Why can't hospitals understand diet and diabetes?

[lesleyr284]

Hi
Just been in for a day op, (which had to be cancelled due to a sinus infection!), and obviously mentioned being T2 (diet no meds). She took a quick blood reading (7 - oops, bit high, but I'm a sucker for that dawn phenomenon) at half 8 this morning. Fasting and knew it would be at least five hours before I'd be done (got to drink some water) so they wanted to book a meal for me for after op. My jaw hit the floor - it would be choice of sandwich (white bread only), crisps, OJ, banana and biscuits. I looked the nurse straight in the eye and said, 'oh great, a diabetics nightmare!'. she was confused and asked me what I couldn't eat....er everything. The only item she thought might be a problem was the crisps and suggested she swap them for a pack of digestives (plain ones, no chocolate as if this made a whopping difference).
I got a packet of biscuits and a cup of tea before being packed off on my way. This year I embark on my five year mission to become a qualified dietician - even if I'm the oldest student at the university. We can't self test because it causes stress or despression or the PCT too much, and the whole country is being threatened with diabetes if we don't change our ways BUT when we're in the hands of the good old NHS they can't even get something as basic as food right.
I remember this from when I was having my daughter. I was in for a few days and demamded that the hospital provide me a meal that was suitable for a diabetic. Eventually I got my husband to bring food in after I got an overcooked piece of plain white fish and a lump of mashed potatoe (no veg).
If nursing staff think biscuits are a good alternative for bread then what hope is there? And how is that box of goodies I was offered even vaguely healthy to anyone, diabetic or otherwise? My kids would not be allowed to take that to school so why is it offered to people in hospital?
I've gone on far more than I intended!

 

[ally5555]

ahh the frustrations of hospital catering !!

The nurses have no training or very little , and some hospitals have no dietetic input into the menus.Ah the battles I have had with caterers and nurses whilst a hospital dietitian!

One of the problems with hopsital catering is that you also have to build into menus that people are ill and may fancy things that may not be healthy but offering diabetics white bread AHHHHHHH!

So you are planning to become one - where are you going to train. I occ do some teaching on dietetics degrees and also nutrition degrees.

 

[lesleyr284]

I am enrolling on a certificate course this sept (in lieu of not having biology or chemisty A levels) and hope to go to Surrey Uni the following year as it's not far from where I live. Being over 40 (cough cough), I am a little nervous about it, but since becomming diabetic I've increasingly become more and more interested in diet/nutrition, not to mention a little disillusioned with current advice and my own experience.
Hospital catering is just simply appaling. I've always thought so, diabetic or not. It's horrifying. My nurse today (Anne) was lovely and we ended up having quite a chat about it. They seem happy to teach them all about the new malfunctioning computer system (which lost my records) but not things that I consider fundamental (like how to feed diabetics).

 

[ally5555]

it doesnt change then!!

You may be suprised that you will not be the only mature student - mature now means over 23 by the way!
TBH I think mature students make better dietitians - some of the younger ones can be quite cocky and want to be the head of dept in a year!

Surrey is a good uni but all the dietetics degrees are approved by the health prof Council any way.

Good luck tho it is a great profession - I love my job.

 

[jopar]

And what was wrong with what they offered, apart from not complying with what you’ve determined that diabetics should eat? I’m also a diabetic and would not have any problems with what they offered...
I don’t believe in a specialist diabetic diet, an healthy diet yes, but I have no wish to be tagged by my diabetes, having my basic rights of choosing what foods/diet taken off me, to be replaced by some muppet who has deemed that only certain foods are allowed... More so if the muppet is taking advices from a very small section of the diabetic community to what they want...
There isn’t a need to created a specialist diabetic diet, however there is a need when menu designing that there are enough options and detail on the menu so that the individual can mix and match to suit their individual tastes and requirements of their personal chosen diet plan...
Believe me, I have been subjected to weeks of hospitalisation when as a diabetic patient I lost the control of what I could eat, this was determined by the hospital kitchen, which sent it on the main food trolley, dished in separate containers/bags with my name written on it. Many meals times the I ate dishes completely different from the other patients, because they hadn’t been given my dish as an option on their menu...Total humiliation and soul destroying that anybody walking onto the ward at meal time, could indentify me as a diabetic purely by what I was eating... I have no wish to return to these days at all, if I have to have another hospital stay...
Visiting my father last week while he was in hospital, I did look at their menu, and I must say I was impressed with what was on offer, plenty of choice pretty well detailed, and would suit most dietary requirements and taste... Being a cottage hospital food is freshly cooked on site and has a good reputation of being of a lot higher standard than the main hospital.

