Remission vs Reversal

[britishpub]

How about additional life insurance? You even get a free pen just for applying and a welcome gift when you've paid your first payment....don't forget.

Thank you I will remember.

Fortunately I am neither old enough nor uninformed enough to fall for those adverts.

 

[DaveNN]

Thank you I will remember.

Fortunately I am neither old enough nor uninformed enough to fall for those adverts.

...yet.....

If that doesn't grab you, the smart cash back will.

 

[britishpub]

@EdMac I agree 100%. The last thing the newly diagnosed need to be told is that they will always be Diabetic and that the disease is progressive and they can only get worse and have further complications.

The message that it is possible to control, improve and potentially reverse the condition should be the story that is told.

 

[britishpub]

...yet.....

If that doesn't grab you, the smart cash back will.

It might be a good idea to give up now.

I'm not sure you are adding anything particularly constructive to the thread mate.

 

[DaveNN]

Ironically myself and my partner said the same thing this afternoon.
What deems a recovered alcoholic no longer an alcoholic?
We came to the conclusion the will to drink would have to be no longer a driving force for the addiction.
So we also concluded the body would have to not cause high sugar levels when eating like a non-diabetic?

That's the way I see it.
Both conditions if cured/in remission could quite possibly be upended within minutes though.
That said, and as noted previously, I would be interested to see the circumstance required for a 'cured' diabetic to become diabetic again.
Is it just excess carbs,excess body fat etc?

 

[DaveNN]

It might be a good idea to give up now.

I'm not sure you are adding anything particularly constructive to the thread mate.

Chill...

 

[ickihun]

That's the way I see it.
Both conditions if cured/in remission could quite possibly be upended within minutes though.
That said, and as noted previously, I would be interested to see the circumstance required for a 'cured' diabetic to become diabetic again.
Is it just excess carbs,excess body fat etc?

For me it was shock and stress which led to more carbs, more meds more shock and stress. On top of more stress then 2 pregnancies and more stress. Hence insulin and a little depression.
That's life!

 

[DaveNN]

For me it was shock and stress which led to more carbs, more meds more shock and stress. On top of more stress then 2 pregnancies and more stress. Hence insulin and a little depression.
That's life!

Stress is often cited and may have helped to screw many of us TBH.
BUT how can we legitimately measure and then control that?

 

[ickihun]

Stress is often cited and may have helped to screw many of us TBH.
BUT how can we legitimately measure and then control that?

You just have to use your own coping mechanisms to survive it. It can kill some people. I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. I come across ok but my body takes the strain. I don't drink or smoke so I have used carbs as my crutch in the past. Not anymore. I use protein rich foods instead. Well on the odd occasion.

 

[catherinecherub]

Do people need to squabble over semantics?
Call it what you like as there will always be different views as to what it means and I cannot see the sense of getting into a heated debate.

If an alcoholic abstains from drink he/she is then a recovering alcoholic. We could be called recovering diabetics?

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

If you consider yourself cured, then you're cured.
If you consider your diabetes in remission, then it's in remission.
If you consider your diabetes reversed, then it's reversed.
If you consider yourself to be a well controlled type 2 diabetic, then you are a well controlled type 2 diabetic.

The only way I could discover if I really have no more insulin resistance would be to eat carbs for a few weeks until my physiological insulin resistance due to a zero carb diet should have gone away and see what my blood glucose levels are like. I have no intention of ever doing that, so I'll never know. Perhaps low carb (or zero carb) is just an end run around type 2 diabetes, but that's good enough for me. Personally, I don't consider the "healthy plate" or the typical western diet to be healthy for anyone in the long run, regardless of blood glucose levels. In other words, just because a person has non-diabetic blood glucose levels doesn't mean they are healthy. So I will not be going back to that way of eating even if I could with respect to my blood glucose levels.

 

[NoCrbs4Me]

It's a shame to write a discussion off as a squabble. If you don't see the point of it perhaps it means the point just isn't important to you not that there is no point.

Imagine two people break a leg. They both get medical advice.

