Vit D shortage

[milesrf]

I've read that metformin (a medicine commonly used as the first treatment for type 2 diabetes) can cause vitamin D deficiency severe enough that some people cannot absorb enough vitamin D from pills, and need to get it by injection instead.

 

[lindisfel]

I hear all this about not absorbing D without K2. Not the case for me. I take 2000iu per day. Little ore or less season dictated. At DX I was 24. 3 months later , no K2 and I was 58. I'm sure insulin helped with absorption ( and lack of insulin depletion) but I've never taken K2

Vit D is our anti cancer vitamin. People are slathering on sunscreen and skin cancer has gone way up. I've had numerous moles that were precancerous and they were all where the sun doesn't shine. Of course too much sun and burning is no good but some early morning or later afternoon sun within reason is always good IMO

The skin behaves like one organ, my dermatologist told me a melenoma can occur on an area of skin that has not been exposed but can be caused by exposure elsewhere. Derek

 

[Brunneria]

I've read that metformin (a medicine commonly used as the first treatment for type 2 diabetes) can cause vitamin D deficiency severe enough that some people cannot absorb enough vitamin D from pills, and need to get it by injection instead.

Can you remember where you read that?

The reason I ask is that Metformin is well documented to reduce or prevent Vit B12 absorption in some people (although it usually takes years), and Vit B12 is treated by injection.

On the other hand, Vit D is treated by tablets (some of them in huge doses), but I have never heard of its absorption being affected by Metformin. I would be very interested to see if there is any evidence for Metformin affecting any other nutrient absorption other than B12 (because, after all, it can in some people, affect their guts). I am guessing that the sunshine through skin part of absorbing Vit D wouldn't be affected at all.

 

[KimWheeler]

Reply. I was vit d deficient for years before I started LCHF. Levels are rising now I'm off Metformin

 

[Brunneria]

Because I was curious about the comments re Metformin and Vit D made above, I have done a bit of googling, and have found this:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21940283
It is a 6 year study of over 700 people

and it concludes
This study confirms the higher prevalence of vitamin B₁₂ deficiency in metformin-treated patients with type 2 diabetes than in those not treated with metformin. This study also suggests that vitamin D deficiency is not a clinical concern among metformin-treated patients with type 2 diabetes and that metformin does not negatively affect treatment of vitamin D deficiency in these patients.

So I think that while Metformin definitely has its issues, they are not connected with Vit D.

 

[KimWheeler]

Where did you get the above 100 range from, and do you know which units it is?
My lab report does not give a reference range. It actually says "not applicable". The test was a 25-OH vit D. The units were nmol/L

I have been trying to find a UK official reference range without much success. The goal posts move. I have seen that 50 is the lowest adequate level, that between 50 and 100nmol/l (20-40ng/mL) is normal, also seen that 75 is adequate. 200 is too much. No-one seems to know for sure, which may explain why my lab doesn't give one.

Go by the Vitamin D council figures of America as they are the leaders. UK figures are way out of synch with them. There is a conversion table

 

[badcat]

Cant remember the exact chemistry of it but theres another reason why calcium and vit d levels taken together are important
My vit d only got tested because someone at the hospital cocked up the letter to my GP after one years diabetes review and it ended up having page 2 from someone elses letter instead of mine and that person had issues with their parathyroid glands.
Lucky **** up as it turned out ( although the mention on page 2 of needing to "scan for tumours" put the willies up me!!!) as my vit d turned out to be very deficient (15)
Anyway as far as I remember, low vit d can cause secondary hyperparathyroidism. Apparently weve all got 4-6 tiny ( size of a grain of rice) parathyroid glands that can be located in the neck, or the abdomen or just hiding! They can get benign tumours which cause them to overproduce parathyroid hormone)
http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/hyperparathyroidism/symptoms-causes/dxc-20319888

 

[Bluetit1802]

Go by the Vitamin D council figures of America as they are the leaders. UK figures are way out of synch with them. There is a conversion table

I found it on Google. Yes, they are way out of sync with just about everything else I've read.

https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/about-vitamin-d/testing-for-vitamin-d/

I can't find if these recommendations are based on any actual science. Do you have any links to where this doctor gets his figures from?

