Prediabetes Burning mouth syndrome

Lilliepop

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Hello. I am suffering very bad with BMS it seems to be getting worst there isn't any end to it very depressing, it starting to burn my chest and nose. Dr doesent know what it is but could be related to glucose levels. Has anyone else had this problem and if so what did they take or do?
Some people have it for years the thought of that fills me with dread. The only thing that helps it a bit is chewing gum. The only problem there is I have to chew the one with sugar in as the sugar free upsets my stomach. So it's catch 22 really. Can anyone help?
 
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Hello. I am suffering very bad with BMS it seems to be getting worst there isn't any end to it very depressing, it starting to burn my chest and nose. Dr doesent know what it is but could be related to glucose levels. Has anyone else had this problem and if so what did they take or do?
Some people have it for years the thought of that fills me with dread. The only thing that helps it a bit is chewing gum. The only problem there is I have to chew the one with sugar in as the sugar free upsets my stomach. So it's catch 22 really. Can anyone help?

Hi Lilliepop, I don't have burning mouth syndrome, but I have Oral Lichen Planus inside my mouth and tongue, on the left side. I have bought a mouth wash that numbs the pain, as it is like razor blades inside sometimes. The mouthwash is not cheap, It is called Difflam Oral Rinse, for relief of pain and inflammation inside the throat and mouth. Or ask a pharmacist to recommend something suitable for you. Good luck,

RRB
 

CarbsRok

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Hello. I am suffering very bad with BMS it seems to be getting worst there isn't any end to it very depressing, it starting to burn my chest and nose. Dr doesent know what it is but could be related to glucose levels. Has anyone else had this problem and if so what did they take or do?
Some people have it for years the thought of that fills me with dread. The only thing that helps it a bit is chewing gum. The only problem there is I have to chew the one with sugar in as the sugar free upsets my stomach. So it's catch 22 really. Can anyone help?
I can't help with any solution but could you ask your GP for a referral to an ENT clinic?
 

Winnie53

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Lilliepop, yikes.

I did a quick search on "burning mouth syndrome supplements". You can do the same.

Came across a report of studies (in which a dosage of 200 mg alpha lipoic acid is taken 3 times a day)...

https://www.lexi.com/individuals/dentistry/newsletters.jsp?id=june_08

And this self-report - ( http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-suppl...ID.aspx?drugid=767&drugname=ALPHA-LIPOIC+ACID )...

Reason for taking: Burning mouth syndrome
10/17/2014 10:57:21 AM

Reviewer: Gayle, 45-54 Female on Treatment for 1 to less than 2 years (Consumer)

Effectiveness:
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Ease of Use:
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Satisfaction
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Comment:
I started taking Alpha Lipoic Acid for Burning Mouth Syndrome. At first I took 200mg 3x day for two months. Within a few days I had significant relief. I dropped down to 200mg 1x day and have been taking that amount for about 1 1/2 yrs now. Aside from a few flare-ups, I'd say my burning mouth syndrome is 95% + under control. I did try to stop taking it once, but the condition came back - then left as soon as I resumed taking this supplement.

I can only add that alpha lipoic acid is recommended everywhere I looked for peripheral neuropathy supplement strategies. Many of the B vitamins also - (I believe 5 of the 8 B vitamins were listed in one book, so a B complex might be helpful too).
 
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Lilliepop

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267
Lilliepop, yikes.

I did a quick search on "burning mouth syndrome supplements". You can do the same.

Came across a report of studies (in which a dosage of 200 mg alpha lipoic acid is taken 3 times a day)...

https://www.lexi.com/individuals/dentistry/newsletters.jsp?id=june_08

And this self-report - ( http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-suppl...ID.aspx?drugid=767&drugname=ALPHA-LIPOIC+ACID )...

