Sweet smelling urine, peeing every hour and thirst

[Pat-D2]

Did my homework on the internet and it certainly looks looks like Type 2 diabetes. It is the day after Thanksgiving and everything is closed - did not want to go the emergency room ($$$). My last blood test was a year ago and glucose was okay. I recently took a job that requires me to be in the Florida sun a couple times a week without access to a bathroom for 4 hours at a time (sailing instruction)

My symptom started about 5 weeks ago - shortly after starting getting on the water. At first I thought it was dehydration. Constant thirst and needing to go to bathroom every hour. I am 60 and thought this was just another of the wonderful joys of aging. But as time went on I realized that my urine was smelling very sweet.

Tonight I picked up a True2Go self testing blood glucose monitoring system. The instructions said to call the doctor immediately if results were under 20 mg/dL or over 600 mg/dL.

Normal for the time of day for me should have been 170. I measured 383 mg/dl.

Under normal circumstances I cannot get to a doctor for another week. Any advice?

Thanks in advance

 

[Indy51]

Hi and welcome to the forum, @Pat-D2

You certainly have some disturbing symptoms and your BG is very high (21.3 in our measurements). I would definitely urge you to try and see a doctor a lot faster than a week's time. I think I'd also be inclined to see a pharmacist and try to get either ketostix to test to see if you are producing excessively high ketones.

I'm tagging @daisy1 who will be along to give you some introductory information.

In the meantime, I think the sooner you cut most carbs from your diet the better as carbohydrates have the most impact on raising blood glucose levels. It would also be a good idea to stay as hydrated as you possibly can.

This thread is a introduction to the low carb way of eating: http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/a-new-low-carb-guide-for-beginners.68695/

 

[TorqPenderloin]

The advice is go see a doctor....at those levels you are destroying your kidneys. One week may not cause permanent damage but you could have been at those levels well before you started noticing the symptoms.

If money is an issue, go to an urgent care center. Don't mean to be rude, but this is not something you put off for a week.

 

[Pat-D2]

The advice is go see a doctor....at those levels you are destroying your kidneys. One week may not cause permanent damage but you could have been at those levels well before you started noticing the symptoms.

If money is an issue, go to an urgent care center. Don't mean to be rude, but this is not something you put off for a week.

Thanks to both of you for the responses. I just bought some ketone test strips (it is 11:00 PM here). Based on color key I was between 15-40 - my estimate is 30 (between small and moderate).

 

[daisy1]

@Pat-D2

Hello Pat and welcome to the forum Here is the information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask as many questions as you need to and someone will be there to help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEWLY DIAGNOSED DIABETICS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you’ll find over 150,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

Another option is to replace ‘white carbohydrates’ (such as white bread, white rice, white flour etc) with whole grain varieties. The idea behind having whole grain varieties is that the carbohydrates get broken down slower than the white varieties –and these are said to have a lower glycaemic index.
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/food/diabetes-and-whole-grains.html

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes

LOW CARB PROGRAM:
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/low carb program


Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to bloodglucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.

 

[Daibell]

Hi and welcome. The immediate action to take is to reduce the carbs way down to help reduce blood sugar whilst seeing the physician as soon as you can. If you have excess weight then assume T2. If you are thin and have possibly lost weight recently then Late onset T1 is a possibility which needs more serious medication.

 

[Pat-D2]

I saw a doctor yesterday morning. My BG as down from 383 to 232 after 12 hours of fasting. I started on Metformin twice daily. This morning I was 249. In the meantime I need to learn a lot more about designing a health eating regimen for this condition. I am very concerned about any deprivation diet especially when it eliminates vitamins.

I have say that I am surprised that I have not seen info on vitamin supplements on this blog. Just talking sole about eliminating carbs seems to be a bit reckless. I am very impressed by the website. But I don't want to fix my BG and die of scurvy.

 

[Pat-D2]

Hi and welcome to the forum, @Pat-D2

You certainly have some disturbing symptoms and your BG is very high (21.3 in our measurements). I would definitely urge you to try and see a doctor a lot faster than a week's time. I think I'd also be inclined to see a pharmacist and try to get either ketostix to test to see if you are producing excessively high ketones.

I'm tagging @daisy1 who will be along to give you some introductory information.

In the meantime, I think the sooner you cut most carbs from your diet the better as carbohydrates have the most impact on raising blood glucose levels. It would also be a good idea to stay as hydrated as you possibly can.

This thread is a introduction to the low carb way of eating: http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/a-new-low-carb-guide-for-beginners.68695/

Thank you for your interest and advice. It has been extremely helpful

 

[TorqPenderloin]

I saw a doctor yesterday morning. My BG as down from 383 to 232 after 12 hours of fasting. I started on Metformin twice daily. This morning I was 249. In the meantime I need to learn a lot more about designing a health eating regimen for this condition. I am very concerned about any deprivation diet especially when it eliminates vitamins.

