Dawn Phenomenon

Lord Midas

Well-Known Member
Messages
148
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Idiots. Morons. Flat Earthers. Religious fanatics. Trump. Bigots. Misogynists. And other assorted bad types.
@Ullrich were you on a low carb diet when you did this? If so did eating the carbs 2 hours before bed impact your ketosis?

I guess I could experiment with this though. I usually have dinner around 6pm. Which would be low carb. Around 8pm I do exercise, which at the moment is 30 mins of yoga. Then bed at 10:30pm.

I could try a sip of orange juice perhaps.
 

Ullrich

Member
Messages
5
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
No I don't use a low carb diet.

It could still be worth a try if you are not eating for 4:30hrs + sleep. I recall reading some advice at the time I was looking for an answer that suggested low GI foods like peanuts or certain green apples could be good before bed as they slowly release a small amount of carbohydrates while you sleep. Oddly enough that didn't really work for me, medium GI 2hrs before sleep matched my insulin curve better, however maybe this could work better for someone on low carb?
 

ickihun

Master
Messages
13,698
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Bullies
@Ullrich were you on a low carb diet when you did this? If so did eating the carbs 2 hours before bed impact your ketosis?

I guess I could experiment with this though. I usually have dinner around 6pm. Which would be low carb. Around 8pm I do exercise, which at the moment is 30 mins of yoga. Then bed at 10:30pm.

I could try a sip of orange juice perhaps.
Many type2s use none carb foods to do their liver block before bed. It improves their fbg levels by 2mmol/l on average. Low carbers only get improvement after 4wks of low carbing, again on average.
Many wake on very similiar to their bedtime test result on low carbing with their liver block.
 

Lord Midas

Well-Known Member
Messages
148
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Idiots. Morons. Flat Earthers. Religious fanatics. Trump. Bigots. Misogynists. And other assorted bad types.
So a little something (cheese, meat) before bed might help?
 

Lord Midas

Well-Known Member
Messages
148
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Idiots. Morons. Flat Earthers. Religious fanatics. Trump. Bigots. Misogynists. And other assorted bad types.
Thanks @ickihun. Saw you posted on another thread about fbg and your liver block recommendations. I'll read over there
 
  • Like
Reactions: ickihun

spook_kate_

Well-Known Member
Messages
650
Type of diabetes
Researcher
Treatment type
Other
It didnt!! My body rejected them as soon as put in. No insulin would get through for up to 15 hours.. didnt matter what corrections were done and boy, did I do a lot!! Nothing worked. Had to try going back to pump with two more different hospitals including a different pump.. 3 hospitalisations before my tertiary care clinic agreed that my body all of a sudden in 2015 started disliking cannulas. Even after gaining two stone from my worst times of being thin did not allow my skin to accept cannulas.
I only drastically lost weight for 12 months from 2015 to 2017 due to other stomach condition. Even with weight before and after nothing persuaded skin to accept.

Also I have large amounts o intolerances and due to this the doc and I had considered a diaport but it was definitely a no as I know from other going ons that my body would definitely not accept a permanent tube in me feeding insulin.. and thats why I didnt go for reconstruction with breast cancer. Even dressings for plasters etc, certain ones are really bad. Ie had a dressing on for last mastectomy and I coukdnt tolerate that. So no options but to wake at 4 am each day currently...
Oh gawd that's tough. So sorry
 

spook_kate_

Well-Known Member
Messages
650
Type of diabetes
Researcher
Treatment type
Other
It's so so frustrating, so interesting to see so many others have it. I only started DP or became aware of it about 2-3 yrs ago. I found after low carbing for 3 weeks I woke up with great results. Then I didn't. Then I did. A very royal pain! I find low carb difficult when times are tough/stress/kids/chocolate addicted hubby/falling off the wagon. Just need a kick up the *r $e. I'm going to follow this thread as interested in what other people experience.
 
Last edited:

donnellysdogs

Master
Messages
13,233
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
Dislikes
People that can't listen to other people's opinions.
People that can't say sorry.
I been a lowish carber the best part of my life (53 years!)... doesnt make a blind bit of difference to me whether I have higher at 100g or 20g. Same old 4am increase. Only difference is going to bed late and getting up late.. that just shifts the DP...
 

