T2D Since 2000-HbA1c Sept 5.9% Off all Meds since July!

[Robert_D]

Ah, were you tracking your diet with any app or so? I am really curious to know about how much calories from carbs, fat, protein you were getting in general. This is because I have found it is hard to be low in carbs following a vegan/vegetarian diet, in relation to the overall consumption of calories.

No app but the physical one my meter! I did have an excel spreadsheet and logged every reading Wake up, 2 hour post breakfast, pre and post lunch and dinner. If I had a large portion of brocolli (a full head) and mushrooms and bean sprouts and if I tested high than I reduced certain portions and retested to see what difference it made. I found that the meter was my influencer not calorie, fat or protein levels. Remember my driving aim was to get an answer to my one question HOW DO I AVOID TAKING GLICAZIDE? Answer lose sufficient weight and tightly control my blood sugars and end up not taking anything as a direct consequence of eating to my meter. I can't emphasise that enough. If I simply focused on calorie count or protein or fat content the chances are I would still be taking Metformin, Linagliptin and would now be on Glicazide as well, that is the issue with blood sugar levels not tightly controlled. I saw the effect of certain food groups and their portion sizes on my sugar levels and reacted quickly to rectify be it the removal or reduction of that food group. Everything followed by that. If calorie counting is your thing than it shouldn't be too difficult to get that from the internet but I found no use in that method as blood glucose management was my primary aim.
Incidentally how long ago were you diagnosed I assume fairly recently as you are diet and exercise only? And what is your current weight and target weight and lastly do you have a recent HBA1C? (You may not have had an HbA1c test yet ).

 

[CherryAA]

No app but the physical one my meter! I did have an excel spreadsheet and logged every reading Wake up, 2 hour post breakfast, pre and post lunch and dinner. If I had a large portion of brocolli (a full head) and mushrooms and bean sprouts and if I tested high than I reduced certain portions and retested to see what difference it made. I found that the meter was my influencer not calorie, fat or protein levels. Remember my driving aim was to get an answer to my one question HOW DO I AVOID TAKING GLICAZIDE? Answer lose sufficient weight and tightly control my blood sugars and end up not taking anything as a direct consequence of eating to my meter. I can't emphasise that enough. If I simply focused on calorie count or protein or fat content the chances are I would still be taking Metformin, Linagliptin and would now be on Glicazide as well, that is the issue with blood sugar levels not tightly controlled. I saw the effect of certain food groups and their portion sizes on my sugar levels and reacted quickly to rectify be it the removal or reduction of that food group. Everything followed by that. If calorie counting is your thing than it shouldn't be too difficult to get that from the internet but I found no use in that method as blood glucose management was my primary aim.
Incidentally how long ago were you diagnosed I assume fairly recently as you are diet and exercise only? And what is your current weight and target weight and lastly do you have a recent HBA1C? (You may not have had an HbA1c test yet ).

Congratulations, a great story. My opinion is that for the vast majority of people with T2, IF they are still producing insulin and still have hyperinsulinaemia ( too high insulin levels) then it may be possible to get off all medications including insulin no matter how long they have been on them . Whilst of course there will be exceptions to this, I guess no -one knows if they are an exception until they have tried. The fact that the medical profession focuses on the " easy wins" - in terms of those recently diagnosed, is no reason at all for anyone to think that that means that everything we are now learning cannot apply to them no matter how long they have been suffering for.

In my opinion the underlying cause of diabetes is the hyperinsulinaemia ( too much circulating insulin) and for many people who are/ were overweight at diagnosis - they have been overweight for 20 odd years and suffering from undiagnosed hyperinsulinaemia for that entire time -( in my case at least 35 years) the turnarounds made within a year for those newly diagnosed is still turning round multiple years of too high insulin, which is in many ways not that materially different from those actually diagnosed many years ago and placed on medication. In practice we have all been producing too much insulin for many years, just that for some that amount became not enough to actually control blood glucose quicker than for others thus they have been actually diagnosed with diabetes quicker. We should ALL have been diagnosed with Hyperinsulinaemia years ago.

For many hyperinsulinaemia closely tracks weight, ( up and down) . I recently saw a study showing a 54% reduction in fasting insulin coming from an 8 week low carb diet.