Reason for taking: Burning mouth syndrome
10/17/2014 10:57:21 AM

Reviewer: Gayle, 45-54 Female on Treatment for 1 to less than 2 years (Consumer)

Effectiveness:
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Ease of Use:
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Satisfaction
Current Rating: 5 [of 5 stars]

Comment:
I started taking Alpha Lipoic Acid for Burning Mouth Syndrome. At first I took 200mg 3x day for two months. Within a few days I had significant relief. I dropped down to 200mg 1x day and have been taking that amount for about 1 1/2 yrs now. Aside from a few flare-ups, I'd say my burning mouth syndrome is 95% + under control. I did try to stop taking it once, but the condition came back - then left as soon as I resumed taking this supplement.

I can only add that alpha lipoic acid is recommended everywhere I looked for peripheral neuropathy supplement strategies. Many of the B vitamins also - (I believe 5 of the 8 B vitamins were listed in one book, so a B complex might be helpful too).
Well I have ordered some today had to phone my renal doctor to make sure it's okay for me to take them as I'm on immunsurpresents had transplant.She said she has looked into it and to try it. I think I have ordered a stronger one 300mg hope it isn't to high now. I will let you know how it goes in a few weeks.
My Dr has never heard of it. Isn't it the pits does yours get worst in the evening? Also mine gets bad with chemical smells like when I clean the house, Sudan crem I have to put on my dog, or all of sudden I will get a strong chemical smell in my head and it goes mad. Also think it's linked to hormones,.
 
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Winnie53

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@Lilliepop while searching for a book, I found at the bottom of one of my stacks, The Encyclopedia of Natural Medicine, 3rd Edition (2012). It's huge, 1,219 pages! I hadn't looked at it since last year so was curious as to what it had to say about diabetes.

Here's the second paragraph of what the naturopathic physicians wrote about alpha-lipoic acid (ALA)...

"Alpha-lipoic acid is an approved drug in Germany for the treatment of diabetic neuropathy and has been successfully used there for more than 30 years. The beneficial effects of alpha-lipoic acid in diabetic neuropathy have been confirmed in several double-blind studies at a dosage of 400 to 600 mg per day. (174,175) Although the primary effect of alpha-lipoic acid in improving diabetic neuropathy is thought to be the result of its antioxidant effects, it has also been shown to lead to an improvement in blood glucose metabolism, improve blood flow to peripheral nerves, and actually stimulate the regeneration of nerve fibers. Its importance in treating diabetic neuropathy cannot be overstated." (pp.539)

174. Reljanovic M, Reichel G, Rett K, et al. Treatment of diabetic polyneuropathy with the antioxidant thioctic acid (alpha-lipoic acid): a two year multi-center randomized double-blind placeb-controlled trial (ALA-DIN II). Alpha Lipoic Acid in Diabetic Neuropathy. Free Radical Research 1999;31:171-179.

175. Jacob S, Ruus P, Hermann R, et al. Oral administration of RAC-alpha-lipoic acid modulates insulin sensitivity in patients with type-2 diabetes mellitus; a placebo-controlled pilot trial. Free Radical Biology & Medicine 1999;27:309-314.

And here's the first paragraph...

"Alpha-lipoic Acid. Alpha-lipoic acid is a vitamin-like substance that is often described as "nature's perfect antioxidant". First of all, alpha-lipoic acid is a small molecule that is efficiently absorbed and easily crosses cell membranes. Unlike vitamin E, which is primarily fat soluble, and vitamin C, which is water soluable, alpha-lipoic acid can quench either water- or fat-soluable free radicals both inside the cell and outside in the intracellular spaces. Furthermore, alpha-lipoic acid extends the biochemical life of vitamin C and E, as well as other antioxidants such as glutathione, the most important intracellular antioxidant." (pp 539)

I hope you'll come back to let us know if it's helpful. :)
 

Lilliepop

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Messages
267
@Lilliepop while searching for a book, I found at the bottom of one of my stacks, The Encyclopedia of Natural Medicine, 3rd Edition (2012). It's huge, 1,219 pages! I hadn't looked at it since last year so was curious as to what it had to say about diabetes.

Here's the second paragraph of what the naturopathic physicians wrote about alpha-lipoic acid (ALA)...

