Low Carbing Benefits Question

[Eurobuff]

Hi, I wasn't sure where to post this, or how to title it either. I was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes in May of this year, my hba1c was 7.9 and my cholesterol was 6.4 (I am 42 and weighed 62 Kgs at the time). My daily carb intake was 200g roughly. I changed my diet drastically. My daily carb intake now is about 50grams I eat about 90-100 grams of fat, and 80-100 grams of protein. I take 800 grams of chromium and 600 grams of Cinnulin PF per day. I have just had some more tests done at the doctors. My hba1c is now 5.5 and my cholesterol is now 5. Now I'll get to my question! I have a friend who has been diabetic for over 20 years. He is taking metformin and Gliclacide and has just been told he needs to go on insulin. He is wondering if he followed a low carb diet or LCHF if it would help at this stage. I am just wondering if there are any type 2 diabetics out there that have tried low Carbing or LCHF after having diabetes for a long time such as this and what the results are. Sorry to be a bit long winded.

 

[sanguine]

Hi, I don't think it's ever too late to start low-carbing for a T2, and start on a path that might enable your friend to avoid insulin and even reduce his other meds in time. But I've only been T2 for a short time and unmedicated, so you best wait for some words from someone longer in the programme than me!

Well done on your own progress too! (I take it you have 800 mg of chromium, not nearly a kilo!).

 

[Eurobuff]

Oops! Yes 800mg of Chromium & 600 mg of Cinnulin PF Thanks anyway, I'm controlling it by diet as well. I did say that he should tell his doctor and check his BG more often though.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Well done on your achievements. That is brilliant.

Yes, your friend can start now and may well avoid insulin and be able to reduce his other meds. There is no better time than today for him, and with you to help he should do well. Plenty of people on here have managed to come off insulin and seriously reduce other meds.

 

[Eurobuff]

Thanks It's just I know my situation isn't the same as his and I don't want to say something that could make things worse for him.

 

[jack412]

IMO he should keep his BG in range and if that means going on insulin, he should do it
LCHF may or may not get him off or stop him moving to insulin, but by reducing his carbs. he will take a smaller amount of medication, his BG will be more stable and he can lose some weight.

getting his weight and insulin resistance down. So what's left of the pancreas beta cells can work as good as they can

 

[Bluetit1802]

Thanks It's just I know my situation isn't the same as his and I don't want to say something that could make things worse for him.

You won't make things worse, only better. It couldn't be a great deal worse for him as he is clearly not controlling it with whatever he is doing now.

 

[Eurobuff]

IMO he should keep his BG in range and if that means going on insulin, he should do it
LCHF may or may not get him off or stop him moving to insulin, but by reducing his carbs. he will take a smaller amount of medication, his BG will be more stable and he can lose some weight.

getting his weight and insulin resistance down. So what's left of the pancreas beta cells can work as good as they can

He has to go back to the hospital to start his insulin, his appointment is in 4 weeks time. I'm pretty sure he will keep this appointment regardless of what he does. He did ask his diabetic nurse at his doctors and at the hospital about the Newcastle diet, as he was looking into that but neither of the nurses had heard of it!

 

[jack412]

4 weeks can make a big difference to his BG
also a link to the Newcastle diet, on the page is a letter he can print out for his DR



http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf it’s a long page and a video
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarb101/a/firstweek.htm

http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarbliving/a/Food-Cravings.htm because carbs don’t give up easy.

testing
http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045524.php
food count
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/

Newcastle diet aims in 8+ weeks to mimic or better the rate of ~80% remission, for surgery T2
http://www.ncl.ac.uk/magres/research/diabetes/
http://www.diabetesforecast.org/2010/mar/weight-loss-surgery-and-type-2-diabetes.html

http://diabeticmediterraneandiet.com/low-carb-mediterranean-diet/
http://www.lowcarbdietitian.com/blog/carbohydrate-restriction-an-option-for-diabetes-management

http://www.homehealth-uk.com/medical/blood_glucose_monitor_testing.htm
if you buy extra boxes of strips there is a discount code
5 packs 264086
10 packs 975833

 

[douglas99]

If he is to be put on insulin in 4 weeks, and is considering going LC, he needs to make the change now.
LC will affect the amount of insulin needed, so the hospital will need to have a new set of stable BG, to re-assess his treatment, otherwise he may find they over prescribe.
Get him to make the change as soon as possible.

 

[Eurobuff]

If he is to be put on insulin in 4 weeks, and is considering going LC, he needs to make the change now.
LC will affect the amount of insulin needed, so the hospital will need to have a new set of stable BG, to re-assess his treatment, otherwise he may find they over prescribe.
Get him to make the change as soon as possible.

Ok thanks for that, I'll tell him that

 

[Brunneria]

I totally agree with @douglas99

Unfortunately, there is another factor to take into account - and that is, if his blood glucose has been running high for a while (and if he's heading towards insulin, then it probably has), then moving into low carbing is better done gently. In steps. Or in a gradual slide over several months.

I realise that these two suggestions are contradictory. But they are both very relevant.

Perhaps go reduced carb now, rather than low carb.
Stabilise for a few weeks before insulin.
Then get used to the insulin for as long as he needs to feel confident with it, then
Reduce the carbs further, gently, after that, if he feels the need.

Reducing carbs while on insulin is by no means impossible (there are lots of forum members who have done it) but I think it will take some tutoring from an experienced insulin user/health care professional.

Hopefully one of those experts will be along to comment soon!

 

[Eurobuff]

I don't know how many carbs he's eating at the moment. I know he doesn't eat crisps or chocolate. How many carbs should he aim for, or what percentage should he reduce it by? I went from 200g to about 80g initially but I did go into ketosis and have the "carb flu" for about 3-4 weeks. But I wasn't on tablets like he is.

 

[Brunneria]

Rather than aim for a specific target, it might be easier to aim for a specific reduction.

I entered a few days food quantities into myfitnesspal. That told me how much I was eating, and where the carbs were. That made it astonishingly easy to cut some of the carbs out.

If he's currently on 300g, then 200g carbs is a significant reduction.
But if he's on 150g at the moment, then dropping to 100g is equally significant.

I'm afraid I can't make any suggestions. I've been low carbing for so long that I have no real concept of what normal people eat, any more. I've just got home from a curry out with colleagues. 6 ladies, eating, chatting and laughing. I was stunned by their combined capacity to inhale bread, rice, poppadoms and potato.

Perhaps your friend will feel he needs to make up his own mind as to what is 'doable'.

 

[douglas99]

.............. I was stunned by their combined capacity to inhale bread, rice, poppadoms and potato...............'.

That's where the 'healthy eating' advice kicks in.
If you think that's the average starting point, you can start to understand why even the nhs advice is so much better than what you saw being eaten.

 

[Brunneria]

That's where the 'healthy eating' advice kicks in.
If you think that's the average starting point, you can start to understand why even the nhs advice is so much better than what you saw being eaten.

Especially as one of them was bemoaning her brain fog, and saying how the best way to avoid a diagnosis of diabetes is to refuse to go in for the tests.
She seemed rather proud of herself as she said it.

 

[Eurobuff]

I can't believe someone could say that! That's frightening