Sudden changes

[He_Who_Is_T]

Hi all,

I was diagnosed last year as prediabetes. Given a two week course of metaformin then tested again then another appointment 6 weeks down the line. During this period I lost around 15kg and all tests came back fine. 3 months later was taken off metaformin.

In July was suffering with excessive urination so went to Dr who blamed drinking too much water during the day? So decided to restart metaformin and make another appointment. (I was on 2x500mg a day but wasn't the best at taking them) appointment was 3 weeks later. Constant need for toilet stopped but then a week before the appointment started getting aches around my chest/upper body (anyone else had this a dull ache/discomfort in chest and arms) so I called 111 who sent me to walk in. They gave me a ecg all clear and BP slightly raised on one test then on next. They said everything was ok. Went to the dr's appointment last Wednesday and he treated urine no ketones and took blood sugars they were 12.7. He advised continuing metaformin being strict with them and a blood test (tomorrow) to check things out. I've been testing my blood sugars for the first time since the appointment. My mornings have never been below 8.7 and during the day I am anywhere between 10.7-19. I was drinking a lot of sugary drinks (2 litres a day) but I've stopped since the first appointment. I'm eating more fruit and I've always drank lots of water. I'd lost around 2st before all this started so I'd have expected things to be better not worse. I've also been suffering with numbness in my fingers and toes as well as the aches in my arms.

Really worried that uncontrolled blood sugars have caused damage. Anyone else suffered similar issues with type 2? I know metaformin doesn't lower blood sugars a lot but if it isn't working what are my options?

 

[Prem51]

I'm eating more fruit and I've always drank lots of water. I'd lost around 2st before all this started so I'd have expected things to be better not worse.

Welcome to the forum @He_Who_Is_T. Fruit isn't good if you are Type 2. They have a lot of sugar (fructose), especially tropical fruit, though berries are ok.
When you see your doctor tomorrow you should ask if you might be Type 1, further tests might be needed. Weight loss is more associated with Type 1 than Type 2.

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

Welcome to the forum @He_Who_Is_T. Fruit isn't good if you are Type 2. They have a lot of sugar (fructose), especially tropical fruit, though berries are ok.
When you see your doctor tomorrow you should ask if you might be Type 1, further tests might be needed. Weight loss is more associated with Type 1 than Type 2.

Compared to what I'd been eating and drinking fruit is the lesser of the evils. Tomorrow's appointment is blood tests. The weight came after a very active summer trying to get a lot more exercise in. However in previous years (before my son was born) I'd spend 2-3 sessions in the gym so my weight has fluctuated over that period (16 months).

If I was type 1 wouldn't I be suffering a lot more symptoms? I'm more worried about the aches/ discomfort in chest and arms.

 

[Prem51]

I don't know what symptoms you would be getting if you are Type 1, but I expect some of the T1s on here will be along to give you some advice.
The numbness in fingers and toes would suggest some neuropathy, but people on here have found that can be reversed by adjusting their diet to lower sugars and starchy carbohydrates. It doesn't necessarily mean permanent damage.
T2s usually only get permanent damage and diabetic complications from prolonged high bg levels, and from what you say your levels haven't been too high for long.
I wouldn't know about the aches in your chest and arms, I haven't read anything from forum members about that. I would ask your gp about that. It might be due to something else.

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

I don't know what symptoms you would be getting if you are Type 1, but I expect some of the T1s on here will be along to give you some advice.
The numbness in fingers and toes would suggest some neuropathy, but people on here have found that can be reversed by adjusting their diet to lower sugars and starchy carbohydrates. It doesn't necessarily mean permanent damage.
T2s usually only get permanent damage and diabetic complications from prolonged high bg levels, and from what you say your levels haven't been too high for long.
I wouldn't know about the aches in your chest and arms, I haven't read anything from forum members about that. I would ask your gp about that. It might be due to something else.

I'm really worried these blood sugars have been uncontrolled for over a year but only noticed when it's come to a head recently. I do have a poor diet I work nights and lots of hours and then have my son most days. As I mentioned earlier I used to go to the gym fairly regularly but that also took a back seat. Changes to diet are going to be really difficult. I don't drink often maybe 1-2 a month maximum. If my sugars are this high is metaformin going to be able to control them?

 

[Prem51]

I haven't been prescribed metafornin, but from what I've read on here it only lowers bgs by a small amount, but it is an appetite suppressant.
A lot of the Type 2s on here have found that adopting a Low Carbohydrate High Fat (lchf) approach to eating has been better in lowering blood glucose levels. But if you are Type 1, that is more controlled by insulin.

