Gross Misconduct after a hypo

IZ THE LEG END

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Hi,

I am type 1.5 controlled by a basal bonus regime.

I went to an awards ceremony earlier this month in London representing my company. There were 10 people including myself at the table.

I have no recollection of the nights events after eating the meal, though I do know I had drank some alcohol the rest of the night I have never forgotten a whole night nor behaved the way it had been described.

I have several statements that say I was loud and stumbling around and that I was assisted off the premises by security. I do not have any recollection of any of this the first thing I remember is waking early morning and my shirt from the evening before being soaked with sweat. I hasten to add no one knew me or my condition at the awards or knew me previously to see this was completely out of character. I have put a case together with notes from my GP and character references in my defence.

Has anyone had similar treatment from their employers? If so, what was the outcome?

Thanks in advance Izzy
 

Snapsy

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I'm afraid I have no similar experience to share, Izzy - but I'm so sorry to hear this. I've seen posts from @AndBreathe in the past giving very helpful advice on employment matters, and I'm sure there are others out there too who could advise.
 
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novorapidboi26

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WOW, this is unfortunate.....

How much did you have to drink?

Did you test your BG levels at any point...?

From the outside looking in it doesn't look good but if you can prove a hypo was involved you should be good....
 
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Juicyj

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Hi @IZ THE LEG END Sorry to hear your story, that must of come as a shock to you. Just curious to ask if your work colleagues knew about your type 1 status ? You say the people at the ceremony didn't know about your status, but did your work colleagues know ? Can you ask them for their support in this knowing of your type 1 status.

- Next point, do you know why you went low this evening, can you review your meter readings and establish a reason, I would want to clarify for my employer in my case, in the event this happened to me, that I knew why I went low, it's a case of giving confidence that this was a 'unique' event.

- Has your employer outlined what the grievance procedure is ?

- I would contact ACAS for support on this, you can speak to an advisor who will help.

Best of luck with this :)
 
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douglas99

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Were your company aware of your condition?
 

IZ THE LEG END

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Firstly, wow thanks for all the prompt messages,

My company are aware of my condition yes, however as I travelled down to London alone and not actually knowing any of the delegates at my table and they were not aware of my condition.

As for reasons, I didn't eat from breakfast until that evening just through travel etc. With the exception of a very small scotch egg and I mean small!!!
 

IZ THE LEG END

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WOW, this is unfortunate.....

How much did you have to drink?

Did you test your BG levels at any point...?

From the outside looking in it doesn't look good but if you can prove a hypo was involved you should be good....

No I didn't take my meter with me to the event and the next thing I remember is waking and finding myself laid on my bed shirt soaked wet through with sweat
 

novorapidboi26

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It would seem that it might be difficult to prove the episode was diabetes related.....

Did anyone assist you with sugar that night,,,,?

I would expect this to have happened as if you had lots of alcohol on board and a hypo ensued there is a good chance a natural rebound from the liver wouldn't have worked and it could have been a lot more serious...

Are you looking at dismissal here or just a warning....
 
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therower

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@IZ THE LEG END . Do you carry any form of information about your person that alerts people to your medical condition?
Personally I have a tattoo, dog tag necklace and cards in wallet.
Why didn't you take your meter? Do you not feel a need to check your BS levels?
Sorry you find yourself in a spot at the moment but diabetes is your problem and if people don't know you're a diabetic having a hypo then sadly you're a drunk who can't hold there alcohol.
 
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azure

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No I didn't take my meter with me to the event and the next thing I remember is waking and finding myself laid on my bed shirt soaked wet through with sweat

How much later was this?

Did you feel low before this and did you have anything to treat that low (if you felt low)?
 
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GrantGam

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Hi,

I am type 1.5 controlled by a basal bonus regime.

I went to an awards ceremony earlier this month in London representing my company. There were 10 people including myself at the table.

I have no recollection of the nights events after eating the meal, though I do know I had drank some alcohol the rest of the night I have never forgotten a whole night nor behaved the way it had been described.

I have several statements that say I was loud and stumbling around and that I was assisted off the premises by security. I do not have any recollection of any of this the first thing I remember is waking early morning and my shirt from the evening before being soaked with sweat. I hasten to add no one knew me or my condition at the awards or knew me previously to see this was completely out of character. I have put a case together with notes from my GP and character references in my defence.

Has anyone had similar treatment from their employers? If so, what was the outcome?

Thanks in advance Izzy
The fact that alcohol was involved may make things more difficult than they would be if you hadn't been drinking. I can appreciate the situation you are in, but not testing your BG and not making your colleagues (who were in your company that evening) aware of your diabetes really won't help you any.

Nonetheless, 'if' you can be certain that you were in a hypoglycemic state and that's what led to your behaviour being how it was - then there is very good reason for your employer to accept you for how you behaved at that time. We're all VERY different when we are hypo...

My biggest concern, for you and your job, is that you appear to have not recorded your BG at all, and as such have no credible evidence to back up your rationale for being how you were. Further, no-one knew you were diabetic, which only makes your case more complex to argue.

As @novorapidboi26 has asked, how much did you have to drink? The definition of 'some alcohol' differs tenfold from person to person, so it's important that you try and find out. If you'd had one or two glasses of wine then you're in a good situation to argue the toss with your employer. If you had drank 12 pints however, then I'm afraid - diabetes or no diabetes - then you're not in a good position at all.

