Dietitian talks of Carbohydrate Management!!!!!

[wallycorker]

Well, I've had a brief look, and, as I remembered it, it is just a basic low carb-high fat diet book. I suppose it made such an impression on me because I'd never read or heard anything like it before. Back in the 80's and 90's it was, and still is, heresy. This is, possibly, the diet that nearly all low-carb diets are based on! I think this is where I first read about Stefansson and Banting. I'll have another look later.

It's amazing isn't it how long a lot of this stuff has been known and people has either been forgotten about or the knowledge has never been taken up. I keep saying to my wife that I'm sure that my non-diabetic housewife mother (who hardly ever left the house and very rarely read or left the mining village where we lived) seemed to know all about a lot of the dietary stuff that I read about. I can't work out how she would have been aware of it but think it might have been info' given out by the Ministry of Food during the War.

As I said, I don't recall ever actually 'going on a diet' as such, more just an awareness that this book made sense to me and it has been in the background since then. I obviously didn't do it for very long at a stretch, or indeed, very well, otherwise I probably wouldn't carry excess weight and just maybe, wouldn't be on insulin. But - being virtually complication-free could be down to this book - and Pa's genes.

Me neither - I never try to follow a diet or menu plan,I simply just build the principles of what I've read into my daily diet. I just keep making small changes almost on a continual ongoing basis.

John, you've led me astray! I only made a comment on the consultant, the dietician and carbohydrate, and now look where we are. I'll be spouting philosophy next!

Go for it Barb - your message is very interesting! To me at least!

Best wishes - John

 

[dipsticky]

Blimey. We got a blog session going now. I'll have to get my old mates to chip in. We could have a laugh ? How you doing Barb ? Looks like its good. Is willy your boyfriend. He sure looks like he has the hot's for you. Go girl ! :wink:

D.

 

[nannybarbara]

D.

Oooh ... you are awful, (wallop)! but I like you! :lol: :lol:

And if you don't know where that line comes from, it just goes to show that you're far too young!

B

 

[dipsticky]

Yes, cheers babe. **** was a good friend of mine ? :wink:

D.

 

[WeeJane]

Hi Folks - I'm fairly recently diagnosed T2D (5/09), told to increase carb intake and to test daily. Discovered lower carb was better for me. Where do I get best info on portion sizes? Have brought HbA1C to 7.2 from 8.3 but can't budge cholesterol from 7.0. Any ideas?
Read about Cinnamon and lowering sugar levels. Has this worked for anyone?
Thanks,
WeeJane

 

[Romola]

If your cholesterol is 7, I wonder why you aren't taking statins.

 

[cugila]

Hi Folks - I'm fairly recently diagnosed T2D (5/09), told to increase carb intake and to test daily. Discovered lower carb was better for me. Where do I get best info on portion sizes? Have brought HbA1C to 7.2 from 8.3 but can't budge cholesterol from 7.0. Any ideas?
Read about Cinnamon and lowering sugar levels. Has this worked for anyone?
Thanks,
WeeJane

Here is a link to the Blood Pressure Association site with much information on how to lower Cholesterol. Have a read.
http://www.bpassoc.org.uk/BloodPressure ... pyourheart

As one who is very 'heart' conscious here is some advice which will probably upset some, but it's my advice.
Avoid eating too much saturated fat, as this will raise your cholesterol. It is usually found in cheese, red meats, butter, palm oil or ghee. Moderation is all that is required.

As for supplements, personally I don't touch any. All natural foods provide all the nutrients and vitamins I need. There is a previous topic/s which discuss the merits or not of Cinnamon etc. Do a search on here and have a read of the results. There are some users of it on here, no doubt they will also advise you ?