 

[KimWheeler]

It's the organisation which began the whole vit d research. Their website lists all their research. I've not looked at it in years as I follow them on email
[email protected]. Hope this helps

 

[Bluetit1802]

It's the organisation which began the whole vit d research. Their website lists all their research. I've not looked at it in years as I follow them on email
[email protected]. Hope this helps

I'm very sceptical, especially looking at the list of sponsors - https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/about-us/sponsors/
Everyone of them benefits from people buying Vit D supplements or sun lamps. Not unlike the British Nutrition Foundation with British Sugar PLC, Mars, McCains, United Biscuits, Weetabix etc. etc.

 

[KimWheeler]

That's your choice. I know the Mayo clinic follows their protocols. I know I've been on the protocol for years. But it's up to you. I don't trust UK guidelines as they are screwing many thousands of hypothyroid sufferers with their selective research and false science... It's the world over. Take the bits that work for you. Good luck

 

[spendercat]

Personally I do not avoid the sun in Summer, but do not use sun creams - I am fair skinned, but do not burn.
From October to March I supplement with D3 in liquid form (10,000 iu's) dropped into my morning kefir - a fermented yoghurt drink I make with whole goats milk, that is high in K2.
I cannot recommend the kefir enough, the friendly bacteria in it deals with everything, even athletes foot and thrush!

 

[donnellysdogs]

Personally I do not avoid the sun in Summer, but do not use sun creams - I am fair skinned, but do not burn.
From October to March I supplement with D3 in liquid form (10,000 iu's) dropped into my morning kefir - a fermented yoghurt drink I make with whole goats milk, that is high in K2.
I cannot recommend the kefir enough, the friendly bacteria in it deals with everything, even athletes foot and thrush!

Kefir is highly recomended by cancer oncologist Prof Robert Thomas too for keeping flora good in gut..

 

[KimWheeler]

I'm very sceptical, especially looking at the list of sponsors - https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/about-us/sponsors/
Everyone of them benefits from people buying Vit D supplements or sun lamps. Not unlike the British Nutrition Foundation with British Sugar PLC, Mars, McCains, United Biscuits, Weetabix etc. etc.

I agree. It's the way America funds it's research. When they started there were not so many big players.

 

[KimWheeler]

Kefir is highly recomended by cancer oncologist Prof Robert Thomas too for keeping flora good in gut..

I take kefir too but I use coconut milk as I'm not a fan of goats milk.

 

[Brunneria]

Another kefir fan here

 

[donnellysdogs]

Wish I could think of making kefir for myself but too afraid of poisoning us!!

 

[KimWheeler]

Wish I could think of making kefir for myself but too afraid of poisoning us!!

Lakeland do a nice kit. Tad expensive but You'll see how easy it is and then decide to do your own. It's just like making yoghurt.

 

[donnellysdogs]

Lakeland do a nice kit. Tad expensive but You'll see how easy it is and then decide to do your own. It's just like making yoghurt.

Thank you, I will have a look at Lakelands kit..

 

[milesrf]

Can you remember where you read that?

The reason I ask is that Metformin is well documented to reduce or prevent Vit B12 absorption in some people (although it usually takes years), and Vit B12 is treated by injection.

On the other hand, Vit D is treated by tablets (some of them in huge doses), but I have never heard of its absorption being affected by Metformin. I would be very interested to see if there is any evidence for Metformin affecting any other nutrient absorption other than B12 (because, after all, it can in some people, affect their guts). I am guessing that the sunshine through skin part of absorbing Vit D wouldn't be affected at all.

Sorry, I can't. I'm not sure if I was confusing vitamin B12 with vitamin D.