My own friend was a T2 insulin dependent diabetic for 14 years and he no longer takes insulin or any other medications following the adoption of an LCHF diet. he was not particularly overweight when he stopped the medications, so in total he has only lost about 8 kg overall, but his blood sugar control has improved beyond all expectations and is far far better than it ever was when on insulin. His overall perception of his general health had also improved immeasurably. He had to come off the medications without any support from his medical team, who simply refused to accept it was possible. he has persevered and won through, which is fabulous.

Its great that so many stories are emerging of people being able to beat this condition even if its long standing ! you made my day !

 

[Robert_D]

Congratulations, a great story.

Thank you @CherryAA for your congratulatory nod and your contribution to the thread, it is appreciated especially coming from a well-known member such as yourself..
You are absolutely spot on that for most "to get off all medications including insulin no matter how long they have been on them ". Is possible. I strongly now believe it is possible for most to be able to achieve normal blood glucose levels for type 2's through lifestyle changes and 17 years on from diagnosis in my case, is reflective of that reality.

 

[NewTD2]

Really well done!!!

Could you please share your daily meal plan?

Thank you.

 

[PCS1949]

Well done Robert! Stories like this, which pretty much mirror my own, just make me angry! The dietary advice givens to T2s over the last 20 years or more has clearly exacerbated if not caused the condition in so many if not all sufferers. Why oh why have they still not seen the light? My doctor although generally enlightened and supportive still says things like "Well done, you have found a way that works for you". Why do they still not seem to recognise that it can work for all? Unfortunately the "Road to Damascus" came too late for me to prevent two heart attacks, but subsequently, since discovering this way of life, I feel fitter than I have for years and would have been off all meds but for the heart attacks.

 

[Granny_grump_]

No app but the physical one my meter! I did have an excel spreadsheet and logged every reading Wake up, 2 hour post breakfast, pre and post lunch and dinner. If I had a large portion of brocolli (a full head) and mushrooms and bean sprouts and if I tested high than I reduced certain portions and retested to see what difference it made. I found that the meter was my influencer not calorie, fat or protein levels. Remember my driving aim was to get an answer to my one question HOW DO I AVOID TAKING GLICAZIDE? Answer lose sufficient weight and tightly control my blood sugars and end up not taking anything as a direct consequence of eating to my meter. I can't emphasise that enough. If I simply focused on calorie count or protein or fat content the chances are I would still be taking Metformin, Linagliptin and would now be on Glicazide as well, that is the issue with blood sugar levels not tightly controlled. I saw the effect of certain food groups and their portion sizes on my sugar levels and reacted quickly to rectify be it the removal or reduction of that food group. Everything followed by that. If calorie counting is your thing than it shouldn't be too difficult to get that from the internet but I found no use in that method as blood glucose management was my primary aim.
Incidentally how long ago were you diagnosed I assume fairly recently as you are diet and exercise only? And what is your current weight and target weight and lastly do you have a recent HBA1C? (You may not have had an HbA1c test yet ).

Not nessassary to be recent diabetic on no meds, I have been type2 for 17 years initially no information no help,on metformin for only a very short time after a number of years of being diabetic. Then I found this site diet controlled no meds lost 4stone 3 pounds on LCHF diet in last 12 months never felt better,now I'm experimenting with more foods to see how my BG reacts Has I don't want to lose more weight. K

 

[Robert_D]

Really well done!!!

Could you please share your daily meal plan?

Thank you.

I just eat low carb. No starch. 10 Almonds for breakfast. green salad, steamed tenderstem brocolli cooled under cold water and tossed with green olives and radishes for lunch and same for dinner. small amount of olive oil or Mackerel in brine tossed in salad on days I can't get fresh salmon. I do this for 6 days and for the 7th have fresh Salmon Sashimi , raw Salmon with wasabi Japanese horse radish and soy sauce for lunch and dinner. Coffee with unsweetened soya milk. That @NewTD2 is my daily meal plan. Pretty boring really but it has enabled me to lose 3 stone or 42 pounds in c4 months and keep it off as I near 7 months from starting on June 2. (Currently 11 stone 9 pounds /163 pounds
I just want to maintain this so that I can continue to achieve regulated HbA1C results without meds that enabled me to get lower life cover premiums and private medical insurance to boot since June '17 as a direct consequence of well controlled blood sugar levels
Every action as the saying goes, has a reaction and this reaction has resulted in my taking back control of a lifestyle disease that most of us are convinced by those who should know better (most GP's)who are happy to convince us we are not able to influence in any meaningful way, when we in reality can, if we take back control!