 

[NickW]

Hi Folks - I'm fairly recently diagnosed T2D (5/09), told to increase carb intake and to test daily. Discovered lower carb was better for me. Where do I get best info on portion sizes? Have brought HbA1C to 7.2 from 8.3 but can't budge cholesterol from 7.0. Any ideas?
Read about Cinnamon and lowering sugar levels. Has this worked for anyone?
Thanks,
WeeJane

Cholesterol and CHD is a huge topic, but in general my advice would be:

- Definitely continue to pursue better diabetic control - this is just critical. You've made a great start - well done! But keep it up and aim even lower next time.
- Eat real food instead of processed food - meat, fish, eggs, vegetables, fruit, nuts and seeds. Stuff you could dig up or pick from a tree or hunt or fish for. Lean animal protein and dark green leaves are particualrly good.
- Avoid processed foods as much as possible. Particularly watch the refined carbs - not just sugar, but things like bread and pasta as well. Limit or omit from your diet altogether.
- Get your omega-3's in hefty quantities (recent reviews of the body of literature show increased omega-3 consumption as being the single most effective dietary intervention that can significantly reduce the risk of CHD).
- Don't be scared of saturated fats. Do be scared of trans fats.
- Get your exercise.
- Get your sleep and try to lower stress levels.

A natural diet (i.e. one where you eat the food we evolved to eat) has a habit of fixing a LOT of problems. I'd urge anyone to give it a try for a month at least, and see how you feel (and how your blood tests react) - many, many people who try it are pleasantly surprised!

 

[nannybarbara]

Nick,

Yes, I think it's a really good way for a diabetic to eat.

I'm a compulsive diet & nutrition book reader. Unfortunately, after a while they kind of blend into one! I think most of these diet docs go one step too far in their diet plans, but some tips from some time ago that I thought quite helpful, is to try to shop in the outside aisles at the supermarket, that's where the veg, fish and meat are, (so's the bread but I try to ignore that) and try to imagine eating something raw! If early man couldn't eat it without fire, then don't eat it! Very Harsh, but then early man didn't have the delights of decent coffee and digestive biscuits!

Also, one writer, I can't remember who, divided carbohydrate into two types, high-density (bread, root vegetables, pasta, sugar etc.) and low-density (leafy stuff and fruit). Unfortunately, for me, fruit is a no-no - even berries. In fairness, I do try to go for low-density carbs. I have noticed, however, that McVities Plain Chocolate Digestives and Bourbon biscuits are living things that keep sidling off the shelves into my basket. It more or less sorts things out in my head when I'm shopping. Choc biscuits not included.

Barb

 

[wallycorker]

Hi Nick,

Yes - I agree with Barb. That is a superbly succinct and very simple summary of the sort of way that people ought to be eating - especially daibetics - for maximum health benefits.

Best wishes - John

 

[pavlosn]

Hi Nick

I too will agree that you have given an excellent, very clear and concise guidline for good glucose management.

I have only one question. Why do you state that we should not be scared of saturated fats? I thought sats were the enemy if you have high lipid levels.

Personally, I try to limit sats and use mostly olive oil, which I understand is primarily monounsaturated fat (mostly as dressing for salads and vegetables). I am fortunate I guess, as being in Cyprus, olive oil forms part of our traditional cuisine anyway!

Although I do not low carb, I have followed my doctors advice to restrict carbs and I must say that I am surprised to read that nealy diagnosed diabetics in the UK are encouraged to eat more starchy carbohydrates. Why? Were they not eating enough carbs in the first place? Is it because of the food pyramid, which has carbs at the bottom?

I am not saying that the Cyprus health system is so fantastic, just that maybe I had a good doctor and also expressing my surprise at what appears to me counterintuitive advise.

Of course there seems to be no limit to the conflicting advise that a diabetic seems to receive from all sources, a lot of it conflicting or plain wrong.

I visited a health store recently and got into a converation with the owner, who claimed to be a nutritionist, she recommented that I eat lots of starchy low-GI, low -glutten grain products in order to "cure" my diabetes or at least get off the medication. When I expressed my surprise, she went on to clarify that carbs are ok for diabetics as long as they do not mix them with proteins. So I should have at least one meal a day of just carbs and one meal of no carbs. She was also very entusiastic about what she called grape detoxification - eating nothing but dark grapes for a month in order to purify and kick start my system!

I am no expert ,so who knows, maybe she was right but I was not prepared to risk it. It all sounded like a recipe for trouble to me so you will not be surprised that I have not been back to that shop since. But it goes to show that everybody seems to have an opinion as to what diebetics should do.

Regards

Pavlos

 

[NickW]

Hi Pavlos,

Saturated fat's a big topic in and of itself and I'm still learning and reading up myself. A few general comments though:

1. The reason sat fat is vilified is becuase it's thought to raise LDL and total cholesterol (TC).

2. However, there's little real evidence that it does raise LDL / TC, and much of the evidence is contradictory or cannot be repeated.

