Type 2 What is the health goal here?

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Now that was just plain sneaky! Are you on commission?

Well, I am trying to find something very important to do, like clean the toilet :)

Sorry mods for a little derailing...............:rolleyes: o_O
 

intelligenteating

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I did it in 12 day, and no I didn't charge any 'fee'. My income comes from a day job where I train paramedics with respect to the MEND test.
 

intelligenteating

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If I am able to, I will answer. I've survived open heart surgery, and regularly speak at large events. My critics are the pharmaceutics companies and many in the medical profession. A bloke who has more important things like 'cleaning a toilet' or a lady who thinks I am on commission for posting a link to a research paper are unlikely to deter me. :)

So, back on topic - what is the health goal with this forum? Is the idea that people find it through whichever medium and manage their condition, or intend to cure themselves. I appreciate that it's certainly far from possible and often impossible but it's interesting. One of the big congenital heart groups I moderate, ( http://www.thesf.org.uk ) is purely for a sense of not feeling alone, there's no cure.
 

tim2000s

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It's the strongest. I'm not going to sit here and post a bunch of links, but I'm sure given the level of activity online you have, you're well aware of the work of Colin Campbell and Neal Barnard. :)
It's one of many strong links. There's a good summary of all of them here: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1399-5448.2007.00280.x/full

Cow's milk is one with strong correlation. Exposure to enteroviruses is another with strong correlation. I wouldn't say that either was the strongest, based on the data available.

In addition, I am very aware of the work of Colin Campbell and how it is held up in the Vegetarian and Vegan community. It is notable for the sins of omission that could be considered on a par with those of Ancel Keys. Mr Barnard is also a vegetarian/vegan zealot, so both these approaches being advocated come with the same pinch of revolutionary salt.

Likewise, the milk hypothesis is neither proven nor disproven, and has strong correlations both for and against.

So pick your sources and studies carefully and you can make anything a good way to treat diabetes.

Coming back to Type 2 and using the references you have usefully provided, I am guessing that you put forward a vegan or vegetarian diet as your preferred way to deal with the condition, aligned with Barnard's not infamous book? What you'll also find on here is that Low Carb, Higher Fat intervention has proven very successful as a mechanism for putting T2 into remission, as has the Newcastle Diet approach in those who were significantly overweight.

There are multiple ways to treat T2 at a diet level - what's yours?
 
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13lizanne

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Excuse me but your link to a "research paper" was, in fact, to a website which required one to register as a member before given access but, thank you for recognising that I am, in fact, a "lady" don't know how @Robinredbreast feels about being referred to as a "bloke" though
 

Jaylee

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If I am able to, I will answer. I've survived open heart surgery, and regularly speak at large events. My critics are the pharmaceutics companies and many in the medical profession. A bloke who has more important things like 'cleaning a toilet' or a lady who thinks I am on commission for posting a link to a research paper are unlikely to deter me. :)

So, back on topic - what is the health goal with this forum? Is the idea that people find it through whichever medium and manage their condition, or intend to cure themselves. I appreciate that it's certainly far from possible and often impossible but it's interesting. One of the big congenital heart groups I moderate, ( http://www.thesf.org.uk ) is purely for a sense of not feeling alone, there's no cure.

I may just take you up on that.. & you're a fine looking chap too! ;)
 

intelligenteating

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Excuse me but your link to a "research paper" was, in fact, to a website which required one to register as a member before given access but, thank you for recognising that I am, in fact, a "lady" don't know how @Robinredbreast feels about being referred to as a "bloke" though

So register then....?
 

Lamont D

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I have a condition with no 'cure'!
However, I 'control' it with a very low carb, high fat diet. And my specialist endocrinologist has cajoled, inspired and promoted my lifestyle!

Low carb rice is still a starchy carbohydrate, I have no tolerance for that level of carbs.
Not matter how you package it up.
For all diabetics, carbohydrates are really not good for your health!

Finally, my goal, as a different type of blood glucose disorder is to be as healthy as I am now!
If I listened to your 'spiel' I would be very ill again.
This forum exists to promote good health and advice to those like myself who had over a decade of really bad dietary advice which was supposed to 'manage' our conditions. It doesn't!

I am eternally grateful to have found this website and I'm very wary of your intentions!
 
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Excuse me but your link to a "research paper" was, in fact, to a website which required one to register as a member before given access but, thank you for recognising that I am, in fact, a "lady" don't know how @Robinredbreast feels about being referred to as a "bloke" though

Assuming again lol
 
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intelligenteating

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It's one of many strong links. There's a good summary of all of them here: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1399-5448.2007.00280.x/full

Cow's milk is one with strong correlation. Exposure to enteroviruses is another with strong correlation. I wouldn't say that either was the strongest, based on the data available.

In addition, I am very aware of the work of Colin Campbell and how it is held up in the Vegetarian and Vegan community. It is notable for the sins of omission that could be considered on a par with those of Ancel Keys. Likewise, the milk hypothesis is neither proven nor disproven, and has strong correlations both for and against.

So pick your sources and studies carefully and you can make anything a good way to treat diabetes.

Coming back to Type 2 and using the references you have usefully provided, I am guessing that you put forward a vegan or vegetarian diet as your preferred way to deal with the condition, aligned with Barnard's not infamous book? What you'll also find on here is that Low Carb, Higher Fat intervention has proven very successful as a mechanism for putting T2 into remission, as has the Newcastle Diet approach in those who were significantly overweight.

There are multiple ways to treat T2 at a diet level - what's yours?

That's a good question, and I think it's about what works for somebody with respect to adherence and implementation. The newcastle diet, for example isn't something that someone could sustain for a long time and lead a normal life - and it really lacks an exit strategy. Low carb diets with a calorie dependency on fats do appear to have significant influence on type 2 diabetic symptoms, and this forum clearly pushes this approach. My reservation with this approach is the lack of long term data, i.e. what's the sense in remising the type 2 diabetes only to promote reproduction cancers - a holistic thought if you like. Personally, I think the most logical approach that has the most evidence is around a diet that focuses predominately on unprocessed or minimally processed plant based foods, that doesn't say vegetarian or vegan, nor does it say 'high carb' - the importance of detail here can not be overstated. Ultimately it depends on your own health goals I think - and what works for you.
 

Barry Holt

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Why anyone would want to engage in this with an obvious troll is beyond me.

If you ignore it, it'll get bored and will find another forum to annoy.
Hope that's very soon,these people just want to wind people up
 
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13lizanne

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Or sell them something @Barry Holt either products or ideas or more often, both. Y
 
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Barry Holt

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I'm buying neither perhaps Admin will be along to shut him down,all these people hide behind the cloak of tech.just like all these kids being abused owner the Internet,hopefully we are too long in the tooth to be fooled
 

intelligenteating

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It sounds like this forum gets trolled a lot - most popular ones do.

Now we have a divergence of data... The list of countries and incidence of overall diabetic incidence that was copy/pasted isn't consistent with the Wiley link... And that's from two people who appear to post moderately on here.

So who's right? This is the problem with studies....

PEDI_280_f2.gif


@13lizanne - you keep banging on about it, do you want to buy something? I have nothing to sell, but I have an amazon affiliate account, you can update your bookmark to that if you like .... :p
 

intelligenteating

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I'm buying neither perhaps Admin will be along to shut him down,all these people hide behind the cloak of tech.just like all these kids being abused owner the Internet,hopefully we are too long in the tooth to be fooled

Barry, is everything ok? I have given my contact details - if you need to talk, feel free.
 

13lizanne

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On this forum we are asked not to be personally abusive
 
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