints of beer and about 1.5 bottles of wine per week. Too much? Never been a smoker.
I have changed my diet and drastically reduced the amount of bread i eat. Switched to salads with Quorn during the day. Despite all this, my blood sugar level registered '6' when I woke up this morning. Sunday afternoon, it was 5.6. How can it have gone up over night?

Where am I going wrong? Any advice is greatly appreciated. BTW - I am 52 with 3 kids. Would like to get this sorted for their sake!

Somebody already mentioned the TOFI situation, and this could be relevant in this case. Type-2 diabetes does have very much to do with genes, and people get prediabetic or diabetic,at very individuals levels of weight. Just look at the remarkable examples mentioned in this wikipedia article about the subject. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOFI . You can have too persons of the same gender,age,bmi and bodyfat, but one will have 5.86 litres of internal visceral fat, the other will have 1.65 litre. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOFI#/media/File:Coronal_Image_of_a_TOFI_and_a_Normal_Control.jpg Here is a picture of 8 people with the same waist circumference, the one with least internal bodyfat,have 0.5 litre, the one with the most. 4.5 llitre. A 4 kg difference in fat, with the same waistline! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOFI#/..._in_men_with_the_same_waist_circumference.jpg

Here is an artice about the issue, together with a picture of two proffesors, they both have a bmi, of 22.3, the one on the left, of european background, has a bodyfatpercentage of 9.1 the one the right, of asian background has a bodyfat of 21.2 percent. Quite a staggering difference.

I also have two female relatives, both is morbidely obese, one is metabolically healthy, perfect sugars and cholesterol, the other a fullblown diabetic. But I also know somebody with a bmi far lower than yours with diabetes. For a example of somebody thin getting rid of their diabetes by losing weight, read this, a guardian journalist lost 10 kgs and it went away.

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/may/12/type-2-diabetes-diet-cure
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...etes-just-11-days--going-starvation-diet.html

His personal website, he is still cured, 2 half years later.
http://www.reversingtype2diabetes.com/

Bottomline is this, lose some weight. Bmi is notoriously inaccurate as we have seen by now, best bet is to get your waist as slim as possible .

The hard part is weightloss. Here are some links you shold follow. dr Stephan Guyenet is a Phd in neurobiology, and studies how obesity works on the brain. He has a blog packed full with information on weightloss. It covers a lot of others things about food and health as well, but if you read through everything, you will know everything there is to know about obesity. http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.no/

Here is an article he has written about how to lose weight most effectively. It has detailed references is very short, but read this and you will know more than most gps about weightloss. The key takeaway here is that weight is controlled by the brain, in both directions, and that dietquality determines if this system goes haywire and obesity occurs.

https://www.dansplan.com/assets/Ideal_Weight_Program_Scientific_Rational.pdf

Also search up Jason Fung, he is a canadian doctor who uses fasting to treat diabetes type 2(in other words, get people to lose weight sustainably)http://intensivedietarymanagement.com/.

Good luck, the risk of diabetes is determined by genes, but if you have a low personal fat threshold, you just have to work a little bit harder, goodluck!

 

[Bluetit1802]

So what might be causing my liver to increase sugar levels? My doctor ran a series of blood tests, including checking liver function. I was told it was fine.

the irony is, at the moment I'm feeling quite a bit better than previously. Eating sandwiches during the day led to me feeling a lot of troughs in my energy levels. At the moment, this has more or less completely disappeared. Could it be I've already addressed the problem and this is just taking time to feed through my system?

There is nothing wrong with your liver. It is totally normal and natural for the liver to dump glucose in the blood stream in certain circumstances. It happens to everyone, not just diabetics. It is nature's way of helping us get through difficult situations such as fasting, exercising, fear, stress, illness etc. You can't do a great deal about it, and why should you - your liver is being good to you.

Meanwhile, keep a food diary and measure your levels before and after eating as mentioned before. Patterns will emerge from which you can learn.

 

[chrispepper]

Thanks for all the time and effort everyone has put into their replies. I appreciate the responses and the advice you have given.

I think common sense is my usual guiding principle and its probably best applied here. Monitoring before and after meals sounds good so we will give that a try. I will loose a bit of weight, but I have to say, I'd be reluctant to loose much. I kind of feel OK about my weight/height ratio. There was no suggestion I was over weight from my GP. Waste size is about 35-36 inches, so probably a bit more than it should be.