"Alpha-lipoic acid is an approved drug in Germany for the treatment of diabetic neuropathy and has been successfully used there for more than 30 years. The beneficial effects of alpha-lipoic acid in diabetic neuropathy have been confirmed in several double-blind studies at a dosage of 400 to 600 mg per day. (174,175) Although the primary effect of alpha-lipoic acid in improving diabetic neuropathy is thought to be the result of its antioxidant effects, it has also been shown to lead to an improvement in blood glucose metabolism, improve blood flow to peripheral nerves, and actually stimulate the regeneration of nerve fibers. Its importance in treating diabetic neuropathy cannot be overstated." (pp.539)

174. Reljanovic M, Reichel G, Rett K, et al. Treatment of diabetic polyneuropathy with the antioxidant thioctic acid (alpha-lipoic acid): a two year multi-center randomized double-blind placeb-controlled trial (ALA-DIN II). Alpha Lipoic Acid in Diabetic Neuropathy. Free Radical Research 1999;31:171-179.

175. Jacob S, Ruus P, Hermann R, et al. Oral administration of RAC-alpha-lipoic acid modulates insulin sensitivity in patients with type-2 diabetes mellitus; a placebo-controlled pilot trial. Free Radical Biology & Medicine 1999;27:309-314.

And here's the first paragraph...

"Alpha-lipoic Acid. Alpha-lipoic acid is a vitamin-like substance that is often described as "nature's perfect antioxidant". First of all, alpha-lipoic acid is a small molecule that is efficiently absorbed and easily crosses cell membranes. Unlike vitamin E, which is primarily fat soluble, and vitamin C, which is water soluable, alpha-lipoic acid can quench either water- or fat-soluable free radicals both inside the cell and outside in the intracellular spaces. Furthermore, alpha-lipoic acid extends the biochemical life of vitamin C and E, as well as other antioxidants such as glutathione, the most important intracellular antioxidant." (pp 539)

I hope you'll come back to let us know if it's helpful. :)
Yes I will let you know how it goes. I didn't know about the diabetic side of it so that has to be good. I wonder if anyone else on here have tried it, would be interesting to find out.
 
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Winnie53

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Lilliepop, I did some more looking around this morning. You can too by doing a search on "burning mouth syndrome diabetes". It appears that there are multiple causes of BMS. Diabetes appears to be one cause. This article, which was written in 2002 or later, provides a good overview with links to encouraging studies done 10 or more years ago - (also other possible causes that you can investigate)...

Is There a BMS-Diabetes Connection?
A collaboration of researchers from universities in Naples and London decided to investigate the possibility that lipoic acid (technically, alpha-lipoic acid, and also known as thioctic acid) might be good for treating BMS, because of an intriguing link that may exist between BMS and diabetes, for which lipoic acid is known to be helpful.

It had been noted long ago that many patients with BMS have high blood glucose levels, although no consistent or causal relationship has been documented.5 More recent studies of various kinds have led to the suspicion that BMS, despite its maddeningly ambiguous and seemingly numerous origins, is a kind of peripheral neuropathy, a common symptom of long-term, poorly controlled diabetes (it can also occur independently of diabetes).

In medicine, peripheral means far from the center of the body, which usually means the extremities, but in this case it means the mouth (far enough). Neuropathy means nerve damage, and there are different causes, including high glucose levels, although how glucose damages nerves is not clear. Neuropathy generally manifests either as severe pain or as a loss of feeling - an all-or-nothing deal.

Lipoic Acid Works Well on BMS
So what we have is an apparent peripheral neuropathy with a possible connection to diabetes - and it's known that lipoic acid is effective in treating neuronal (nerve-cell) damage, especially in diabetic neuropathy.6-8 You connect the dots. The Italian-British research team certainly did, and the initial result was a randomized, placebo-controlled - but open (not blinded) - clinical trial of the efficacy of lipoic acid on the one symptom of burning mouth syndrome: pain.9 The study involved 42 patients (two age- and sex-matched groups of 21 each), all with classic cases of BMS and no other conditions that might confound the results.

