Dawn phenomenon

[markastin]

Do any other type 1s, suffer from dawn phenomena? I am having unexplainable raises in bg every morning, I have ruled out nocturnal hypoglycaemia and am wondering how I can stop this from happening?

 

[azure]

Hi @markastin

Yes, I have DP. I found a pump sorted mine.

What basal insulin are you on?

 

[markastin]

Lantus! I have 10 units in an evening and it seems to be correct throughout the day! But I can get up at 5.5 and within an hour be at 10. I will go for a pump if need be but would like to try sort it without if I can!

 

[azure]

Lantus! I have 10 units in an evening and it seems to be correct throughout the day! But I can get up at 5.5 and within an hour be at 10. I will go for a pump if need be but would like to try sort it without if I can!

Ah, ok - it rises after you get up? Yes, that's quite common. I get that if I delay breakfast. It's a real pain. If I need to delay breakfast, I either do a tiny bolus without food or I eat a tiny amount of carbs eg a digestive biscuit and bolus for it. Both those things work for me.

 

[GrantGam]

Bolus correction doses, for me around 1-2u each morning.

Another technique that works is for when you have a split basal dose. Not sure if you can with Lantus... Basically instead of taking the basal insulin 12 hours apart, it's taken last thing at night and first thing in the morning. This allows for an overlap of basal insulin during the morning hours which can keep DP at bay.

I have used the staggered basal split dose technique but because I like my long lies too much I now just take 1-2u bolus insulin to compensate for the inevitable BG rise.

Grant

 

[markastin]

Thank you very much for your replies, yes I will do both of these and see what works best. I have considered the bolus thing but I have only just noticed this happening in the last couple of weeks. Knowing that this will definitely happen I can take my bolus with confidence.

 

[therower]

@GrantGam1337 Lantus can be split and as you suggest an overlap can be beneficial at certain times of the day.

 

[noblehead]

But I can get up at 5.5 and within an hour be at 10.

Likewise @markastin

When I fast for a bloods to be taken at my gp surgery I can wake on good numbers but be in double digits with an hour or two if I don't bolus, what I find works is to eat within half an hour of waking as it shuts off the liver dump and therefore can control bg levels much better.

 

[markastin]

@noblehead? Eat within half an hour and bolus a normal dose or bolus a dose taking into account a rising bg? All good fun this diabetes lark lol.

 

[noblehead]

@noblehead? Eat within half an hour and bolus a normal dose or bolus a dose taking into account a rising bg? All good fun this diabetes lark lol.

Either, whatever suits @markastin

I prefer to have breakfast so always eat on waking, I don't usually eat after 6-7pm so always ready for it and enjoy it too.

 

[markastin]

Thank you everybody for this response, it is the first time I have put a question to the forum and I am really impressed.

 

[Ali2003io]

Hi@markstin putting you on a pump should be the best idea; I m pregnant and my diabetic doctor suggest to put me on a pump at least till I ll deliver my baby

And she changed the basal from Lantus to levemir but I m taking quite a lot 32 before bed and 12 into the morning

 

[markastin]

I haven't even seen a diabetic doctor @Ali2003io only nurses! Disgusting really since I was diagnosed last December. Everything I have done I have researched and worked out myself and I haven't been back in hospital yet. Not writing off a pump but would prefer to do it without if I can.

 

[GrantGam]

Hi@markstin putting you on a pump should be the best idea; I m pregnant and my diabetic doctor suggest to put me on a pump at least till I ll deliver my baby

I'm afraid it's not quite as simple as just "putting someone on a pump"... They tend to be reserved for those who are really struggling.

Due to the huge costs surrounding pumps and the strict criteria to be met for eligibility. It would be extremely unlikely for @markastin's to be eligible. Especially because the time since diagnosis is so small and there has been no correspondence with ANY of the diabetes team.

Dawn phenomenon is a complete pain for a lot of us diabetics, but it can be dealt with on MDI. It's just not as simple as on a pump. I'd have a go with the bolus correction first, bearing in mind that 1u rapid acting insulin will lower you around 2-3mmol/L. Once you are scheduled for an appointment with the diabetes team, suggest splitting your Lantus dose and then you can try the overlapping injection approach to see if this helps any.

Good luck and stick at it! There's loads of threads on dawn phenomenon and various techniques to reduce it's impact on your BG. Some funky approaches include a glass of wine before bed and vinegar tablets! The first method is 100x better than pump therapy anyway

Grant

 

[azure]

I haven't even seen a diabetic doctor @Ali2003io only nurses! Disgusting really since I was diagnosed last December. Everything I have done I have researched and worked out myself and I haven't been back in hospital yet. Not writing off a pump but would prefer to do it without if I can.

Push for an appointment @markastin if you don't get one soon. Over the years, I've had to push on occasion. Don't be put off - politely insist you need to see a specialist.