Can I do low carb, high fat with T1 diabetes?

[himtoo]

my experence of type 1 over 46 years with this chronic lifelong illness is that eating moderate carbs has done ok for me...i have outlived what doctors predicted for me back in 1972...........

 

[KK123]

No difference then. Mine came on within 4 weeks. In the November of 2014 I was fine. I upped all the high glycaemic carbarge and was on my way to an early grave. My advice is based on how the OP feels timing wise and in the context of the question, trying to reassure that low carb provides optimal results; I have not seen any cases where high carb betters outcomes in comparison. I see no point on going on roller coasters when the line (blood glucose control) can be fairly flat.

Hi Mbaker, I think low carb can have benefits for anyone but for type 1s or anyone on insulin, (well for me anyway), there has to be an extra caveat when giving opinions, low carb may well mean lower doses of insulin and fewer 'mistakes' but the dangers of hypo's cannot be overestimated. I have tried carbs of under 50 and even when I only use 1 unit of insulin, my levels drop rapidly into the 3s and sometimes the 2s. I find also that between meals my levels can drop based on all manner of reasons seemingly independent of how many units, and then I need to take on extra carbs so it really is a question (for all of us) of trial and error. Also what is low or high carb to you? One last thing, I am still in the honeymoon period, most likely like this poster and gawd knows how that adds to it all. I agree with those who say wait a bit, settle down, get to understand how it all works and then choose. It's not true that levels remain fairly flat for insulin users on low carb either, they may not go high but they can certainly go too low.

 

[Mbaker]

Hi Mbaker, I think low carb can have benefits for anyone but for type 1s or anyone on insulin, (well for me anyway), there has to be an extra caveat when giving opinions, low carb may well mean lower doses of insulin and fewer 'mistakes' but the dangers of hypo's cannot be overestimated. I have tried carbs of under 50 and even when I only use 1 unit of insulin, my levels drop rapidly into the 3s and sometimes the 2s. I find also that between meals my levels can drop based on all manner of reasons seemingly independent of how many units, and then I need to take on extra carbs so it really is a question (for all of us) of trial and error. Also what is low or high carb to you? One last thing, I am still in the honeymoon period, most likely like this poster and gawd knows how that adds to it all. I agree with those who say wait a bit, settle down, get to understand how it all works and then choose. It's not true that levels remain fairly flat for insulin users on low carb either, they may not go high but they can certainly go too low.

Please note that I provided a qualified answer which cannot be misconstrued. Your views and the other post, are another side of the coin which I respect. I stated what I would do and in the hands of Type 1 Grit the OP would do better in my view than on standard Type 1 protocols (this is a safe wall for a Type 2 to defer expertise to and does not compromise the potential well being of the OP. I am very careful not to mention my wife's clinic who deals with such cases, that I type up).

Diabetes hypoglycaemia, hyperglycemia, neuropathy, polyuria etc do not care what type we are, and the feelings and experience are the same for all types (I have after all experienced these myself), so if a fellow diabetic asks the question in hand, I will try to assist without being pushy. I re-read my post before posting to avoid stepping on toes. Clearly the OP is considering LCHF, my personal experience in this area and that of persons such as Dr Keith Runyan and countless other Type 1's I have read up on I would say make LCHF an option the OP can consider at their leisure. If the OP was to follow through, join Type 1 Grit and begin effectively low carb higher protein under their guidance, I would have no trouble sleeping at night, or worries that my words may cause harm.

 

[Jaylee]

Please note that I provided a qualified answer which cannot be misconstrued. Your views and the other post, are another side of the coin which I respect. I stated what I would do and in the hands of Type 1 Grit the OP would do better in my view than on standard Type 1 protocols (this is a safe wall for a Type 2 to defer expertise to and does not compromise the potential well being of the OP. I am very careful not to mention my wife's clinic who deals with such cases, that I type up).