I have say that I am surprised that I have not seen info on vitamin supplements on this blog. Just talking sole about eliminating carbs seems to be a bit reckless. I am very impressed by the website. But I don't want to fix my BG and die of scurvy.

Glad to hear you saw a doctor.

What particular concerns do you have about low carb diets and what do you find "reckless" about them?

There are certainly other approaches and each person has to find out what works best for their body. However, I'm sure you agree that it's important to make decisions based on scientific evidence rather than basing them on misconceptions (there are a ton when it comes to nutrition).

 

[Pat-D2]

Also for what is worth, the fruity smell of urine went away after 12 hour fast. Undiagnosed it is a catch-22: not getting enough glucose to the cell due to insulin deficiency - feeling tired - have another coke or candy bar. Still tired. Repeat. I went from not drinking soft drinks to having 6 a day because they were in a nearby vending machine at work. All of this was associated with the demands of new job. That did not work out too well.

 

[Pat-D2]

Glad to hear you saw a doctor.

What particular concerns do you have about low carb diets and what do you find "reckless" about them?

There are certainly other approaches and each person has to find out what works best for their body. However, I'm sure you agree that it's important to make decisions based on scientific evidence rather than basing them on misconceptions (there are a ton when it comes to nutrition).

First, thanks for your advice. I was off to see a doctor the next morning. My concern now is that I don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. For example there is no vitamin-C in the non-carb diet. I have never been a believer in the one hat fits all solution when it comes to food.

 

[Mep]

I saw a doctor yesterday morning. My BG as down from 383 to 232 after 12 hours of fasting. I started on Metformin twice daily. This morning I was 249. In the meantime I need to learn a lot more about designing a health eating regimen for this condition. I am very concerned about any deprivation diet especially when it eliminates vitamins.

I have say that I am surprised that I have not seen info on vitamin supplements on this blog. Just talking sole about eliminating carbs seems to be a bit reckless. I am very impressed by the website. But I don't want to fix my BG and die of scurvy.

Hi Pat

I'm glad you got to the doctor and you've been placed on metformin. Metformin doesn't work quickly at lowering sugar, but it does help a small amount. The main thing that would control it would by your diet for sure, and yes there are supplements you can take, but it is best to discuss that with your doctor first before trialling any supplement. Also has your doctor requested the diagnostic tests to be done (hbA1c - checks past 60 days average sugar level, GAD test - check for antibodies, C-Peptide test - checks whether or not your pancreas is producing insulin)? You're not really going to know what treatment is needed until you get all the test results. Eg. metformin isn't going to work very well if you hardly have much insulin. Also the tests will show what type of diabetes you have. Yes the low carb/high fat diet is a diet many try and follow, but it is not a one size fits all diet for diabetes. I for one tried it and had to come off it due to very high cholesterol and a family history of heart disease. You will find you will work out what is best for you as you go. The best thing to learn though is use your meter regularly and get to know what various things do to your sugar levels (eg. it's not just about food, as being sick, climate temperature, stress, exercise/activity, plus other things such as medications all impacts your sugar levels either good or bad). I wish you the best... this is a good support network right here.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

First, thanks for your advice. I was off to see a doctor the next morning. My concern now is that I don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. For example there is no vitamin-C in the non-carb diet. I have never been a believer in the one hat fits all solution when it comes to food.

I completely agree that everyone is different and my personal dietary approach is vastly different from most people's on this forum.

However, concerns about deficiencies in things like vitamin C are easily combatted with a basic daily multi-vitamin.

Hopefully, you don't feel like anyone is pressuring you into implementing a specific diet. We are simply trying to help one another make our own informed decisions.

 

[Pat-D2]

Last year I had a kidney stone that had to be removed (first one in 20 years). I spend a lot of time on the internet looking for recommendations about diet. I found one paper by the University of Maryland that told me (in the same page) to avoid one vegetable because of the oxalates and consume it for the fiber.

I also found a website where the creator said to drink a mixture of lemon juice and olive oil claiming that the lemon acid would break down the stone (okay) and the olive oil would lubricate the urethra to help pass the stone (crazy). As if your dog's urine would be slippery if you put vegetable oil in its kibbles.

My kidney stone doctors were from UCLA and they were big believers of cutting out red meat and salt - forget about the Mayo clinic recommendations on oxalates. It made my head spin.

So now I supposed to avoid carbohydrates for my diabetes and red meat and salt for kidney stones. Like all of you probably were, I was overwhelmed last night when I went to the grocery store and saw aisle after aisle of nothing but sugar and processed food.