 

[Robert_D]

Well done Robert! Stories like this, which pretty much mirror my own, just make me angry! The dietary advice givens to T2s over the last 20 years or more has clearly exacerbated if not caused the condition in so many if not all sufferers. Why oh why have they still not seen the light? My doctor although generally enlightened and supportive still says things like "Well done, you have found a way that works for you". Why do they still not seem to recognise that it can work for all? Unfortunately the "Road to Damascus" came too late for me to prevent two heart attacks, but subsequently, since discovering this way of life, I feel fitter than I have for years and would have been off all meds but for the heart attacks.

You may not be able to change your past but you are definitely influencing your future, no doubt about that is there? Well done on embracing change and sticking with it.

 

[Mimi's]

So after 4 years of Metformin ( first 500mg × 3 times a day to 500mg × 2 times a day) for insulin resistance linked PCOD,
Now off Metformin for two weeks and all blood sugar reports came normal. Doctor however advising to take 750 mg metformin as he feels the results are due to taking the medicines for long and diet change. My question is that I feel weak And unwell on the meds so do i still need to take the 750 dose every day?

 

[Mimi's]

I just eat low carb. No starch. 10 Almonds for breakfast. green salad, steamed tenderstem brocolli cooled under cold water and tossed with green olives and radishes for lunch and same for dinner. small amount of olive oil or Mackerel in brine tossed in salad on days I can't get fresh salmon. I do this for 6 days and for the 7th have fresh Salmon Sashimi , raw Salmon with wasabi Japanese horse radish and soy sauce for lunch and dinner. Coffee with unsweetened soya milk. That @NewTD2 is my daily meal plan. Pretty boring really but it has enabled me to lose 3 stone or 42 pounds in c4 months and keep it off as I near 7 months from starting on June 2. (Currently 11 stone 9 pounds /163 pounds
I just want to maintain this so that I can continue to achieve regulated HbA1C results without meds that enabled me to get lower life cover premiums and private medical insurance to boot since June '17 as a direct consequence of well controlled blood sugar levels
Every action as the saying goes, has a reaction and this reaction has resulted in my taking back control of a lifestyle disease that most of us are convinced by those who should know better (most GP's)who are happy to convince us we are not able to influence in any meaningful way, when we in reality can, if we take back control!

Didn't you feel weak on this diet? Sounds like 600 to 700 calories.

 

[Robert_D]

Didn't you feel weak on this diet? Sounds like 600 to 700 calories.

The simple answer is no I don't feel weak. If I am hungry I have an occasional extra tin of mackerel in brine or some extra radishes.
What I have noticed is my appetite has dramatically changed. I eat less because I feel less hungry. I feel less hungry as a direct consequence of eating low carb not because of any drop in calories. I don't count calories at all so don't need to address what my previous conditioning regarding food may have prompted me to consider re food intake. And finally my weight fluctuates at best by 2-3 pounds at most and a little extra walking (30 minutes) and it adjusts back after a couple of days but other than that, weight loss has stopped. It appears that the body self regulates once you hit a minimum weight level and you need very little to maintain it in reality.
Bottom line is, that I am no longer preoccupied by food because of the dropping of carbs like pasta, potatoes and cereals and the removal of all meds is a release psychologically of control over my life that I no longer have to justify, it just is......

 

[Paul Oak]

Well done, excellent result.

 

[L1ncslass]

[QUOTE="More of us are coming to realise that it's all about knowledge and monitoring and taking control. And the medical profession in most cases doesn't want you to have that knowledge nor that control. (If it did guess what, you'd be offered free test strips (not generally available in the UK for non insulin users) and proper diabetic dietary advice that offers quick and measurable change and gives results that are self evident and of course being in possession of the equipment to help you monitor and take control of those lifestyle changes ( Meters!) giving control back to the diabetic and enabling YOU to manage your personal BG improvements and consequently your health outcome.

I hope that this inspires in whatever way possible for others to take back control.[/QUOTE]

Agree no support from GP surgery, here take the pills no interest in me taking back control, tho I have just received an invite to speak to a Dr after I wrote him a long letter and enclosed 6 weeks worth of data to show my BG results. No idea which way this is going to go, telling off for ignoring their advice OR support in my lifestyle change, blood test strips and a way to safely dispose of the sharps bin.