The results were highly positive: 76% of the test subjects taking lipoic acid (600 mg/day for 20 days, followed by 200 mg/day for 10 days) showed some improvement, with 43% showing "decided" improvement. By contrast, only 14% of the control subjects taking placebo showed some improvement (0% had decided improvement). When the controls were then switched over to lipoic acid for 30 days, their improvement rate increased to 67% (52% had decided improvement). No side effects were reported, which is consistent with lipoic acid's excellent reputation for safety.

Lipoic Acid Works Really Well on BMS
Encouraged by these results - which bolstered their belief that BMS may be a form of peripheral neuropathy - the same research team undertook a more rigorous study (randomized, placebo-controlled, and double-blind) with the same objective.10 This time, 60 patients were involved (two groups of 30 each).

This time the results were even better: 97% of the subjects on lipoic acid (600 mg/day for 2 months) showed some improvement (73% had decided improvement), whereas 40% of the controls showed some improvement (0% had decided improvement). In the lipoic acid group, four patients (13%) showed "resolution," i.e., a complete cessation of pain, which amounts to a cure; this did not occur in any of the controls. None of the patients on lipoic acid got worse during the course of the study, whereas six (20%) of the controls did. Again, there were no side effects.


Read the entire article here... http://www.life-enhancement.com/mag...lps-quench-the-fire-of-burning-mouth-syndrome

Lilliepop, neuropathy, unfortunately, is an all too common complication of diabetes. I believe more than 100 types have been described. So the alpha-lipoic acid (ALA) is a good place to start along with keeping your blood glucose levels within or as close as possible to the normal range, which you are already doing, which is good. :)

To that I'll add only that nutrients are often synergistic, by that I mean that sometimes taking "A" and "B" sometimes works better than taking "A" or "B" alone. So, when trying to find something that works for me, I give "A" a chance to work, then add "B". If the two together work, I then experiment with removing "A" to see if "B" alone works (so I'm taking the minimum of nutritional supplements needed). If "B" alone doesn't work, I add back the "A" again.

If the ALA doesn't work, the next question in my mind would be whether or not you have vitamin B deficiencies, because 5 of the 8 B vitamins have been found to be helpful in treating neuropathy. :)

Hopefully, someone else will see your post and share what worked for them. If not, you'll know in time whether or not the ALA is working. The good news is that it's good for you, whether it works for your BMS or not. Fingers and toes crossed it reduces or eliminates your BMS symptoms. :)
 
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Lilliepop

Well-Known Member
Messages
267
Lilliepop, I did some more looking around this morning. You can too by doing a search on "burning mouth syndrome diabetes". It appears that there are multiple causes of BMS. Diabetes appears to be one cause. This article provides a good overview with links to encouraging studies done 10 or more years ago - (also other possible causes that you can investigate)...

Is There a BMS-Diabetes Connection?
A collaboration of researchers from universities in Naples and London decided to investigate the possibility that lipoic acid (technically, alpha-lipoic acid, and also known as thioctic acid) might be good for treating BMS, because of an intriguing link that may exist between BMS and diabetes, for which lipoic acid is known to be helpful.

It had been noted long ago that many patients with BMS have high blood glucose levels, although no consistent or causal relationship has been documented.5 More recent studies of various kinds have led to the suspicion that BMS, despite its maddeningly ambiguous and seemingly numerous origins, is a kind of peripheral neuropathy, a common symptom of long-term, poorly controlled diabetes (it can also occur independently of diabetes).

In medicine, peripheral means far from the center of the body, which usually means the extremities, but in this case it means the mouth (far enough). Neuropathy means nerve damage, and there are different causes, including high glucose levels, although how glucose damages nerves is not clear. Neuropathy generally manifests either as severe pain or as a loss of feeling - an all-or-nothing deal.

Lipoic Acid Works Well on BMS
So what we have is an apparent peripheral neuropathy with a possible connection to diabetes - and it's known that lipoic acid is effective in treating neuronal (nerve-cell) damage, especially in diabetic neuropathy.6-8 You connect the dots. The Italian-British research team certainly did, and the initial result was a randomized, placebo-controlled - but open (not blinded) - clinical trial of the efficacy of lipoic acid on the one symptom of burning mouth syndrome: pain.9 The study involved 42 patients (two age- and sex-matched groups of 21 each), all with classic cases of BMS and no other conditions that might confound the results.