 

[ally5555]

Hi jo - how are u?

Does make a difference if the food is served individually - like the old days.

allyx

 

[Romola]

I have given husband instructions to bring me suitable food if I am an in-patient in the future, eg oatcakes, nuts, dried fruit - all of which can be stored in a locker easily.

However, I don't think any great harm would come of eating the occasional white bread sandwich - the glycemic load of white versus wholemeal bread is not very much - and it is the amount eaten that would be important.

Unless the hospital stay is for longer than a few days, I'm not sure I would make too much of a fuss about the food. I would eat what I wanted, leave XC starchy carbs, and make use of my snacks if required. The trick with a sandwich is to eat just half of the bread. If that leaves you hungry later on - have a snack to make up.

 

[catherinecherub]

Nurses don't spend years doing their training, ( three years for me) and they cannot be expected to know everything about all conditions and diseases. I am a psychiatric nurse and spent 12 weeks on general wards during my training. That does not make me an expert on a lot of subjects including diabetes. One day on food that you do not consider suitable is not going to make that much difference and as Romola says, be prepared and take some snacks that you consider suitable.

If you had been on an Endo ward then you would have cause for concern but to date these don't exist.

Someone, somewhere, is compiling these menus and they are not getting the flack, perhaps you could address your complaint in a letter?

 

[Synonym]

Last time as an in-patient (pre diabetes diagnosis) was a nightmare for me in spite of the fact that the hospital dietician was really on the ball and was absolutely brilliant. The problem is that by the time the food got to me some dough ball in the food production chain decided that they knew better and changed everything! :roll: One day I received one potato on a large plate!

Food is important as a patient, especially when you are a long way from home and visitors are thin on the ground so that your private supplies don’t get replenished.

It is worth remembering that hospital staff are Joe Public when they are shopping. As for eating what others think is alright for you just take a look in the supermarket trolleys as they go through the checkouts and you could easily lose the will to live! :shock:

 

[suzi]

I grabbed a gluten free loaf from the freezer at 5am on Dec 30th prior to our dash to hospital, thank god i did. Andrew had DKA, from vomiting and diarrhoea. By the time he was feeling better it was lunchtime, menu consisted of sausages, fish fingers, sandwiches on kids ward, Andrew couldn't eat any of them. So had GF toast, whilst i went to the canteen and paid! for a ham salad (he snacked on fruit and crisps the remainder of his stay) They only specialised in low sodium and cholestral diets!! Why not diabetic and Coeliac diets also? They were fantastic in every other respect. Next time i'll be better prepared.
Suzi x

 

[Romola]

Coeliac should certainly be catered for. I hope you will let them know that it is essential.

 

[ally5555]

Of course they should be - but communication is not always as it should be - the caterers have to know they are on a ward!

 

[ham79]

hospital food every time I've been in has been inedible and I'm not being picky as an ex chef but they could try making it taste and look like food it's just steamed to death.

 

[chris_h]

Nurses don't spend years doing their training, ( three years for me) and they cannot be expected to know everything about all conditions and diseases. I am a psychiatric nurse and spent 12 weeks on general wards during my training. That does not make me an expert on a lot of subjects including diabetes. One day on food that you do not consider suitable is not going to make that much difference and as Romola says, be prepared and take some snacks that you consider suitable.

If you had been on an Endo ward then you would have cause for concern but to date these don't exist.

Someone, somewhere, is compiling these menus and they are not getting the flack, perhaps you could address your complaint in a letter?

Endo wards do exist I was in one, but in the most crappiest of hospitals, they still got it wrong and I have vowed never to go there again I was in for a week and never saw an endo Dr, until the last day of my stay. and my sugars were still high, as said in another thread I changed my Hospital and have never looked back, they have a Beta dept second to none and cater for diabetics the best I've seen anywhere. In the canteen you can even get brown bread sandwiches with benecol spread.

 

[Angeldust]

I don't see any problem with that ... what were you expecting honestly?
A sandwich with white bread isn't really going to do you harm .. it's not like you're eating it 3 times a day..