One question I would like to ask - what should I substitute for things like bread, rice and pasta. I feel like I need something to 'bulk' out my meals a bit to stave off being continually hungry. I don't want to follow some kind of 'paleo' diet route. I'm dubious about the benefits of 'fashionable' regimes.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Have you seen this thread? Have a read. http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/a-new-low-carb-guide-for-beginners.68695/

 

[CraigDT]

Before meals blood sugar should be below 6.8, after meals rising to max 7.8 for non diabetics. You are doing fine if you are getting 5's and 6's. Check 2 hours after food to see if you are getting a spike after you eat. My sugars regularly go up overnight, that is common.

 

[chrispepper]

Before meals blood sugar should be below 6.8, after meals rising to max 7.8 for non diabetics. You are doing fine if you are getting 5's and 6's. Check 2 hours after food to see if you are getting a spike after you eat. My sugars regularly go up overnight, that is common.

Thanks - that's reassuring I will definitely continue to monitor things. We have a 'Contour' blood sugar monitor. The test strips for this were very expensive in Boots - a pack was nearly 30 pounds!! What sort do you guys use? Any recommendations?

Anyhow, as a result of my diet it seems my weight is still coming down, which is good - I suppose.

 

[john stevenston]

Thanks - that's reassuring I will definitely continue to monitor things. We have a 'Contour' blood sugar monitor. The test strips for this were very expensive in Boots - a pack was nearly 30 pounds!! What sort do you guys use? Any recommendations?

Anyhow, as a result of my diet it seems my weight is still coming down, which is good - I suppose.

hi Chris,I'm in the same situation as you and it's completely baffling me..what to eat? when to eat? how much exercise? and on and on.
i was told my blood tests were borderline then high and the Doctor has given me three months to diet and try and bring down my levels before testing me again and then deciding on future actions.
I'm just waiting to get a meter to track my blood sugar levels.

I'm nearly 50 and overweight and my diet was awful so unlike you i can understand why i might have diabetes.
hopefully like you it's a warning and we can stop it developing further.
it seems a complicated illness to get under control but i'm sure after a while you find out what's good and bad for you and this forum seems full of helpful people....i wish you all the best...John.

 

[Jo123]

Hi, I was like you in that my BMI was normal and I was diagnosed pre diabetic. I decided to low carb, which I did extremely strictly and my BG levels slowly went to normal. I bought a meter as you have very sensibly done and tested what sent my BG up, you will be surprised at some of the results.

A few years later my BMI is 19.1 rather than at the upper end of normal and my last HBA1C was 32 which is excellent. If I test myself now things which woudl have sent my BG too high don't, however I don't push things as I value my health rather than being able to eat what I like. I consider myself very lucky, now, that I was diagnosed when I was so I had a chance to turn things round. By the way I do drink red wine, it doesn't raise my BG at all, thank goodness!

If ever I am tempted off the straight and narrow I think of something I heard on the radio when a doctor was discussing diabetes, he basically said that if your BG was too high it was like having shards of glass in your bloodstream damaging your blood vessels, which is what leads to heart disease, may be inaccurate or simplistic but it works for me!!

 

[chrispepper]

Thanks for this. I've continued to monitor myself - probably need to be more thorough about when I test, but my results seem to be hovering around the 6 mark. I continue to record around 6.1 first thing in a morning. Last week, my post meal test (2 hours after eating) was 6.6. Before meals, it drops to around 5.6. Interestingly, last night I had a meal mainly consisting of veg and fish. Also went for a walk afterwards, then 2 hours after my meal my sugar level recorded as 5.9. What do these results sound like? Are they good or bad?

 

[Jo123]

Hi chris, sorry missed your reply, those results look fine to me. It took ages for my fasting bg to come down. I am on my tablet at the moment later on my pc I will link you something that I found on this website years ago which gave me figures to aim for. As a pre diabetic I aimed for bg levels of a 'normal' person!!

 

[jadeng]

I have recently been told by my doc that I am pre diabetic recording at 6 after fasting the last 12 hours. I have since read online that BITTER MELLON can help manage glucouse level. Do research this powerful vegetable online. You can find bitter mellon tea in Asian grocery stores. I have read that people see a significant difference in their readings after drinking a cup of this tea. Bitter mellon has a long list of health benefits. I am waiting for my measuring device to arrive so I can start measuring.