3. Further, different saturated fatty acids behave differently. Laurate and stearate appear to actually increase HDL and improve the HDL/LDL ratio, whereas palmitate increases LDL.

4. With all that said, particle size and density is more important in cardiovascular health than absolute counts, and increased sat fat (and increased fat intake in general at the expense of carbohydrate) appears to improve this quite markedly.

5. Evolutionarily we ate a reasonable amount of saturated fat (approx. 10 - 15% of energy intake).

In everything I've seen so far, there's no reason to believe that reasonable intake of sat fat is harmful (e.g. 12 - 15% of total energy) - though I'd try to get it in the form of laurate and stearate rather than palmitate (so I'd get it from grass-fed meat, grass-fed butter, and coconut oil). I'd avoid taking in too much omega-6 (found in most vegetable oils), would make sure to get plenty of omega-3 (fish, grass-fed meat, even fish-oil supplements), decent amounts of mono-unsat (olive oil, avocados) and would avoid trans fats like the plague. And strangely enough, this starts to look very much like a paleo diet - plenty of fish, naturally reared meat, vegetables and nuts, and avoiding processed foods (with one or two minor exceptions - I still eat butter, and olive oil is pressed).


I vaguely intend to put a blog post together about all of this but it'll take a while to compose, and in all honesty it might be too big a topic to manage! I'd certainly recommend reading some of the better cardio health blogs if you're interested though, there's a lot of great information out there.

As for eating carb-only meals or going on a month-long grape-only diet that your health store owner suggests, I think your instincts were right - I'd steer well clear!

Cheers,
Nick.

 

[NickW]

I forgot to add - this article may well be of interest, as it puts the recommendation of a TC of under 5 in a slightly different light: http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/enig_chol.html

The article by Taubes that's referred to in that post can be read here; it's long and takes some getting through, but well worth it in my opinion (as his his book if this sparks off an interest in learning even more): http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/taubes.html

 

[fergus]

Excellent stuff Nick.
To my mind, the fear of saturated fat is almost entirely misplaced. It was demonised in the '50's, largely due to Ancel Keys hypothesis that it raised cholesterol and thus increased the risk of heart disease.
Keys himself later recanted and admitted the concern about cholesterol was misplaced. Unfortunately, it was a little too late because government guidelines and highly profitable pharmaceutical companies had heavily backed the wrong horse by that time.
While it was true that sat. fat raised cholesterol, the effect on the precise sub-fractions is the important bit. It's now well established that the large, fluffy, perfectly benign LDL levels rise, not the potentially damaging small dense particles which form plaques under the endothilial layer.
Besides which, LDL itself is a by-product of VLDL which is produced in response to the consumption of glucose and the production of insulin to deal with it. The fact that elevated glucose and insulin simultaneously raise triglyceride levels and reduce HDL kinda puts the tin lid on it!

All the best,

fergus

 

[Lucky123]

Fairly new to website - what is this carb diet everyone keeps talking about. Please could I have a note of what to and what not to eat. Type 2 diet only, but weight ballooning as not good to sticking to diet.

 

[NickW]

Hi Lucky,

Many people on here have achieved their best control by limiting the amount of carbohydrate they eat. Low-carb isn't a specific diet as such, it's just a general term because you eat a low amount of carbohydrate!

Take a look at the Low-Carb forum, there's a thread right near the top with a great introduction to things. Have a read through that and some of the other posts on that forum, and post up with any specific questions!

Cheers,
Nick.

 

[NickW]

Great post fergus (sorry, not trying to turn this into a mutual appreciation society!) But I'd take coconut oil and butter over pasta and white rice any day...

 

[wallycorker]

Fairly new to website - what is this carb diet everyone keeps talking about. Please could I have a note of what to and what not to eat. Type 2 diet only, but weight ballooning as not good to sticking to diet.

Hi,

The first thing to do is to cut back on your starchy carbohydrate intake - i.e. cereals, bread, potatoes, pasta, rice etc. That usually leads to a rapid improvement in the blood glucose levels of Type 2s.

Best wishes - John

 

[jesseventura]

I think that whether you are 'professional' or not, common sense has a huge part to play in the dispensing of that advice. So for my dieting I will not prefer any dieticians.


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