Diabetes hypoglycaemia, hyperglycemia, neuropathy, polyuria etc do not care what type we are, and the feelings and experience are the same for all types (I have after all experienced these myself), so if a fellow diabetic asks the question in hand, I will try to assist without being pushy. I re-read my post before posting to avoid stepping on toes. Clearly the OP is considering LCHF, my personal experience in this area and that of persons such as Dr Keith Runyan and countless other Type 1's I have read up on I would say make LCHF an option the OP can consider at their leisure. If the OP was to follow through, join Type 1 Grit and begin effectively low carb higher protein under their guidance, I would have no trouble sleeping at night, or worries that my words may cause harm.

Good mornin @Mbaker ,

I wouldn't disagree personally with the points you make regarding T2 & diet. (My dad was T2.)
All diabetics no matter what type are indeed subject to complications as a result of unmanaged BGs

However, at this early stage of the OP's T1 on a new insulin regime & still in the throws of learning & tailoring dosage of exogenous insulin, then the "honeymoon" as the pancreas spasmodically pushes out its own.
Practically. It's not (ironically.) going to look like a low carb diet in these early stages of diagnosis for a T1 with all the hypo treatment going on & a little "something" longer acting before I do something or turn in for sleep..
In most cases of T1, there is no insulin resistance happening.

I can understand if we're talking to a longer standing T1 diabetic with mad swings & wot not. Then yep, try it out.

I'm a low carber myself in comparison to some of the T1s posting on this thread to date.
But I wouldn't advocate tweaking diet, before the dust settles on a new T1 diagnosis..

Have a great day!

 

[hooha]

I have read such mixed reviews about whether a high fat low carb diet is beneficial for type 1! I am already putting on weight after 4 days of taking insulin and don’t want to put on any more. Has any one got any advice on what diet to go on?

@Lydiagoodman93
LOTS of good advice in this debate . As a type 2 I am a bit out of this argument but I did enjoy watching Dr Troy Stapleton on youtube as he described his own situation ; one of the posters below says the LCHF can cause hypos, but ...well look at Dr Troy and get professional advice before radical changes.

 

[KK123]

Please note that I provided a qualified answer which cannot be misconstrued. Your views and the other post, are another side of the coin which I respect. I stated what I would do and in the hands of Type 1 Grit the OP would do better in my view than on standard Type 1 protocols (this is a safe wall for a Type 2 to defer expertise to and does not compromise the potential well being of the OP. I am very careful not to mention my wife's clinic who deals with such cases, that I type up).

Diabetes hypoglycaemia, hyperglycemia, neuropathy, polyuria etc do not care what type we are, and the feelings and experience are the same for all types (I have after all experienced these myself), so if a fellow diabetic asks the question in hand, I will try to assist without being pushy. I re-read my post before posting to avoid stepping on toes. Clearly the OP is considering LCHF, my personal experience in this area and that of persons such as Dr Keith Runyan and countless other Type 1's I have read up on I would say make LCHF an option the OP can consider at their leisure. If the OP was to follow through, join Type 1 Grit and begin effectively low carb higher protein under their guidance, I would have no trouble sleeping at night, or worries that my words may cause harm.

Hi there, have you ever been on insulin? If the answer is no then you most certainly have not experienced an insulin induced hypo. Your advice reminds me of all those non diabetics who continue to 'advise' what is best for a diabetic, none of us know what it is like to be in another's shoes and I will admit, I am getting fed up with being lectured by people who have NOT experienced type 1 life (not you, I hasten to add, I am speaking generally), I do appreciate you giving us your personal experience of things but sorry, I do not agree that your experience of LCHF and the experience you have gleaned from other actual type 1s means that you are any better qualified to give type 1s advice than any other NON insulin user. Of course any of us can point people in the direction of what we think they might benefit from but when people base their views on the experience of a third party, well I for one, would have no trouble ignoring them. By the way, I am an advocate of lower carbs but seek to caution other type 1s about managing/avoiding the hypos.

