Newly diagnosed Type 2 & Neuropathic pain?!

[Charliek3]

Hi everyone, my name is Charlie & Yes you have guessed it, I am a Newbie to Type 2 diabetes, although I was feeling terrible for the last 3 years and put it down to an old back injury I had as a kid. I had broken 6 vertebra in my spine at 16 and was told I would have pain with this in later years. Well I am 45 in a few days time and the pain in my back & legs is unbearable now. I have been taking Dihydracodeine 60mg SR & Naproxen 500mg X2 Daily. I also take two 500mg Metformin twice daily which has caused me no problems. I was seen by my Podiatrist about 6 months ago and she mentioned a drug called Pregabalin for my Neuropathic pain. But when I told my GP this he poo pooed the idea of trying this drug. He has said that Metformin alone will take away my back and thigh pain and ease my absolutely freezing feet that are 10 times worse at night time. I am not a new patient when it comes to pain of any kind, having broken many bones in my life time but this pain at night and the freezing feet are chronic now and driving me & my poor wife & kid's insane as they have to listen to my negativity. The deep depression that seems to accompany my pain & Type 2 diabetes is desperate and I just feel like my quality of life is disastrous at the moment.
I have only recently started Metformin ( 3 weeks ), so I do not know whether it is helping me or worsening my pain. I also have pins & needles in my feet and hands at the moment. I am still working away but with such pain and lack of sleep caused by pain, I am too often thinking dark & negative emotions. My Podiatrist suggested my back pain & leg pain could be from my old injury but said she would inform my GP about a drug called Pregabalin. Anyhow I really sympathize with anyone carrying pain like I do and it appears there are many of us on here.
Does anyone else here have this kind of pain where your feet are on fire & freezing all at the same time. Sometimes I think I am going Nuts LOL...Has anyone here ever got complete pain relief from only Metformin or should I push my GP for Pregabalin & Amitryptiline...I am far too young to be feeling so low ( 45 years old ). Anyhow thank you in advance for listening to my rant here and Please Please Anyone with any ideas on helping me ease Neuropathic pain please leave a message or post for me here. I know I left it too l,ong to visit my GP and get my Type 2 diagnosis but surely to God there has to be a drug to touch this kind of Pain...Oh and by the way the dihydracodeine, ( DHS Continus ), I take doesn't even touch this kind of pain and discomfort and it is a pretty strong Opioid painkiller. Maybe Opioids are the wrong analgesic for this kind of pain. Thanks again for listening to my rant & Good Luck with your fight against Diabetes.

 

[Alzebra]

Hi Charliek3, welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear about your pain problems, sounds nasty. I have nerve damage in my leg caused by an accident not my diabetes and I've tried all sorts of painkillers for it: gabapentin, pregabalin, amitriptiline and carbamazepine. I'm currently trying to get by using lidocaine patches that I wear over the site of the injury.
Have you been referred to a pain management specialist at all? I found mine really useful, he tried lots of different things with me before I had to settle with the patches because of side effects to medication.
Getting your blood sugar levels under control could reduce some of your pain, I'm tagging @daisy1 for her newbie guide to Type 2. Changing to a Low Carb diet has had a life-changing impact on me, is that something you could try?

 

[daisy1]

@Charliek3

Hello and welcome to the forum As mentioned above, reducing your sugar levels could help you. Have you tried reducing the carbs in your diet? Here is the information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask more questions and someone will be able to help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you’ll find over 150,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

Another option is to replace ‘white carbohydrates’ (such as white bread, white rice, white flour etc) with whole grain varieties. The idea behind having whole grain varieties is that the carbohydrates get broken down slower than the white varieties –and these are said to have a lower glycaemic index.
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/food/diabetes-and-whole-grains.html

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes

LOW CARB PROGRAM:
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/low carb program


Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to bloodglucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.

 

[joe-90]

I think you need a CT scan of your back to see if any nerves are trapping. My partner had one and a back operation recently (very successful too). I too get the hot/cold feet thing and usually sleep with a type of Bootie on that I got from IKEA. The odd thing is, that if I use an electric blanket to warm my legs up - it causes my feet to hurt much more. So, I would say you need to isolate your back injury from your diabetes. I had a broken back too (vertebra removed), and doubt that any drug will relieve that sort of pain.

 

[Mike d]

I would seek a second (and third) opinion ..... BTW, are you carrying excess weight? Statins?