 

[Dixon1995]

Hello there, recently my uncle had lost around 4 stone in 3 months, urinating excessive, drinking like a fish, the doctors diagnosed him as being a type 2 diabetic even though he's sugar was 22 and the other symptoms mentioned. They would not diagnose him type 1 until further blood tests and because he had no Ketones in he's urine. 2 weeks later after being on Glicalizide and Metformin, this lowered he's blood sugars back down to around 6-9mmol/l but he would still sometimes go up to 12,13,14,15mmol/l, so the tablets worked but... he was rung from the hospital by a diabetic doctor telling him he was in fact type 1 diabetic, and was started on NovoMix straight away. Type 1 diabetes onset usually happens within months

Don't settle on just your type 2 diagnosis as misdiagnosis is common

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

I haven't been prescribed metafornin, but from what I've read on here it only lowers bgs by a small amount, but it is an appetite suppressant.
A lot of the Type 2s on here have found that adopting a Low Carbohydrate High Fat (lchf) approach to eating has been better in lowering blood glucose levels. But if you are Type 1, that is more controlled by insulin.

I probably do have a high carb diet atm I'm planning to go back to the gym and I'll have to look into which changes are going to give the best results. I'm hoping it's just taking home to balance back out now I'm taking the medication correctly.

 

[StacieB]

Hi, I have recently been diagnosed with type 1 diabetes and my symptoms was extreme thirst along with constant need to urinate especially at night. I also found it really hard to eat anything, I was lucky to eat 1 meal a day also lost alot of weight (5 stone) I was tired and felt drained also had alot of headaches. Hope this helps

 

[4ratbags]

Metformin helps but changing your diet is the key to controlling blood sugar. There really shouldn't be much damage caused by high bs given that you were in the pre diabetic range last year. I most probably had diabetes for 6-7 years before I was diagnosed. I will tag @daisy1 for you as she has a very informative post to help you understand the role food etc has on our bodies. It can be hard to get your head around everything at first but the members here are only too willing to answer any questions you may have.

 

[ickihun]

Hi all,

I was diagnosed last year as prediabetes. Given a two week course of metaformin then tested again then another appointment 6 weeks down the line. During this period I lost around 15kg and all tests came back fine. 3 months later was taken off metaformin.

In July was suffering with excessive urination so went to Dr who blamed drinking too much water during the day? So decided to restart metaformin and make another appointment. (I was on 2x500mg a day but wasn't the best at taking them) appointment was 3 weeks later. Constant need for toilet stopped but then a week before the appointment started getting aches around my chest/upper body (anyone else had this a dull ache/discomfort in chest and arms) so I called 111 who sent me to walk in. They gave me a ecg all clear and BP slightly raised on one test then on next. They said everything was ok. Went to the dr's appointment last Wednesday and he treated urine no ketones and took blood sugars they were 12.7. He advised continuing metaformin being strict with them and a blood test (tomorrow) to check things out. I've been testing my blood sugars for the first time since the appointment. My mornings have never been below 8.7 and during the day I am anywhere between 10.7-19. I was drinking a lot of sugary drinks (2 litres a day) but I've stopped since the first appointment. I'm eating more fruit and I've always drank lots of water. I'd lost around 2st before all this started so I'd have expected things to be better not worse. I've also been suffering with numbness in my fingers and toes as well as the aches in my arms.

Really worried that uncontrolled blood sugars have caused damage. Anyone else suffered similar issues with type 2? I know metaformin doesn't lower blood sugars a lot but if it isn't working what are my options?

Yes metformin can disguise diabetes by affecting your HbA1c blood test. Also the prediabetes test came before metformin use so it could have been a honeymoon period as a type1 but without the correct blood tests we can only guess on here as we are not medically trained and majority of us aren't a type1.
I'd keep an open mind and await further tests after asking if you could be a type1 diabetic?
Sudden changes can occur as you suddenly started metformin or suddenly stopped it. Also you may have suddenly changed your diet and/or exercise.
Could you be overly stressed about your health at the moment? Causing the symptoms you've mentioned (other than urination).
Stressed out people can lose lots of weight due to being off their food.
When are you due to see your medical team next?
If you think you have neuropathy I recommend a supplement called R-ala. It worked wonders on numb toes. The only reason I'm no longer on it is its cost which I need to spend on prepations for bariatric surgery instead. A great support. A few makes out there now. Just stick to R-ala not just ala or the s-ala. Try and get a good percentage of R even though it can be pricey. I will return to buying it after my op benefits kick in.

