T2, vegetarian and slimming world...how on earth is this going to work?

[LooperCat]

Thank you. Here’s where people start rolling their eyes at me...I’m a fussy eater. Along with being veggie, I don’t eat eggs (on their own anyway...eggiest I’ll go is quiche), mushrooms, aubergine or avocado. I haven’t tried avocado again recently but I have never liked it in the past. Trying to get my head round the contradictions between Slimming World and diabetes friendly foods. Avocado isn’t good on SW.

I know I will find the balance in time and find the diet that works best for me but at the moment my head is fighting with contradictions and a complete 180 on what I now should be eating as a vegetarian in order get my levels down.

The problem with SW is that they regard a can of cider as fewer syns and therefore a better choice than an avocado!

 

[merrymunky]

The problem with SW is that they regard a can of cider as fewer syns and therefore a better choice than an avocado!

I rarely, if ever drink alcohol these days...I’d rather eat the food!

 

[HSSS]

You have had an awful few months. All of which will emotionally take its toll. Recognise this and accept it’ll take some time to feel better. It will mean big changes diet wise. But it will also give big results. And truly many find new different food loves to replace the old ones.

However you really do need to forget what you think of as “healthy”. For diabetics much of is not. You probably won’t be able to work lchf into sw if I’m honest. And if you stick with it your bloods won’t improve and it’ll probably work less and less well anyway as your diabetes progresses so weight loss by that old method won’t work either. We in here can be your support and guidance as you learn these new ways, a virtual group not just weekly but 24hrs.

Lchf isn’t just low carb. It’s also high(er) fat. That’s what you need to learn to eat after years of being told it’s bad. Everything in you will scream against it. But that’s what will fill you up and give you energy. That’s what will replace the missing carbs.

Sadly it’s very much pot luck what the gp diabetic nurse and course will tell you as far as diet is concerned. Low carb is only just being recognised, and it is, but still far too many health professionals are stuck in the past and the starchy carbs advice knowing little to nothing of the most recent research and even tentative support for it. We in here are living it and have experienced the different approaches for ourselves. Even if you’re doubtful give it a few months of honest effort and see what happens.

Getting a meter I feel will be crucial. It will show you in real life what carbs are doing to you. That will help so much more than us in here just telling you.

 

[HSSS]

Some ideas.

Breakfast:
Fruit salad with a fat free vanilla yoghurt - swap for berries and full fat Greek yogurt
A small bowl of cereal with skimmed milk. - try a seed and nut based granola with full fat Greek yogurt
At weekends I will have 2 slices of whole meal or grain bread with peanut butter as a treat. - lots of recipes for lower carb breads or even better do some sort of cooked breakfast.

Lunch:
Jacket potato with cheese and salad, - salads are good
Cheese salad - cheese is great
Mixed beans and couscous -try cauliflower rice instead. I think it tastes more like cous cous than rice. Add veg and spices
Leftover red lentil pasta (usually with peppers, onions, sweetcorn and a passata sauce) with cheese. - swap the pasta for butternut squash sheets or courgette spaghetti
New potatoes and salad
Ryvita with soft cheese topped with peppers and cucumber - lots of keto cracker recipes online. Fathead dough is great.
Home made vegetable soup (with carrots, peppers, onions and parsnip). - just ditch the parsnip

Tea:
Quorn chilli with rice (although I sometimes use butternut squash spaghetti instead) - swap the rice, or just go without. It looks odd to start but you’ll get used to it. Add fats in some form eg oils.
Red lentil Pasta as above topped with grated cheese
Vegetarian quorn roast with veggies and roast potatoesjust drop the potatoes. Add more of other veg. Cauliflower cheese is great. Some use radish or turnip as alternatives.
Quorn sausages with potatoes and baked beans
Vegetarian curry made with quorn pieces, chickpeas and vegetables etc with rice - just drop the chickpeas. Add more of the other veg.
Jacket potatoes with salads or new potatoes with salad

Add nuts, cream, cheese, oils, mayo for fats where you can. You only need enough fat to feel full. Try and stick to meals as much as possible without snacks. A bigger meal is better for insulin response than lots of snacks.