Thanks for the post as I feel for you with all that going on. Stay strong

Mike

 

[Charliek3]

Hi Charliek3, welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear about your pain problems, sounds nasty. I have nerve damage in my leg caused by an accident not my diabetes and I've tried all sorts of painkillers for it: gabapentin, pregabalin, amitriptiline and carbamazepine. I'm currently trying to get by using lidocaine patches that I wear over the site of the injury.
Have you been referred to a pain management specialist at all? I found mine really useful, he tried lots of different things with me before I had to settle with the patches because of side effects to medication.
Getting your blood sugar levels under control could reduce some of your pain, I'm tagging @daisy1 for her newbie guide to Type 2. Changing to a Low Carb diet has had a life-changing impact on me, is that something you could try?

God Love you Alzebra, suffering that kind of pain. It seems like you have been through the Mill regarding Pain meds. I have not been referred yet to a Pain Specialist although I have an appointment with my GP next week. He has just started in our Surgery and looks as old as my son lol...Just a sign that time is moving forward LOL...He has been really helpful so far but he just suggested Metformin to try and get my BG down to a much lower count. I actually had begun getting a Yeast infection in my left Groin & the meds he gave me have wiped that out very quickly, Thank God. I am a fool for not visiting him earlier...I realise that now & my **** taxi mans diet was atrocious as you can imagine...just eating on the run etc etc...
My back pain is chronic at the minute & we are not sure if it's Neuropathic or the old injury. To me it feels different from any pain I had before. The Freezing feet is also a new thing for me...along with restless legs...I am going to take your advice on board and start a Low Carb diet...That is Great that it is working for you & this Forum is a Well of Wisdom for the likes of me. So many ways to look at this problem. Knowledge is Power & there are many Knowledgeable men & women here. Cheers for answering my first post & I will bring these meds up with my GP and maybe ask him to refer me to the Pain Clinic in the City Hospital in Belfast. My wife attends there every 4 months and swears by the treatment she receives there. She is on a very high dose of that Carbamazepine, ( Tegratol ), for a terrible affliction called Trigeminal Neuralgia where a nerve goes haywire on her face for hours and days at a time. Thanks again XX

 

[Charliek3]

I would seek a second (and third) opinion ..... BTW, are you carrying excess weight? Statins?

Thanks for the post as I feel for you with all that going on. Stay strong

Mike

I have lost almost 3 stone Mike over the past year & a half...I am 5'8" & 14 stone now. Yes I have been given another Statin called Simvastatin after I almost died on Atorvastatin!! I swear that drug almost finished me off. Half an hour after taking it before bed time I would be gushing sweat from my head and back. My wife couldn't believe the shape I was in. I had taken a heart scare a year ago and was admitted to Cardiology for 3 nights. I actually failed the treadmill by 30 seconds. I had bad chest pain before the admission and it took me 3 days to go to hospital. When the bloods were done some kind of protein was found which suggested a small Heart Attack. I was put on Simvastatin then and felt fine when I got home. My next visit to my GP I was put on Atorvastatin and told I was prediabetic & that Statin would be the one to suit me. My God man it almost finished me...I was on it for maybe 9 months but after Googling it & hearing the horror stories I stopped taking it myself. I genuinely believe that Atorvastatin did me muscle damage and caused the darkest depression imaginable. I literally lost the will to live, I had pain almost everywhere and the sweating was terrible...I'm not joking when I say the bed was soaking in 10 minutes from my back & head.