boppa18

Member
Messages
6
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Cigarette smoke, pomposity, cruelty of any sort - animal or human..
Also have this problem. I can go to bed with BG at 5 but I know it will increase by +7 or more by morning. I've also recently noticed that taking the dog for his morning walk on an empty stomach will increase my BG by another 2 or 3!
Don't know if this will help anyone else but I have been experimenting with 90% dark chocolate - currently Lindt Excellence - and I have found that half to 1 square before bed appears to almost eradicate DP! I haven't done a blood test 2hrs after eating the chocolate yet so don't know if it causes higher BG but it certainly seems to stabilise me so I don't have to spend my 1st waking hours trying to get my numbers down.
Of course, this may not work for anyone else and I'm still experimenting but so far so good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: donnellysdogs

gillianwrdl

Member
Messages
11
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Dislikes
bad manners and inconsideration for others. Relatives who phone all the time and rattle on about nothing! Manipulating types, liars, control freaks, etc etc!
I hate how my feet pain all the time. Arthritis, Diabetes and probably after effects from Chemotherapy.
I have an awful time with DP, but for some reason mine appears to be due to environment? Does anyone else have this? I never used to suffer from it, but about a year ago I moved from the UK to Costa Rica for work, and since then I rarely wake up with a sugar below 10. I have tried a lot of things (eating/not eating/increasing insulin/decreasing insulin) and nothing works. BUT when I visit the UK (e.g. at christmas) I have no problems with DP! I do not eat anything really different here compared to the UK (same amount of carbs etc) so I am pretty stumped. I am on injections and the thought of getting up every day at 3am kills me. Something that has helped slightly is to go to bed with a sugar level of 8 or so (which is high for me). In this case I usually wake up with sugars around 12-15 rather than higher but this does not always work and is totally trial and error!!
Try sleeping with an eye cover when in long daylight environments. Nature probably designed us to lift up the sugar levels to prepare us for the days activity at dawn. Just an idea that clicked as I know light exposure has several effects on the body.
 

gillianwrdl

Member
Messages
11
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Dislikes
bad manners and inconsideration for others. Relatives who phone all the time and rattle on about nothing! Manipulating types, liars, control freaks, etc etc!
I hate how my feet pain all the time. Arthritis, Diabetes and probably after effects from Chemotherapy.
I have an awful time with DP, but for some reason mine appears to be due to environment? Does anyone else have this? I never used to suffer from it, but about a year ago I moved from the UK to Costa Rica for work, and since then I rarely wake up with a sugar below 10. I have tried a lot of things (eating/not eating/increasing insulin/decreasing insulin) and nothing works. BUT when I visit the UK (e.g. at christmas) I have no problems with DP! I do not eat anything really different here compared to the UK (same amount of carbs etc) so I am pretty stumped. I am on injections and the thought of getting up every day at 3am kills me. Something that has helped slightly is to go to bed with a sugar level of 8 or so (which is high for me). In this case I usually wake up with sugars around 12-15 rather than higher but this does not always work and is totally trial and error!!


Something just clicked here regarding locality affecting the liver activity at first light! I would try using an eyeshade to sleep when you are in long daylight environments and see if there is any difference. Probably all our livers, diabetic or not are designed to prepare the body for the day's energy requirements when early work starts were the norm. Perhaps it is just doing what if is designed to do! My rooster has a habit of crowing early and I could be exposed to more light than I would have if not woken up.
 

ickihun

Master
Messages
13,698
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Bullies
I have dp throughout my day as well as night. Anytime my body thinks I'm fasting, my liver dumps. I have to eat breakfast are I too increase by 4mmol by the time I eat. Even on an excellent basal called Toujeo300. That is why I say basal doesn't make any difference for me. Novarapid and food resolves my liver dump but on lchf fatty protein worked nicely too.
My consultant doesn't want me on fatty diets before bariatric surgery. He's hoping to more than half my insulin injection needs.
 

becca59

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,856
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Something just clicked here regarding locality affecting the liver activity at first light! I would try using an eyeshade to sleep when you are in long daylight environments and see if there is any difference. Probably all our livers, diabetic or not are designed to prepare the body for the day's energy requirements when early work starts were the norm. Perhaps it is just doing what if is designed to do! My rooster has a habit of crowing early and I could be exposed to more light than I would have if not woken up.

Tried this last night. First in range reading in weeks!! Let's hope it isn't a fluke.
 
  • Like
Reactions: spook_kate_

smag3

Well-Known Member
Messages
104
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Doctors telling me that I probably know more than them
I get DP every morning and have failed to find a solution. But when I am on holiday I do not get it! In fact I wake very low and have to adjust for that by lowering my Lantus when on hols! Went to Sicily for 2 weeks in May and no DP, been to Portugal and no DP! Why? Maybe the solution is to move to a warmer country......
 

Lord Midas

Well-Known Member
Messages
148
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Idiots. Morons. Flat Earthers. Religious fanatics. Trump. Bigots. Misogynists. And other assorted bad types.
I get DP every morning and have failed to find a solution. But when I am on holiday I do not get it! In fact I wake very low and have to adjust for that by lowering my Lantus when on hols! Went to Sicily for 2 weeks in May and no DP, been to Portugal and no DP! Why? Maybe the solution is to move to a warmer country......
Could it be that you eat different foods when away? I'd imagine the diet in Sicily is somewhat different than what you would have at home. Could you replicate what you eat when away as a comparison?