 

[Pat-D2]

Hi Pat

I'm glad you got to the doctor and you've been placed on metformin. Metformin doesn't work quickly at lowering sugar, but it does help a small amount. The main thing that would control it would by your diet for sure, and yes there are supplements you can take, but it is best to discuss that with your doctor first before trialling any supplement. Also has your doctor requested the diagnostic tests to be done (hbA1c - checks past 60 days average sugar level, GAD test - check for antibodies, C-Peptide test - checks whether or not your pancreas is producing insulin)? You're not really going to know what treatment is needed until you get all the test results. Eg. metformin isn't going to work very well if you hardly have much insulin. Also the tests will show what type of diabetes you have. Yes the low carb/high fat diet is a diet many try and follow, but it is not a one size fits all diet for diabetes. I for one tried it and had to come off it due to very high cholesterol and a family history of heart disease. You will find you will work out what is best for you as you go. The best thing to learn though is use your meter regularly and get to know what various things do to your sugar levels (eg. it's not just about food, as being sick, climate temperature, stress, exercise/activity, plus other things such as medications all impacts your sugar levels either good or bad). I wish you the best... this is a good support network right here.

I am going back first week of January for those tests. I had basic bloodwork done but the said the hbA1C could want until my coverage kicked in. I don't even know what my cholesterol is right now. I had been working overseas on a ship for a few years (until June) and started new job in the states in October. Insurance does not kick until January 1

 

[andcol]

Why do you think you will be deficient in vitamins and minerals by cutting out starchy carbs. Green leafy veg have high contents of vitamins and minerals and you can eat lots of these and still be low carb. You do not need the high sugar fruits/fruit juice for vitamin C.

 

[Daibell]

Hi. Many of the carbs we eat are empty of other nutrients and hence are no real loss. If you still have plenty of veg and non-tropical fruit when low-carbing plus fat and protein you are probably getting most if not all of the nutrients you need such as Vitamin C plus fibre.

 

[Devonbear]

Pat,

Amongst the 10 best foods for Vitamin C content are the following which are acceptable on a low carb diet (in order of Vit C content).

Bell peppers, Broccoli, Brussel Sprouts, Strawberries, Cauliflower

I certainly eat plenty of those. A single serving of any of the first four will give you your RDA, and cauliflower isn't far off either.

Don't listen to the "you can't live without your essential carbohydrates" brigade.

 

[Pat-D2]

Again thanks for the input. I think I am trying to process too much information.

I had classic scenario for type 2 - age 60, 40 pounds overweight, and had been consuming uncharacteristic high level of sugar drinks. My ketone level is "medium" per home test stick. When I mentioned this at doctor appointment yesterday she did not blink and told me she prescribed Metformin and wanted me to exercise. No discussion about type 1 or 2. I just assumed type 2. Bloodwork is at lab.

Now I am rereading info that says one is much more likely to be Type 1 with ketones and that exercise with medium ketones and my BG level is a no go. My excessive urine output, thirst and urine sweetness stopped immediately during my overnight fast. I don't have much of an appetite.


Am I too focused on ketones?

 

[Mep]

Again thanks for the input. I think I am trying to process too much information.

I had classic scenario for type 2 - age 60, 40 pounds overweight, and had been consuming uncharacteristic high level of sugar drinks. My ketone level is "medium" per home test stick. When I mentioned this at doctor appointment yesterday she did not blink and told me she prescribed Metformin and wanted me to exercise. No discussion about type 1 or 2. I just assumed type 2. Bloodwork is at lab.

Now I am rereading info that says one is much more likely to be Type 1 with ketones and that exercise with medium ketones and my BG level is a no go. My excessive urine output, thirst and urine sweetness stopped immediately during my overnight fast. I don't have much of an appetite.


Am I too focused on ketones?

Hi Pat

When you're newly diagnosed, it is very hard to take in all the information. I remember it well. Take regular breaks and do things by steps which helps to break it down for you so that you can cope. When I was first diagnosed it was a shock to me and there was no online support at the time like there is now. I started out by keeping a food diary and monitoring my sugar levels. I lost 20 kgs (44 lbs your measurement if in US) in the first year. I started out with small steps and monitored everything which helped me a lot.

I'm type 2 and I've had ketones in my urine before, so no it is not only type 1's that get ketones. I usually get ketones when I'm really sick and not eating much. It is a sign our body is using stored fat for fuel instead of the food we should be eating. It's not good for diabetes. Yes, sugary drinks would definitely raise your blood sugar levels. Just cutting them out would help you to start with... then just work on the rest that you need to.