The results were highly positive: 76% of the test subjects taking lipoic acid (600 mg/day for 20 days, followed by 200 mg/day for 10 days) showed some improvement, with 43% showing "decided" improvement. By contrast, only 14% of the control subjects taking placebo showed some improvement (0% had decided improvement). When the controls were then switched over to lipoic acid for 30 days, their improvement rate increased to 67% (52% had decided improvement). No side effects were reported, which is consistent with lipoic acid's excellent reputation for safety.

Lipoic Acid Works Really Well on BMS
Encouraged by these results - which bolstered their belief that BMS may be a form of peripheral neuropathy - the same research team undertook a more rigorous study (randomized, placebo-controlled, and double-blind) with the same objective.10 This time, 60 patients were involved (two groups of 30 each).

This time the results were even better: 97% of the subjects on lipoic acid (600 mg/day for 2 months) showed some improvement (73% had decided improvement), whereas 40% of the controls showed some improvement (0% had decided improvement). In the lipoic acid group, four patients (13%) showed "resolution," i.e., a complete cessation of pain, which amounts to a cure; this did not occur in any of the controls. None of the patients on lipoic acid got worse during the course of the study, whereas six (20%) of the controls did. Again, there were no side effects.


Read the entire article here... http://www.life-enhancement.com/mag...lps-quench-the-fire-of-burning-mouth-syndrome

Lilliepop, neuropathy, unfortunately, is an all too common complication of diabetes. I believe more than 100 types have been described. So the alpha-lipoic acid (ALA) is a good place to start along with keeping your blood glucose levels within or as close as possible to the normal range, which you are already doing, which is good. :)

Hopefully, someone else will see your post and share what worked for them. If not, you'll know in time whether or not the ALA is working for you. The good news is that it's good for you, whether it works for your BMS or not. Fingers and toes crossed it reduces or eliminates your BMS symptoms. :)
Thanks very much very interesting can't wait to get them and start taking them, it will be such a relief if it helped it's on my mind all day. Getting me down.
 
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Winnie53

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Fingers and toes crossed Lilliepop. Remember, if the first thing doesn't work, there's almost always something else to try. I edited my post a bit after you read my post. Apologies...

Something else to try might be to begin taking a good quality B-complex that includes all 8 of the B vitamins. If you're deficient in the B vitamins, it might help. That said, they got good results with the ALA alone in the studies, so I still think that's a good place to start. Pain and discomfort is no fun. Hope you're feeling better soon. :)
 
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Lilliepop

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Well I have been taking 600mg for two days they are like horse pills I don't know if it's in the mind but I'm sure it's a bit better so far so good. But also been reading about the diabetic benefit side of taking them I wonder if anyone is taking them for that. My Doctor said there isn't many known side effect she ask the lab and there has only two been reported that's out of thousands of people taking them.
 
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jackiemanc45

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U
Hello. I am suffering very bad with BMS it seems to be getting worst there isn't any end to it very depressing, it starting to burn my chest and nose. Dr doesent know what it is but could be related to glucose levels. Has anyone else had this problem and if so what did they take or do?
Some people have it for years the thought of that fills me with dread. The only thing that helps it a bit is chewing gum. The only problem there is I have to chew the one with sugar in as the sugar free upsets my stomach. So it's catch 22 really. Can anyone help?
[/QUOTE I've had this problem for a while now and find sacking on something helps try boiled sweet sugar free! It helps
 

Lilliepop

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Hi what is the course of yours? Chewing gum really helps but I do get fed up of chewing all the time. I have started taking lipid acid pills and I think it's helping but only been taking them for a few days. Also they are good for you anyway. You can get them on Amazon. The thing that worries me is my sense of taste has changed. Doctors don't seem to know what it is, anything that isn't
Life threatening they don't seem to worry about. Also it could be hormonal. It's nice to chat to someone else that has the same problem.