 

[IanS]

... and indeed I have a bacon roll with white crusty bread every day for my morning snack. My HbA1c below says it all.

IanS.

 

[lovinglife]

Understand your frustration at the food you were offered and yes it doesn’t sound a healthy option but I think it needs to be looked at in perspective, - it was a day ward where you would only be eating one snack meal – in the big scheme of things it wasn’t going to do much harm and the meal on this ward will probably be a generic meal unless you had very specific dietary requirements such a celiac etc.

There is as many diabetic diets as there are diabetics! You only have to read this forum to see we all eat differently

EVERYONE in a hospital will have different reasons for eating different things be it choice, likes and dislikes, allergies etc etc – it is impossible to cater for every individual

When I was in hospital for a week last June out of an 8-bedder ward 3 others were T2 all with good control and all ate completely differently (all of us were in for emergencies not related to our diabetes)

The hospital food was fantastic and very good – there was a diabetic choice, which I very much relied on as I was diagnosed with diabetes during that stay, ok it may be not what I would eat normally now but it was still adequate and would be again.

When I did a stint in hospital catering many moons ago they get very little budget to provide 3 meals a day – can’t remember exactly but now I suppose it would equate to about £35 a week – don’t know if it’s the same now – and of course being the NHS whatever the personal knowledge and views of the catering team/dietician/advisors and of course patients they still have to conform to the healthy plate!

As a side note - on the ward I was on we had to sign a waver if friends and family were bringing in food as in the past one old dear had almost killed herself with food poisioning after her daughter had brought her in a prawn sandwich and she didn't eat it until over 12 hours later - had kept it in her locker next to the lovely warm panel heating :roll:

 

[catherinecherub]

Nurses don't spend years doing their training, ( three years for me) and they cannot be expected to know everything about all conditions and diseases. I am a psychiatric nurse and spent 12 weeks on general wards during my training. That does not make me an expert on a lot of subjects including diabetes. One day on food that you do not consider suitable is not going to make that much difference and as Romola says, be prepared and take some snacks that you consider suitable.

If you had been on an Endo ward then you would have cause for concern but to date these don't exist.

Someone, somewhere, is compiling these menus and they are not getting the flack, perhaps you could address your complaint in a letter?

Endo wards do exist I was in one, but in the most crappiest of hospitals, they still got it wrong and I have vowed never to go there again I was in for a week and never saw an endo Dr, until the last day of my stay. and my sugars were still high, as said in another thread I changed my Hospital and have never looked back, they have a Beta dept second to none and cater for diabetics the best I've seen anywhere. In the canteen you can even get brown bread sandwiches with benecol spread.

Hi Chris,
Should have made myself clearer. I meant Endo wards for day surgery.

 

[noblehead]

On the few occasions that I have been in hospital, I've never had a problem with regards to food. Even late on in the evening, when I was worried about going low during the night, they would make me 2 slices of toast, where the other patients got nothing.

Were I to be in for a longer period, well yes I can see that they be a problem with the meals, but as my past experiences have only lasted a few days, I can put up with the food. Last time I was in, my wife brought fruit and sandwiches in to my ward which was a great help.

Hospital food has come a long way in recent years, I think for the better. I think it depends on the hospital, some cook the food on site, others have meals brought in pre-chilled and heated up in trolleys, which I'll admit, isn't ideal. My wife was in the Freeman Hospital a few years back, and the standard of food was very good, she didn't want to come out! :cry:

Regards

Nigel

 

[ally5555]

Being a dietitian I have had a number of years experience with hospital catering and posters are right it does vary. They do have a very limited budget and the figure quoted is right - £35 per week per pt and that is for everything including beverages.

The Better Hospital Food campaign did raise the profile and after a shaky start when the celebrity chefs wanted to introduce some unusual foods has produced standard recipes and some improvement. Nurses will often do extra things like toast but in many wards toasters are now banned because of the number of smoke detectors set off! Some hospitals have tried to ban pts from bringing in food because it is claimed there is a risk of contamination - I feel that is extreme although I can see the risk with some foods!

But things can break down when the kitchen doesnt know someone is on the ward - they would always in my experience have stocks of gluten free braed, low protein bread and other specialist products.

They may try to provide healthy food but it is not really the right place to educate alot of people - if they are ill that would be the last thing they want to hear about. I have often arranged for the catering staff to provide foods for pts that they will eat when ill - can be something as simple as egg and chips!