My question what are your BG readings on a typical day? I have the dawn phenomenon and morning BG's are now in mid 7's on waking IF I could get these down then my average daily results would be very good. Need to loose more weight [it's going slowly] which will help with fatty liver and then the DP.

In 10 weeks I've gone from avg daily readings of 10 to 6/7, should be on 4 Metformin only taking one [told that's the reason why my BG results are dropping hmm so why prescribe 4 when 1's working [tho I know it's down to LCHF diet and excercise]

Congratulations on your fantastic results

 

[Robert_D]

[QUOTE="More of us are coming to realise that it's all about knowledge and monitoring and taking control. And the medical profession in most cases doesn't want you to have that knowledge nor that control. (If it did guess what, you'd be offered free test strips (not generally available in the UK for non insulin users) and proper diabetic dietary advice that offers quick and measurable change and gives results that are self evident and of course being in possession of the equipment to help you monitor and take control of those lifestyle changes ( Meters!) giving control back to the diabetic and enabling YOU to manage your personal BG improvements and consequently your health outcome.

I hope that this inspires in whatever way possible for others to take back control.

Agree no support from GP surgery, here take the pills no interest in me taking back control, tho I have just received an invite to speak to a Dr after I wrote him a long letter and enclosed 6 weeks worth of data to show my BG results. No idea which way this is going to go, telling off for ignoring their advice OR support in my lifestyle change, blood test strips and a way to safely dispose of the sharps bin.

My question what are your BG readings on a typical day? I have the dawn phenomenon and morning BG's are now in mid 7's on waking IF I could get these down then my average daily results would be very good. Need to loose more weight [it's going slowly] which will help with fatty liver and then the DP.

In 10 weeks I've gone from avg daily readings of 10 to 6/7, should be on 4 Metformin only taking one [told that's the reason why my BG results are dropping hmm so why prescribe 4 when 1's working [tho I know it's down to LCHF diet and excercise]

Congratulations on your fantastic results/QUOTE]

Thank you. The Doctor won't admonish you if your blood sugars are improving and your weight is coming down.
In my honest opinion doctors are stuck, they are not nutritionist and as they only get 15 mins per patient (Generally here in the UK under the NHS) they work on the principle that most won't be able to make the lifestyle changes that you are obviously making so they work on the "one size fits all" principle and that is "Just take the medication" Re-education for most patients is very time consuming for GP's on the whole (unfortunately)
The fact that your lifestyle changes will have an impact will not be as alien to your doctor as some may think but he/she doesn't have the resources to make such wholesale changes to his/her approach.
You are taking back control, that is what counts. I appreciate that we "the lifestyle changers" may feel we have an obligation to change the medical profession's attitude to Diabetic management but we all do our bit on this and other forums so

Well done to you and your sterling efforts-Long may they continue.

My last HbA1c ( Mid December) was 45mmol/mol (6.3%) which was a minor change but still reflects that my BG control is steady and is still acceptable on a no meds regime coming up to 18 years since diagnosis.
As far as dawn phenomena is concerned I find if I eat post 7:30pm than it is slightly elevated but reduces back if I resist eating post 7:30 over 2-3 days. Hope that helps?[/QUOTE]

 

[Mimi's]

The simple answer is no I don't feel weak. If I am hungry I have an occasional extra tin of mackerel in brine or some extra radishes.
What I have noticed is my appetite has dramatically changed. I eat less because I feel less hungry. I feel less hungry as a direct consequence of eating low carb not because of any drop in calories. I don't count calories at all so don't need to address what my previous conditioning regarding food may have prompted me to consider re food intake. And finally my weight fluctuates at best by 2-3 pounds at most and a little extra walking (30 minutes) and it adjusts back after a couple of days but other than that, weight loss has stopped. It appears that the body self regulates once you hit a minimum weight level and you need very little to maintain it in reality.
Bottom line is, that I am no longer preoccupied by food because of the dropping of carbs like pasta, potatoes and cereals and the removal of all meds is a release psychologically of control over my life that I no longer have to justify, it just is......

The last line is a clincher and your victory! Bravo!