I really wish you the best with this @IZ THE LEG END - and I do hope that the outcome does not result in you losing your job.

In future though, ensure everyone around you knows that you're diabetic and carry your meter and medication on you at all times. Medical ID of sorts is also encouraged. It's very important to test when we're drinking, etc - and the reason for that is to try and avoid situations like the one you are currently in.

All the best pal,
Grant
 
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ickihun

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If they had known would they have been allowed to refuse you alcohol or check your sugars?
I think unless your in danger you would have been expected to manage your health yourself.
Would you have done things differently, in hindsight?

My old company would have allowed me a companion if my health was not good and it was essential I attended.
If you told your company you were happy to represent them and let them down it can be upsetting, for both of you.

I understand the uncomfortable relationship now.

It needs fixing. Reassurance, reassurance and reassurance.
 

DiabeticDadUK

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@IZ THE LEG END . Do you carry any form of information about your person that alerts people to your medical condition?
Personally I have a tattoo, dog tag necklace and cards in wallet.
Why didn't you take your meter? Do you not feel a need to check your BS levels?
Sorry you find yourself in a spot at the moment but diabetes is your problem and if people don't know you're a diabetic having a hypo then sadly you're a drunk who can't hold there alcohol.

I was reading this thread and thinking along the same lines. No food. No BS checks. Alcohol. Recipe for disaster, as harsh as that sounds. I hope the OP gets a positive resolution from their employer.
 

AndBreathe

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Hi,

I am type 1.5 controlled by a basal bonus regime.

I went to an awards ceremony earlier this month in London representing my company. There were 10 people including myself at the table.

I have no recollection of the nights events after eating the meal, though I do know I had drank some alcohol the rest of the night I have never forgotten a whole night nor behaved the way it had been described.

I have several statements that say I was loud and stumbling around and that I was assisted off the premises by security. I do not have any recollection of any of this the first thing I remember is waking early morning and my shirt from the evening before being soaked with sweat. I hasten to add no one knew me or my condition at the awards or knew me previously to see this was completely out of character. I have put a case together with notes from my GP and character references in my defence.

Has anyone had similar treatment from their employers? If so, what was the outcome?

Thanks in advance Izzy

Oh dear. It doesn't sound as if you're in a great place; especially as you have no recollection of the specific period which seems to have been in question.

Without seeing the detail of the case your employer is presenting you with, or their description of the meeting you will be attending, it's hard to make too much comment.

How did the matter come to the attention of your employer? Did someone, from another business, report you or something? If you were the only one from your employer there, I'm just curious

Gross misconduct usually covers a great many issues and areas, but I imagine your employer will be miffed that you were representing them, became incapable of looking after yourself, never mind being "loud and stumbling around" (your words), and as a result may have compromised their reputation.

Have you had the preliminary meeting where a formal decision will be taken whether to proceed to a formal disciplinary would be taken, or is that yet to happen? Do you know who will be hearing your case, and do you know anything of them? I'm not suggesting for an instant you would be able to choose your hearing manager or anything, but it can be helpful to have a bit of a look into them, Once you reach a certain level, it becomes hard to find an appropriate person to hear a case because people tend to know each other, and those who may be available will often try their hardest to get out of it. If you don't fancy the sound of the person hearing your case, you can object and provided it's not on a totally unreasonable basis and employer will try to oblige both parties. They will be mindful of how things could look should anything go as far as an Employment Tribunal.

Others have suggested contacting ACAS, but were I in your shoes, I might choose to contact Diabetes UK, for their advocacy service: https://www.diabetes.org.uk/How_we_help/Helpline/Your-rights/ , especially as you feel your case hinges on the impact of your diabetes. Once you have spoken with DUK, I might be inclined to invest a bit of cash with a lawyer, specialising in employment law. At c£500 an hour + VAT it wouldn't be cheap, but if you really do fear for your job and reputation, it could be money well spent. If you go down that route, make sure you go very well prepared to minimise time spent explaining matters, as every minute you talk costs £10. I can think of more fun ways to spend my hard earned money!

In so many ways, I think your biggest problem is you just don't know what happened. You don't have any meter readings over the relevant period, and by your own admission ate very little in the preceding hours, then consumed alcohol, which is known to impact your expected glucose levels. You don't know how you behaved, and on that basis, it's hard to build a robust defence against allegations.

I think it's easy for every single one of us to know what you should or shouldn't have done in the circumstances, but I bet you have a very clear idea of how you would handle things differently next time.

Personally, when I was attending such functions, or even in-house work functions, I didn't drink. In fact, if the function was local, and I would be going home afterwards, I would even drive, meaning there would be no way I would drink. My view was I could always have a nightcap in my room after the event if I felt I had missed out a bit, but by that stage I usually just wanted to crash out!

I'm sorry if all of that sounds harsh and not incredibly supportive of you, but I'm just feeding back what you are expressing. You have a lot of thinking and planning to do, methinks.
 

Claire007

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It's a tricky one.
On one hand, one might say you only have yourself to blame, empty stomach + alcohol+stress of event = disaster, however in your defence hypo sypmtoms can make you appear intoxiacted.

If someone with a nut allergy knowingly ate a nut roast at a work function then when into anaphylaxis, meaning they couldn't make a presentation could they then be disciplined?

I think you need a lawyer!