Alcohol v. Diabetes

[viv1969]

I have to disagree that no-one chooses to be an alcoholic. The decision whether or not to drink alcohol initially is that of the individual. No-one becomes an alcoholic right after thier first encounter with alcohol. It takes time and dedication and individual actions.

 

[JUSTFOCUS]

Have you heard about the 3yr old baby on the news ??????????
JF point made folks

 

[viv1969]

I have read the highly sensationalised media 'reports' yes; but I wouldn't care to comment on them because you can be sure that what we've read / seen contain scant factual / accurate content.

 

[Patch]

This thread got really ugly.

There's a great case for deleting it, I think.

 

[cugila]

This thread is in the Diabetes SoapBox.

There is nothing ugly about it, it is just the differing opinions of Members. It needs no action at this point in time. We do not wish to stifle debate.

So long as everyone remains civil, there is no problem.

Forum Monitor's.

 

[sugarless sue]

This is the soapbox and most of us are long enough in the tooth to have had many and varied life experiences which, like it or not, colour our view of many subjects.

To some alcohol is the ' good fairy' to others the 'wicked witch'. We have no right to judge others or their experienced views on life, just respect their personal views.

We can, of course, add our own views and, in the same manner have them respected. In this way we learn and grow in experience of others and their views on many subjects.

 

[PickledPepper]

Well, I'm experimenting with 'no alcohol' for the first time since a teenager.

I must say in the early days (post diagnosis), a shot or two on a evening did help lower my fasting levels to ones I struggled to obtain. Something has happened since though and I often get these lower levels without the booze these days.

Truth is, it is financial 'constraints' that is causing me to lay of the sauce, but even though I was sort of compelled into it, I'm sort of glad because I get to experience a teetotalers life for a while at least. Plus I'm sure my liver is thankful for it!

That being said, I don't think the odd indulgence is overly detrimental. I can admit to myself that if I have bottles laying around, I'm likely to overdo it slightly on one pretext or the next. Not having them about helps immeasurably.

 

[Patch]

It was only after the "p-word" got mentioned that I thought the thread should be deleted, for the protection of the OP.

I'd much rather not know which members had been abused as children... But obviously, if the OP is happy for that to be common knowledge it's their decision to make it known or not.

 

[Eiche]

I'm fine with it patch, it is nothing I am ashamed of. I'm sorry if it upset anyone. Maybe cugila or sue could go to that post and edit the dreaded "P" word out of it if it makes people more comfortable.

I am in no way against people having a drink if they like it. That really wasn't the point of my post and if my distaste for boozers is so very offensive, by all means, delete the whole thread. The point I was trying to make has been completely missed and has been walzed over and misinterpreted anyway so I will step away and only mind myself...

 

[viviennem]

I think you made a valid point, Eiche, and I've read the thread with interest.

As a alcohol-loving child of a (fortunately not abusive) alcoholic father, my biggest fear has always been going down that road. I can do without it, but I do so love my wine!

A question, though - I'm sure I've read somewhere that alcohol causes inflammation in the body, including inflammation of the pancreas, which I believe can be one of the causes of diabetes.

It may lower our BGs temporarily, but if it ultimately worsens the condition . . .?

Viv

 

[JUSTFOCUS]

Eiche
I did'tn think anyone was wrong lastnite nor did i think anyone was right. I feel sometimes text can make a mockery out of the intended post. If we did'nt post or join in we would'nt have a forum to share our views .
I hope that everyone had enjoyed the different opinions :wink:
Be 8) JF

 

[cugila]

A question, though - I'm sure I've read somewhere that alcohol causes inflammation in the body, including inflammation of the pancreas, which I believe can be one of the causes of diabetes.

It may lower our BGs temporarily, but if it ultimately worsens the condition . . .?

Viv

That's one of the problems Viv. People seem to forget the effect that Alcohol has on many parts of the body. It may help lower Bg levels in moderation but it can be detrimental to various organs and body processes, especially in excess. It is a matter for the individual how much is 'moderate'.

If people are not aware of the numerous effects they should take a look at this link........

http://www.drinkaware.co.uk/facts/health-facts

 

[Patch]

It may help lower Bg levels in moderation but it can be detrimental to various organs and body processes, especially in excess.

So can insulin. Alcohol is not no more of a demon than any other drug. If you drink too much, you KNOW what will happen. If you know what will happen and continue to drink, then you have a problem - the problem is not alcohol, though.

 

[JUSTFOCUS]

Thats right Patch
surely cugila likes a tiple or two as he has promoted a certain blend on all his posts (in moderation) :wink:

 

[Patch]

Of course.

 

[cugila]

JF.
Yes I like Guinness......no more than 2 pints a week. Glenfiddich (which isn't a blend BTW, it's a Single Malt) ....I have a bottle of 21 yr old that I have had for almost 2 years.......it is still 2/3rds full. In my book that is moderation. It isn't promotion, just a fact. :wink:

As for calling Alcohol a 'demon'.....not my words. In this thread I am not really interested in Insulin use or drug consumption.....this thread is about Alcohol and Diabetes. Anybody who thinks the two are the same thing, well certainly not my view. It is also a fact that there are those, especially some younger people, who treat alcohol as some sort of recreational drug, drink to excess. My Son was one of those until he ended up in Hospital after a 'binge'.......he now drinks sensibly.