 

[becca59]

My concern with this thread is that @Lydiagoodman93 has posted two questions as a newly diagnosed type 1. Both threads mention the concern about gaining weight. A few days into diagnosis, this is going to happen to rebuild muscle and replace fluids.
Long term, a type 1 diagnosis does not necessarily mean you have to gain weight (5 years in my weight is constant) wether you low carb or not. I eat moderate carbs.
The most important thing is that that Lydia gets fit again, because let’s face it, prior to diagnosis us Type 1s certainly weren’t. Then there will be a few months of getting to grips with the new routine and then eventually working out what suits her personally.
Just carb counting, injecting, avoiding hypos and hypers,in conjunction with sleeping, working and exercise is quite frankly enough to take on board.
If, 6 months down the line too much unwanted weight has been gained then it can be dealt with. When feeling fit, confident and in control.

 

[Mbaker]

Hi there, have you ever been on insulin? If the answer is no then you most certainly have not experienced an insulin induced hypo. Your advice reminds me of all those non diabetics who continue to 'advise' what is best for a diabetic, none of us know what it is like to be in another's shoes and I will admit, I am getting fed up with being lectured by people who have NOT experienced type 1 life (not you, I hasten to add, I am speaking generally), I do appreciate you giving us your personal experience of things but sorry, I do not agree that your experience of LCHF and the experience you have gleaned from other actual type 1s means that you are any better qualified to give type 1s advice than any other NON insulin user. Of course any of us can point people in the direction of what we think they might benefit from but when people base their views on the experience of a third party, well I for one, would have no trouble ignoring them. By the way, I am an advocate of lower carbs but seek to caution other type 1s about managing/avoiding the hypos.

I was a former British Karate champion, training 3 hours a day, please do not patronise me by stating what you do not know about, as it was similar training to this with diabetes that produced hypos for me. What would you call dramatic drops from late 8 mmol to early 4's and dropping (even now I go into 2's well documented on this website in pictures, on multiple occasions), for the first time and all of the feelings of light headiness, nausea, shakiness and impending doom - check your facts, insulin is not the only factor that can cause a hypo and many an athlete will concur. A strawman argument with me to support your view and bias (I admit mine) is unfortunate, you appear to resent comments from a Type 2, so should "we" expect you to never comment on a cross over area where your view could helpful, you are positioning yourself into a corner. I align more with the Bernstein's protocol of LCHP over HF, as this is how I eat. My non - reliance on exogenous insulin is irrelevant to the OP's question and is mitigated by my position statement i.e. trust the advice and guidance of fellow Type 1's doing this protocol; I fail to see how you can complain about this safety valve.

Your argument is against a number of fellow Type 1's who ironically do what I have suggested as a viable option and have now been published on this (how you square this is a matter for you); following your logic, I would expect you to complain to your peers, all of the Facebook and Instagram groups etc setup and run by Type 1's - if my suggested approach is wrong, by definition theirs is as well, as these are identical positions, it is not really my problem if there are different approaches, I just pointed out one of those that is not unusual.

 

[himtoo]

I was a former British Karate champion, training 3 hours a day, please do not patronise me by stating what you do not know about, as it was similar training to this with diabetes that produced hypos for me. What would you call dramatic drops from late 8 mmol to early 4's and dropping (even now I go into 2's well documented on this website in pictures, on multiple occasions), for the first time and all of the feelings of light headiness, nausea, shakiness and impending doom - check your facts, insulin is not the only factor that can cause a hypo and many an athlete will concur. A strawman argument with me to support your view and bias (I admit mine) is unfortunate, you appear to resent comments from a Type 2, so should "we" expect you to never comment on a cross over area where your view could helpful, you are positioning yourself into a corner. I align more with the Bernstein's protocol of LCHP over HF, as this is how I eat. My non - reliance on exogenous insulin is irrelevant to the OP's question and is mitigated by my position statement i.e. trust the advice and guidance of fellow Type 1's doing this protocol; I fail to see how you can complain about this safety valve.