 

[sylviashev]

No app but the physical one my meter! I did have an excel spreadsheet and logged every reading Wake up, 2 hour post breakfast, pre and post lunch and dinner. If I had a large portion of brocolli (a full head) and mushrooms and bean sprouts and if I tested high than I reduced certain portions and retested to see what difference it made. I found that the meter was my influencer not calorie, fat or protein levels. Remember my driving aim was to get an answer to my one question HOW DO I AVOID TAKING GLICAZIDE? Answer lose sufficient weight and tightly control my blood sugars and end up not taking anything as a direct consequence of eating to my meter. I can't emphasise that enough. If I simply focused on calorie count or protein or fat content the chances are I would still be taking Metformin, Linagliptin and would now be on Glicazide as well, that is the issue with blood sugar levels not tightly controlled. I saw the effect of certain food groups and their portion sizes on my sugar levels and reacted quickly to rectify be it the removal or reduction of that food group. Everything followed by that. If calorie counting is your thing than it shouldn't be too difficult to get that from the internet but I found no use in that method as blood glucose management was my primary aim.
Incidentally how long ago were you diagnosed I assume fairly recently as you are diet and exercise only? And what is your current weight and target weight and lastly do you have a recent HBA1C? (You may not have had an HbA1c test yet ).

 

[sylviashev]

I really would like to try what you did. OK you did not count calories but all you ate was some almonds, salad, tender stem broccoli ? And then the salmon or tins of mackrel. What else? Its not that I find this very extreme but I do want people to think they too can do this.

 

[Robert_D]

I really would like to try what you did. OK you did not count calories but all you ate was some almonds, salad, tender stem broccoli ? And then the salmon or tins of mackrel. What else? Its not that I find this very extreme but I do want people to think they too can do this.

The "What else?" was eating to my meter and I can not stress that enough. Without test, test, testing I would not have known which foods or portion sizes affected my blood sugar most and would not have ended up with the eating plan I have now.
If my blood sugars spiked when testing, I examined what I ate and adjusted accordingly by either dropping and/or swapping that ingredient.
There is no doubt that some (including my previous self), would have found or would find my current regime extreme, but this is where I have ended up, not where I started from. Remember the ingredient of mackerel or salmon or tenderstem broccoli is not important and has no bearing on the core message. The message and the focus should not be on any one food ingredient but the journey and the underlying message which is:-Adopt a very low carb regime which excludes potato, starch, pasta and cereal, beer etc which was key in me getting the weight loss program to start and most importantly to continue and to maintain my current 11 stone 9 pound weight (achieved by 1st Nov '17) from 14 stone 9 pounds original weight (June 2 '17).

This is the approach that has in my case, worked for the longest time. I have stuck to this evolved program and for the first time in 17 years I am and continue to be med free as a consequence. So yes, people can do it, but the message and focus has to be on adopting a very low carb intake and not to focus on what any individual decided to include or not in their regime. Swap one ingredient for another if that ingredient doesn't float your boat but use a meter to evaluate how your body reacts to that ingredient and drop/swap if it doesn't work for you when testing your blood sugar post meals. That's what I did.

I found it easier for the first time since diagnosis c 18 years ago to not focus on food by taking the freedom of food choice out of the equation. This than makes the formula (defacto low carb) rather than the focus being on the daily chore previously, of asking myself "What am I going to eat today?" That driving force in my daily decision making is now removed, which yes, has its limitations but also gives one a lot more freedom in a strange way, by removing choice and temptations.
I have got to say that approach has individually worked for me and I am still applying it today, going into month 8 and haven't fallen off the wagon yet! So no to Calorie counting and yes to very low carbing.
Lastly, mustn't forget a small but important blood sugar lowering fact, walking briskly for a minimum of 40 minutes a day works and throws high blood sugars in to the long grass! That is basically my "What else?" in a nutshell

 

[Tophat1900]

Amazing what can be achieved when you educate yourself and take some control of your life, Well done, fantastic result.

 

[Pinkorchid]

Amazing results Robert D so well done you You say you have a low carb low fat diet which I find interesting when the general advice here is low carb higher fat ..LCHF. Most will say if you do low carb then you have to increase the fats to make up for eating les carbs and this is the advice usually given to new T2 diabetics joining this group. When I was diagnosed T2 about 2 years ago...only just over 7 the BG level for diabetes and not overweight....I did lower my starchy carbs but I do not like red meat or full fat dairy I do have olive oil avocados, olives and a few nuts low fat dairy and lots of vegetables so basically eat much the same as I always did much the same as I always did but just with lower carbs but much lower fat than many here do where the trend is mostly to have cream, butter, the fat on meat and fried breakfasts A lot here say doing low fat for years made them ill but I am 78 in good health and apart from the T2 have no other medical problems so do not think it did me any harm