I spent the past year lying on our two seater settee in the living room where I got some relief from my back pain but at this time more importantly my feet were killing me. They were constantly freezing so I arranged the settee to have my feet hanging over the edge in front of the fire...that helped a bit also. My wife has put up with a man that is still not functioning right to this day. I am already on Dihydracodeine 60mg X2 daily for pain but it has got to the point where that pain killer no longer works!! I have been on that for 10 years now and I am dreading coming off it because of it's addictive qualities. It absolutely did help me when I was first put on it. I stopped drinking 10 years ago also very easily and haven't taken any alcohol since. I just have a bad feeling that Atorvastatin did me some kind of damage. I feel weak and useless. Sex life is gone although I have a wife that is truly supportive but this is an area where things can go very wrong. I'm just hoping that the Metformin & Simvastatin will bring back some kind of decent life. Or maybe that Statin is not good either. I have only started taking it again...about a month now so I don't know if it is working well for me.
What do you think about the Statins Mike?? Atorvastatin is definitely a drug that would have finished me if I kept taking it. When I went into the Nurse to get Bloods done she asked me was I on any Statin and when I said No I stopped taking the Atorvastatin myself months ago she answered..." Oh are you another man that suffered muscle damage on it?? She kind of let the Cat out of the bag and I noticed her worried face when she said that. My first visit with this young GP was OK but he spoke so quickly I missed the half of what he was saying. He didn't even explain my results to me. He just said Oh you need to be on this Metformin and it will extend your life by 20 years!! I also think he said my Bloods were at 63??! But I don't even know if that was Blood Glucose or my Cholesterol...Many questions I have for next weeks appointment. It is time I took my health seriously. I ate & ran during work for years now...chasing the £'s hasn't been worth it LOL...Thanks for your reply man and I wish you well on this old journey we're on.

 

[Alzebra]

Ooooh, I've read about trigeminal neuralgia, it sounds horrendous. I think pain is easier to bear the further it is from your central nervous system - I can sort of distance myself from my leg pain, imagining a barrier at the knee. Pain in your face is impossible to get away from in that way though - I hope the tegretol is helping your wife, it did help my leg but also gave me dangerously high blood pressure so I had to stop taking it!

 

[Charliek3]

Ooooh, I've read about trigeminal neuralgia, it sounds horrendous. I think pain is easier to bear the further it is from your central nervous system - I can sort of distance myself from my leg pain, imagining a barrier at the knee. Pain in your face is impossible to get away from in that way though - I hope the tegretol is helping your wife, it did help my leg but also gave me dangerously high blood pressure so I had to stop taking it!

They have upped her Tegretol to 600mg morning & 4 at night!! High dose now and Neurologist told us on Monday that she can go up to something as high as 1600mg at a time! It is a good drug for that kind of pain alright and Paula, my wife, has had alot of trouble with the central nervous system...Pineal Gland Cyst in her Brain and the investigations over the past 10 years have been horrendous. She has had her strength taken from her and I often wonder how she gets by but she's an extraordinary girl that never gives up. I am in awe at times when I hear the Consultants explaining her pain levels...I guess that some of us are to go through that kind of pain & my own troubles are nothing compared with some other folk.
I took one of her Pregabalin 300mg one night and was completely out of my tree but man did I get a good nights sleep and no hangover LOL...That was too strong a dose for me but I am going to mention it to my GP & maybe get a lower dose. I was starving the next morning and apparently it can cause people to eat like a horse LOL...My eating habits are atrocious and maybe that could help me regulate my meals better.
How to you manage your leg pain now then Alzebra? Do you suffer anything with your feet and if so is there anything can be done for the lose of feeling, pins & needles that could drive me Nuts at times. My lower legs ( shins ), get a crazy kind of itch and if I begin scratching I could tear them open. I use Dipro Base & a spray bottle of Vaseline that I think is absolutely brilliant. After a shower or bath I drown myself in those creams LOL...But seriously I know I am just ranting here to get it outta my system but I am truly Happy to know that this forum exists and there are people like yourself that have been coping much longer than me. The Tegretol/ Carbamazapine you were on is a serious drug alright. Paula has always had Low Blood Pressure but I will make sure she checks her BP on & off now as she did have a particularly bad headache earlier & felt kind of spaced...but that has always been a problem. I have been a wee rascal and ranted more than I thought I would LOL...Good Luck Alzebra...I am honored to havce you as a Cyber Friend on this forum. X

 

[sandra curtis]