Your argument is against a number of fellow Type 1's who ironically do what I have suggested as a viable option and have now been published on this (how you square this is a matter for you); following your logic, I would expect you to complain to your peers, all of the Facebook and Instagram groups etc setup and run by Type 1's - if my suggested approach is wrong, by definition theirs is as well, as these are identical positions, it is not really my problem if there are different approaches, I just pointed out one of those that is not unusual.

have you been on insulin ? have you lived as a type 1 ?
perhaps walking in anothers shoes is relatable


i quote you just below-----

"my non - reliance on exogenous insulin is irrelevant to the OP's question " --

that is the only relevant point in this whole thread -- this op will be totally reliant on insulin the rest of her life and as such needs time to settle with the diagnosis and time to find her own mojo.....

 

[becca59]

@Mbaker are you type 1 or type 2 on insulin or not. Cannot see these facts from my I pad.

 

[himtoo]

@Mbaker are you type 1 or type 2 on insulin or not. Cannot see these facts from my I pad.

@Mbaker declares as a type 2 in remission

 

[Mbaker]

have you been on insulin ? have you lived as a type 1 ?
perhaps walking in anothers shoes is relatable

This is not an insulin question and in any event was dealt with in my original answer to an open question with due safety regard to the OP. The OP asked a question, I answered it accurately. Here are Type 1 Dr's you can take this up with Dr Troy Stapleton, Dr Keith Runyan, Dr RD Dikeman. There are countless anecdotes on line of end user Type 1's doing this. All of more points are there to be shot down if they are factually incorrect; you are a mod so could easily cross out words, phrases or the entire content.

 

[KK123]

I was a former British Karate champion, training 3 hours a day, please do not patronise me by stating what you do not know about, as it was similar training to this with diabetes that produced hypos for me. What would you call dramatic drops from late 8 mmol to early 4's and dropping (even now I go into 2's well documented on this website in pictures, on multiple occasions), for the first time and all of the feelings of light headiness, nausea, shakiness and impending doom - check your facts, insulin is not the only factor that can cause a hypo and many an athlete will concur. A strawman argument with me to support your view and bias (I admit mine) is unfortunate, you appear to resent comments from a Type 2, so should "we" expect you to never comment on a cross over area where your view could helpful, you are positioning yourself into a corner. I align more with the Bernstein's protocol of LCHP over HF, as this is how I eat. My non - reliance on exogenous insulin is irrelevant to the OP's question and is mitigated by my position statement i.e. trust the advice and guidance of fellow Type 1's doing this protocol; I fail to see how you can complain about this safety valve.

Your argument is against a number of fellow Type 1's who ironically do what I have suggested as a viable option and have now been published on this (how you square this is a matter for you); following your logic, I would expect you to complain to your peers, all of the Facebook and Instagram groups etc setup and run by Type 1's - if my suggested approach is wrong, by definition theirs is as well, as these are identical positions, it is not really my problem if there are different approaches, I just pointed out one of those that is not unusual.

So you haven't used insulin, thank you.

 

[Mbaker]

@Mbaker are you type 1 or type 2 on insulin or not. Cannot see these facts from my I pad.

I am Type 2, just trying to point out an option to the questioner that he was considering. I have a lifelong friend of 35 years on insulin, I assist my wife who works on all diabetes types in her own clinic, and am almost qualified in nutrition and diabetes management. I simply have pointed the OP in a direction many Type 1's take.

 

[himtoo]

This is not an insulin question and in any event was dealt with in my original answer to an open question with due safety regard to the OP. The OP asked a question, I answered it accurately. Here are Type 1 Dr's you can take this up with Dr Troy Stapleton, Dr Keith Runyan, Dr RD Dikeman. There are countless anecdotes on line of end user Type 1's doing this. All of more points are there to be shot down if they are factually incorrect; you are a mod so could easily cross out words, phrases or the entire content.

as mods we do not cross out things that do not break rules and so far nothing has crossed that line

it is indeed an insulin question and having lived on insulin for 46 years i feel quite qualified to answer..........
i often do days with no carb and still need to bolus for the protein and fat in the meal and i still get variations in BG levels surrounding exercise stress temperature ( the list is longer ) and experience hypos on no carb meals and highs also--- so until you have walked in the shoes of a t1d and are not just quoting 3rd party i would suggest you are talking the talk but not actually walking the walk

 

[Mbaker]

So you haven't used insulin, thank you.