 

[JUSTFOCUS]

:lol: @promotive
I think if anyone uses bla di bla V bla di bla in a post (subject)
Then the opening line (Jump all over this soap box) Is already showing signs of anger to people that don't even know the posters circumstancess .
e.g" I have noticed that a lot of people seem to choose alcohol to manage there levels" I.m pleased for them " personally i choose not to use alcohol "
Would be enough " :wink: :wink:
Manythanks JF

 

[welshtony]

A question, though - I'm sure I've read somewhere that alcohol causes inflammation in the body, including inflammation of the pancreas, which I believe can be one of the causes of diabetes.

It may lower our BGs temporarily, but if it ultimately worsens the condition . . .?

Viv

That's one of the problems Viv. People seem to forget the effect that Alcohol has on many parts of the body. It may help lower Bg levels in moderation but it can be detrimental to various organs and body processes, especially in excess. It is a matter for the individual how much is 'moderate'.

If people are not aware of the numerous effects they should take a look at this link........

http://www.drinkaware.co.uk/facts/health-facts

Can I preface this with the standard YMMV! I wholeheartedly agree with the comment that it is a matter for the individual how much is 'moderate'.

I am NOT advocating that anyone changes their lifestyle based on this post; do your own research, and make as informed a decision as you can, taking all factors (including your individual tolerance, experience and social environment) into account.

The Drinkaware site has some surprising facts, in the context of the debate on this thread, so far.

Here's an extract of their comments on "alcohol and diabetes" (the numbers refer to footnote references accessible from the link in Cugila's post above):

Drinking alcohol can contribute to the conditions that cause diabetes. There is evidence to suggest that heavy drinking can reduce the body’s sensitivity to insulin, which can trigger type 2 diabetes.(6) Diabetes is a common side effect of chronic pancreatitis, which is overwhelmingly caused by heavy drinking. One in three people who have chronic pancreatitis will develop diabetes.(7)

Drinking can also increase your chance of becoming overweight and therefore your risk of developing type 2 diabetes. Alcohol contains a huge amount of calories – one pint of beer can be equivalent to a chocolate bar.

However, several studies have shown that light to moderate drinking actually may reduce your chance of getting type 2 diabetes.(8) (9) (10) (11)

A 2005 review of 15 previous studies into the link between diabetes and alcohol concluded that ‘moderate drinkers’ (those who drank between one and six units per day) were a third less likely to develop type 2 diabetes than abstainers or heavy drinkers. Teetotallers and heavy drinkers have an equally high risk of developing diabetes.(12) This is thought to be because low to moderate levels of alcohol make the body more sensitive to insulin.(13)

Now I wonder how many readers of this thread are regarding "moderate" drinking as up to 6 units a day? And at that level, the risk of DEVELOPING T2 diabetes, was REDUCED by 1/3 .

I appreciate that this advice refers to the risk of developing diabetes, and is not directly related to those of us already with T2 diabetes, but thought it worthwhile posting some of the direct "facts" that are published about alcohol.

Here's another summary of recent studies from http://www.drinkingandyou.com/site/uk/health/diabetes.htm

A recent meta-analysis by Pietraszek et al (2010) concluded: "light to moderate alcohol consumption seems to reduce the risk of type 2 diabetes by 30%, while heavy drinkers have the same or higher risk than total abstainers." Crandall et al (2009) have also shown that pre-diabetics who consume alcohol are at lower risk of developing diabetes. The analysis was from the Diabetes Prevention Program, involving patients from 27 centers throughout the US.

Another recent paper by Joosten et al 2010 showed that moderate drinking considerably lowered the risk of developing type 2 diabetes even among subjects who are otherwise following a healthy lifestyle (not obese, non-smokers, physically active, eating a healthy diet). The authors suggest that moderate drinking should be considered as a complement, and not as an alternative, to other healthy lifestyle habits that lower the risk of chronic diseases such as diabetes and coronary heart disease.

Cardiovascular disease remains as the leading cause of death among diabetics. Thus, it may also be important to comment on the very convincing and consistent data over many decades indicating a much lower risk of cardiovascular disease among diabetics who drink alcohol in comparison with abstainers.

However, binge drinking increased the number of diabetes cases. Excessive consumption can impair glycaemic control, and increase the risk of diabetic neuropathy and retinopathy.

A cursory search on Google will show that there is no universal (or even pan-EU) guidance on what is a recommended weekly intake of alcohol in units, and somewhere (although I can't find the link now) I came across an interview with the guy that first proposed the 21/14 unit basis for the UK, where he admitted that there was no scientific basis for the limit, but that it just seemed a reasonable one and he was under pressure to produce a recommendation!

 

[viviennem]

6 units a day is moderate? :shock: You mean I can stop beating myself up about this?

Someone pass me the bottle!

(or maybe not . . .)

Viv

 

[Osidge]

Sorry to come into this late but the carbohydrate value of alcoholic drinks has, thus far, not been mentioned. Most alcoholic drinks are far from carb free!!

Doug