Hello Charliek3 I sympathise with you having the severe pain and pins and needles like you?I was eventually sent to see a pain consultant at my local hospital.I had many analgesics but have settles with M.S.D. slow release morphine 60 mgms. X 2 daily.Under the conditions that we are being treated for I am reassured that they aren't addictive.! The dose is determined by the patient.My doctor gave me 20 X 10 mgms. tablets and I slowly increased the dose until I was pain free.and Pregabalin 200mgms. X 3 daily. This was increased from 100mgms, X 3 daily. I am now virtually pain free but I have burning feet that are cold to touch most of the year.The tingling sensations are mostly still there but are tolerable now the pain has gone. Pregabalin is reasonably expensive so maybe your G.P. is not prescribing them under those conditions.M.S.D. Morphine is relatively very cheap. If you are travelling abroad especially to the States you must apply to the home office to get a certificate stating you are on morphine as most States don't allow you to take large amounts of morphine.This is a formality only and most G.P..s aren't aware of this' Otherwise just take your N.H.S. Prescription in case you are stopped by customs ..I have travelled lots and nothing has ever been questioned. You have to let the D.V.L.A. know you are taking metformin and M.S.D. morphine.tablets but again this is only a formality.If you haven't already it's best you read up on driving while under certain medications. It's crazy but you will have to be testing you blood sugar if you drive as you must follow the D.V.L.A. rules but Metformin won't lower your blood sugar.If you are prescribed insulin then you must by law inform the D.V.L.A. Don't worry this is again a formality. Why don't you ask to be referred to a pain specialist at your local hospital. Metformin isn't an analgesic it sounds as if your G.P. Is trying to pull the wool over your eyes.!!! I hope you can get things sorted quickly. Let us know how you get on.Its sometimes needed to keep going to your GP. To get things sorted.

 

[Mike d]

What do you think about the Statins Mike??

Hi @Charliek3 ... there are people that can tolerate them and people who cannot. I fall into category 2.by a long margin.

I will never take them again and all my side effects taking that dreaded stuff have cleared up. I'm either damned unlucky with what they did to me, or damned lucky I knew very early on what they were doing to my system.

Had a stand up brawl with the doctor about it and eventually he listened .... after all, he couldn't shove one down my throat.

Will never go near them again, but I repeat, do some research and make up your own mind. Good luck, but you're going thru some issues and if it were me, go see someone else. I happen to disagree with some of his opinions but won't address that here as I'm not qualified. Suffice it to say that if Metformin can do what he claims, millions would be on it.

Mike

 

[PatsyB]

I used to take statins and decided to stop them.... after a while I went back on them and my blood klevels went high so am off them again and still not informed the Doctor as not been to see him yet

 

[Alzebra]

@Charliek3 I'm always glad to meet people who I have something in common with, but you my friend are getting a bit spooky I posted this thread almost a year ago about my itchy legs!!! http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/itchy-rash-on-legs.77868/ Eventually the rash cleared up as my blood sugar levels came down and, touch wood, it hasn't resurfaced this year. I wonder if the warmer weather will bring it back?
The only thing I use for my nerve pain now are lidocaine patches which numb the area, and also reduce the burning sensation across the top of my foot. As I got my sugars and weight down I've been able to walk more and I think the exercise helps, even though it was very painful to begin with - 3 years ago when I first injured it I spent 6 months having to use a walking stick.
Your lovely Paula sounds awesome, coping with all that pain, but I imagine that makes you feel a little guilty if you need to let off steam yourself? All the better that you've found our forum, we're here to help and support you both!

 

[Charliek3]

I am feeling optimistic Alzebra the more I read of your past & present post LOL >.< I guess I am going through a very similar awakening to the nitty gritty bits of Diabetes & the painful or itchy parts that go along with it. I genuinely feel I can beat this back to a manageable form cuz I refuse to believe this is it till I pick my Pine Overcoat LOL...The Drugs like Metformin, were annoying the first week but I seem to be coping fine now with them.
Yes maybe I do feel a little guilty about Crowing about my little aches & pains as Paula is one of those exceptionally ill people that is silent and bears the pain quietly. Truly shocking to see a woman or indeed any other human being having to go through what she does. Life can be so cruel at times and unfair, & what I have witnessed on the Neurology Ward & ICU has been horrendous and yet some our best friend's we have made on that Ward. Humor is definitely something that people in pain seem exceptional at. I am just so glad I have met you all on this forum also as the disease seems to follow very similar paths, well the Type 2 at least. It's just the numbers and abbreviations that I need to work out and my young GP is gonna have his brain picked this week for everything I need to learn. It was all a bit of a rush when I was given the drugs & cream and I missed my meeting with the Diabetic Clinic, the Nurse etc & Diet discussion through work, but I intend keeping everyone of my appointments from here on in. Cheers & I see you are destroying Diabetes on your journey...Good for You...

 

[Charliek3]

Hi @Charliek3 ... there are people that can tolerate them and people who cannot. I fall into category 2.by a long margin.