This is the strawman. If the OP took the option (not an instruction), your fellow Type 1's I am sure would have looked after him. Where is this vitriol coming from, anyone would have thought, I was either passing on some snake oil or an untested new treatment. I will not capitalise this, despite your insistence that something is wrong. Stand behind your conviction and criticise other Type 1's who do the Bernstein protocol.

 

[Mbaker]

This is the strawman. If the OP took the option (not an instruction), your fellow Type 1's I am sure would have looked after him. Where is this vitriol coming from, anyone would have thought, I was either passing on some snake oil or an untested new treatment. I will not capitalise this, despite your insistence that something is wrong. Stand behind your conviction and criticise other Type 1's who do the Bernstein protocol.

This doesn't work as you have contradicted yourself. I do not need to have an amputation to know how it is. I have experienced severe highs and lows concerning blood sugars so again I do not need to know the difference between getting drunk on Vodka compared to Gin (for the benefit of all reading I am not trivialising insulin induced equivalents, but just making the point that a hypo is a hypo).

I genuinely tried to offer help and confidence to someone who asked. I did not break rules and just like if you were going to learn football, I suggested the OP go to the exact equivalent if they want to take it further, and arguably the most condensed amount of low carb management expertise on the planet ; vested arguments have been made turning this into do I take insulin, because I am Type 2 - sad really, when the reality is that many Type 1's take this option across the globe.

 

[KK123]

This doesn't work as you have contradicted yourself. I do not need to have an amputation to know how it is. I have experienced severe highs and lows concerning blood sugars so again I do not need to know the difference between getting drunk on Vodka compared to Gin (for the benefit of all reading I am not trivialising insulin induced equivalents, but just making the point that a hypo is a hypo).

I genuinely tried to offer help and confidence to someone who asked. I did not break rules and just like if you were going to learn football, I suggested the OP go to the exact equivalent if they want to take it further, and arguably the most condensed amount of low carb management expertise on the planet ; vested arguments have been made turning this into do I take insulin, because I am Type 2 - sad really, when the reality is that many Type 1's take this option across the globe.

Sorry, I have to disagree with you again. You most certainly DO need to have had an amputation to know 'how it is'. You may know something about it or have read a book or medical report but you do not know how it is.

 

[donnellysdogs]

I have ate lower to low carb all my life except 6 months.. ranging. From 20-70 a day.

The difference is, this wasn’t questioned at the time of my diagnosis.. yes, I had to eat 2 rich tea or a digestive if I felt my levels dip but I still never ate breakfasts or lunch meals and only small dinners. After I was diagnosed I had to eat something for those meals I used to miss before but it was minimal like 1/2 a slice of bread if I was pushed to or I think it was some sort of yogurt...
lunch was literally meat and small portion of veg. No potatoes, rice or cereal etc.. but I was started off like this, not changing to this.
I did it long before it was called a LCHF lifestyle and it has kept me slim and fit and no directly linked complications.

I considered myself at the time to be eating in moderation but it wasn’t until coming on this forum back in 2010 that I realised it was LCHF....

 

[himtoo]

I have ate lower to low carb all my life except 6 months.. ranging. From 20-70 a day.

The difference is, this wasn’t questioned at the time of my diagnosis.. yes, I had to eat 2 rich tea or a digestive if I felt my levels dip but I still never ate breakfasts or lunch meals and only small dinners. After I was diagnosed I had to eat something for those meals I used to miss before but it was minimal like 1/2 a slice of bread if I was pushed to or I think it was some sort of yogurt...
lunch was literally meat and small portion of veg. No potatoes, rice or cereal etc.. but I was started off like this, not changing to this.
I did it long before it was called a LCHF lifestyle and it has kept me slim and fit and no directly linked complications.

I considered myself at the time to be eating in moderation but it wasn’t until coming on this forum back in 2010 that I realised it was LCHF....

this pretty much is my opinion as well surrounding the so called LCHF -- i have eaten around 80-100 carbs a day for the past few years and always jus thought i was eating sensibly to my blood sugar meter -- not ultra low but not full blown western diet