Patient 1: Your leg was broken. There is a process to heal your injury. You can wear a cast for 8 weeks. During this time you must not put any weight on your healing leg. At the end of 8 weeks you will be given a two month programme of stretching and muscle building exercises. By the end of this process your leg will be as good as new.

Patient 2: Your leg was broken. Over time the bones will knit together. With diligent management of your injury you will gain good function in the leg. You will be able to walk, climb stairs and enjoy pain free mobility. But you must never move too quickly let alone run as your leg will always be a potential problem just waiting to happen.

I don't understand your analogy.

 

[catherinecherub]

I wrote my post in the hope that people would agree to differ. The thread does not seem to be going anywhere, just a few people arguing about semantics.
If you are unhappy with my attempt at trying to keep the peace, rather than close the thread, then please discuss via PM as per forum rules.

 

[britishpub]

If you consider yourself cured, then you're cured.
If you consider your diabetes in remission, then it's in remission.
If you consider your diabetes reversed, then it's reversed.
If you consider yourself to be a well controlled type 2 diabetic, then you are a well controlled type 2 diabetic.

.

Succinct and to the point as usual.

Arguing over what each individual means when they use those words to describe their own individual circumstances only potentially causes more confusion.

 

[Southbeds]

I wrote my post in the hope that people would agree to differ. The thread does not seem to be going anywhere, just a few people arguing about semantics.
If you are unhappy with my attempt at trying to keep the peace, rather than close the thread, then please discuss via PM as per forum rules.

Thanks

 

[ickihun]

I thought the thread was started to debate with personal experience what we thought was happening to the future of managing type 2 diabetes. Progression.
Afterall the forum is for everyone not just newbies.
Yes newbies need clarity but as a regular I feel I need to still gleem experience from posters who are long term managers. With the option of hope for the future, going forward.
Healthy debate is always helpful. I feel.

 

[DaveNN]

I wrote my post in the hope that people would agree to differ. The thread does not seem to be going anywhere, just a few people arguing about semantics.
If you are unhappy with my attempt at trying to keep the peace, rather than close the thread, then please discuss via PM as per forum rules.

Agreed. However, it does show how emotive the subject is...afterall it effects us all one way or another. My approach is too deliberately divert or lighten the conversation and perhaps it may well meander back on course. As noted above, the definition ( like the condition) is in the eye of the beholder and no matter how much some may try and push their point of view- resistance will naturally occur.

 

[DaveNN]

Deleted by Moderator as it is not a decision that this poster can make.

 

[muzza3]

I'm not sure if you are deliberately misunderstanding, or are you unable to follow an argument ?

The minutiae I was very clearly talking about was whether or not we should waste time discussing what these words mean, not whether or not you can be cured of Diabetes or be classed as not having Diabetes by the medical profession.

I have never said, nor do I think that somebody cannot reverse, be cured of, or have their Diabetes enter remission.

How you, or anybody else views their current status is irrelevant to me.

I view my current status as having excellent control over the Diabetes that I still suffer from. It is certainly not cured, nor reversed but probably could be considered in remission.

For your information the DVLA will not penalise me for being a T2D that is not controlled by medication, it will in no way affect my employment and so far has not made any difference to any Insurance product I either held prior to, or have bought since diagnosis.

Hi @britishpub

Sorry I have taken a while to respond but it was late last night and I had to get some kip as I had a full day today. I must confess I feel a little like the boy who chucked a cracker into the fire and ran away.

I was certainly not deliberately misunderstanding but, I will confess that on more than one occasion, I have been told, that I am not following the argument (usually by my Lad at Uni)

On reflection I believe you are correct in my confusing your thoughts on the words with the cure of diabetes and that was careless and I am very sorry for that.

Attention to detail has never been my greatest trait I I will endeavor to take much more care on here in the future

Cheers

 

[britishpub]

Forums are funny places.

You think that as everything is "written down" then it's easy to follow, but we ALL often just skim over a thread and only see select bits.

There is no huge disagreement or argument, and the thread isn't derailed IMHO and should continue if people have more to add.