I will never take them again and all my side effects taking that dreaded stuff have cleared up. I'm either damned unlucky with what they did to me, or damned lucky I knew very early on what they were doing to my system.

Had a stand up brawl with the doctor about it and eventually he listened .... after all, he couldn't shove one down my throat.

Will never go near them again, but I repeat, do some research and make up your own mind. Good luck, but you're going thru some issues and if it were me, go see someone else. I happen to disagree with some of his opinions but won't address that here as I'm not qualified. Suffice it to say that if Metformin can do what he claims, millions would be on it.

Mike

Jesus Mike you seem to have been through the Mill...the Mill where I find myself at the moment. I am definitely with you that some people DO NOT TOLERATE them & I'm beginning to believe I fall into that Cat along with you. Man the time I went through on Atorvastatin was the worst year of my life and I could kick myself for allowing my Doc to fool me when I would normally call myself a pretty intelligent man. I stopped them after 9 months but I can tell you I haven't recovered from them entirely. Nasty things that really I should have come off long before I did.
My old Doc was a Type 1 and a fantastic man when it came to pain relief for my back problems but alas he has retired now and I am really up against a Surgery that appear to be squeezing everyone to come off medications that they very obviously need. Is it that we are all being pushed by a Government policy that intends doing away with our National Health?! That is exactly what I believe and even though drugs like Pregabalin are now past the 3 year period before Generics can & are being offered, we are not being offered these as Neuropathic pain relief simply because our Surgeries are trying to save every penny they can. Not good enough I say. I am not a Pill Popper by any stretch of the imagination & if I were my wife has a medication bag stuffed with these kinds of drugs & I could medicate myself if I chose. I want to be able to have my Surgery sort my own medical issues out without breaking the Law and trying to self medicate. There are literally days, mostly nights though that I could chop my lower legs and feet off. Even when I was explaining this to the young Doctor I now have he just kept saying how important it was I saw him again and that the Metformin & Simvastatin would bring my BG down and I would have relief from all the Pain, Cold Feet & Chronic back and leg pain...Jesus I didn't even get telling him about the Pins & Needles and lose of feeling as I was afraid he would ask for my licence...I'm a Cabby and the Law is pretty strict regarding Meds etc. Yet I feel I have no choice but to tell the DVLA that I am not even sure myself whether I should be publically operating a Taxi with my medical condition at the moment.
I apologize for another Rant here yet again people...I will indeed seek another opinion Mike, after this weeks meeting with my new Doc. I have the feeling that he is a little nervous to push the boat out yet or maybe that he isn't even in full time with the Surgery yet but whatever the reason it is not enough to simply put me on 1,000mg of Metformin night & day & Simvastatin 40mg at night and leave me like that. I have checked both of these drugs now and can see they offer no help with any of my pain or skin problems...in fact I think the Metformin has me tearing myself to shreds with the itching all over my body at the moment. We will see how this coming week finds me...Good Luck....& thanks Mike for your answer to me...I feel you are spot on with what has happened to me and that you have traveled the road ahead of me. Your opinion is greatfully received as is everyone I have spoken to on this Forum. It is also Shocking to me that there is another entirely different world happening at the same time from when we we were all healthy...We have to be kept informed fairly & squarely by the Medical Professionals and money should never come into it. Cheers All X

 

[Mike d]

Jesus Mike you seem to have been through the Mill...

Hi @Charliek3 ... no, nothing like you and that sweet wife of yours is enduring. She sounds like one good lady It's OK now as the neck pain, the finger trembling, the sweats and the chest pains have gone. Took 12 months to dissipate and a lot of analysis on my part to work out what drug (be it blood pressure, statins or Metformin and not in that order) could be causing it. So one by one, I eliminated them all with good figures and exercise and diet. I'm not one to sit idly by and accept a doctor's opinion given what I know now.

Keep pushing that as hard as you can. It's hard to divorce your previous issues (Broken Bones / Verterbra) from T2 though I do suspect some strong links insofar as the pain is concerned.

They really do need to tell you what their expectations are regarding Metformin in dropping your BS. Unless I have missed it, what is your diet by meal? THAT is foremost in my mind as tight control is far better than a drug with what I consider has minimal effect.

Good luck and please come back as we'll be interested in the developments. Ridiculous you're going thru this

Mike

PS ... Do you test your blood sugars? I should have said that as it's a very important factor along with diet control