 

[daisy1]

@He_Who_Is_T

Hello and welcome to the Forum Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask questions when you need to and someone will help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. Most of these are free.

• Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why
  
  
• Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
  

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

Hi, I have recently been diagnosed with type 1 diabetes and my symptoms was extreme thirst along with constant need to urinate especially at night. I also found it really hard to eat anything, I was lucky to eat 1 meal a day also lost alot of weight (5 stone) I was tired and felt drained also had alot of headaches. Hope this helps

This all sounds very familiar. I'm going to mention it to the nurse tomorrow.

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

Yes metformin can disguise diabetes by affecting your HbA1c blood test. Also the prediabetes test came before metformin use so it could have been a honeymoon period as a type1 but without the correct blood tests we can only guess on here as we are not medically trained and majority of us aren't a type1.
I'd keep an open mind and await further tests after asking if you could be a type1 diabetic?
Sudden changes can occur as you suddenly started metformin or suddenly stopped it. Also you may have suddenly changed your diet and/or exercise.
Could you be overly stressed about your health at the moment? Causing the symptoms you've mentioned (other than urination).
Stressed out people can lose lots of weight due to being off their food.
When are you due to see your medical team next?
If you think you have neuropathy I recommend a supplement called R-ala. It worked wonders on numb toes. The only reason I'm no longer on it is cost which I need to spend on prepations for bariatric surgery instead. A great support. A few makes out there now. Just stick to R-ala not just ala or the s-ala. Try and get a good percentage of R even though it can be pricey. I will return to buying it after my op benefits kick in.

Because of the pains in my chest and arms I've been sm really stressed. I work long hours and sleep poorly. I'll look for this supplement I'd pay anything for the neuropathy to ease. Thank you

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

After doing some reading on here today. I ate less carbs. My blood sugars on waking were 8.7 which is low compared to recently. I had bacon and eggs for breakfast. My bloods later were 10.8 again lower than rest of week. At lunch 2 chicken breasts I took 2 metaformin by accident took one while cooking then completely forgot and took another after eating. Tested again this evening 6.6 the lowest I've had so far. For my evening meal I'm planning scrambled eggs and pork loin. Will retest before bed. Wondering if the low reading is due to the mistaken extra metaformin?

 

[DCUKMod]

Because of the pains in my chest and arms I've been sm really stressed. I work long hours and sleep poorly. I'll look for this supplement I'd pay anything for the neuropathy to ease. Thank you

Hi there - Is there any relation of your taking Metformin and the onset of the chest and arm pains?

I was at an event on Monday where a lady with diabetes was talking to me about how she was getting along and so on. Curiously enough she mentioned that Metformin had given her chest and neck pains, which made her feel very unwell. There wasn't any immediate connection between the two, but she (unilaterally) decided to take a break from Metformin (as she had been having a phase of tummy reactions and she couldn't cope with both). Within a week, her pain had gone (and her tummy was better), so she decided to try harder on her diet.

Now, I had never heard of this acute chest pain before, and we see a few newly diagnosed T2s through the forum, so it may not be a common thing.

I'm absolutely not suggesting you have the same thing as that lady, but it could be worth asking the medics next you see them.

I do hope you get some clarification soon.

 

[DCUKMod]

After doing some reading on here today. I ate less carbs. My blood sugars on waking were 8.7 which is low compared to recently. I had bacon and eggs for breakfast. My bloods later were 10.8 again lower than rest of week. At lunch 2 chicken breasts I took 2 metaformin by accident took one while cooking then completely forgot and took another after eating. Tested again this evening 6.6 the lowest I've had so far. For my evening meal I'm planning scrambled eggs and pork loin. Will retest before bed. Wondering if the low reading is due to the mistaken extra metaformin?

Metformin doesn't work on a dose by dose basis. It needs to build up in your system to a therapeutic dose. Your lowering blood sugars are more likely to be due to the dietary changes you have made.

 

[ickihun]

After doing some reading on here today. I ate less carbs. My blood sugars on waking were 8.7 which is low compared to recently. I had bacon and eggs for breakfast. My bloods later were 10.8 again lower than rest of week. At lunch 2 chicken breasts I took 2 metaformin by accident took one while cooking then completely forgot and took another after eating. Tested again this evening 6.6 the lowest I've had so far. For my evening meal I'm planning scrambled eggs and pork loin. Will retest before bed. Wondering if the low reading is due to the mistaken extra metaformin?

And all without insulin?

 

[ickihun]

Statins can cause upper body pain and weakness too.

 

[He_Who_Is_T]

And all without insulin?

Just metaformin. The decrease from the days before was noticeable.