 

[HSSS]

Being veggie may mean that the carbs are a little higher than some of us, especially in the early days as you adapt to new ways of eating but utilising the quorn for example will help the change over. You may in time find alternatives but for now try and focus on the other things then sort that. It will still be a big improvement on where you are now. Every step in the right direction helps.

 

[Resurgam]

You don’t get to 19 stone by eating well! I love ‘healthy’ food. Healthy if you don’t have diabetes that is, my usual SW foods that worked so well for weight loss and allowed me to have very small measure portions of my crisps and chocolate as treats when needed. However, like most obese people I like the junk too. I love bread, I love carbs. I would go bread crazy for weeks on end sometimes.
But on SW I only have it once a week and I make sure it is wholemeal. All these other carbs that are so good on SE like the pasta, rice and potatoes that account for many of my meals are off limits or at least need to be drastically reduced. Hearing that Quorn also contains these carbs etc. It just seems cruel. I feel like this is ow my punishment for not being able to stay Diabetes free.

I probably reached 19 stone on a diet from the doctor intended to lower my cholesterol - porridge and other oats, wholemeal this and brown that, low fat - you probably know the list better than I do.

I stopped weighing myself at 264 lb, as I was just getting nowhere with the doctors insisting that I could not possibly be gaining weight on their plan. I was doing it wrong.
There are protein drinks which are lower in carbs - though I think that they are more expensive because of that - and many 'body building' products are about 1/3rd carbs - but perhaps a thorough trawl would uncover ones which are at the lower end. Your diet is very carb heavy, so swapping anything you can for a lower carb option is going to help - even if some of the carbs are sugar - far better to eat a small apple at 11 or 12 percent carbs than yogurt at 18 percent or bread at twice that.
If you do not eat yogurt made from cows' milk, you can get Alpro soya yogurt - there is plain, coconut and another flavour which are very low carb - I set them with vege gell, whipping them up when they are just setting - the yogurt settles to the bottom leaving a clear layer on top so with the coconut one I add thin slices of lime and press them under the surface, then sprinkle desiccated coconut on top to hide the surprise.

 

[Pinkorchid]

There’s quite a logical fallacy in there somewhere, but out of respect for the OP’s sensitive situation I won’t labour the point. Causation aside though, personally I think encouraging a diabetic to consume a high carbohydrate diet is bad advice, but we’re all free to offer our views.

You do not have to eat loads of carbs on SW they can be substituted for other vegetables and salad if that is what is preferred. Not everyone likes rice, pasta, bread and potatoes so would not eat them anyway. They don't hold a gun to your head and say you have to eat starchy carbs.

 

[Pinkorchid]

I rarely, if ever drink alcohol these days...I’d rather eat the food!

I think you would benefit from the vegetarian section on this group they can give you more ideas on what you can eat. The main forum here are mostly meat devotees so have not got much idea about the vegetarian way of eating. There are lots of vegetarian recipes on here as well just look in the list of forums at the beginning

 

[HSSS]

You do not have to eat loads of carbs on SW they can be substituted for other vegetables and salad if that is what is preferred. Not everyone likes rice, pasta, bread and potatoes so would not eat them anyway. They don't hold a gun to your head and say you have to eat starchy carbs.

No they don’t force it but give poor advice. They parrot eatwell. Very little of the below would match good lchf diabetic advice as given on the site and increasingly supported by research. In fact a lot of it directly contradicts it. Taken from their own website that I linked to earlier

Diabetes UK suggests that people with diabetes follow the same healthy, balanced diet recommended for the population as a whole, ie, limiting fat (especially saturated fat), sugar and salt intake, and including plenty of fruit, vegetables and some starchy carbohydrate food. This is also the basis of Food Optimising.

Enjoy some carbohydrate-rich food
Enjoying some carbohydrate-rich food every day is easy when you’re Food Optimising. Carbohydrates affect blood glucose levels so it can be important to keep an eye on how much you eat. Wholegrain starchy foods, such as wholegrain pasta and brown rice, fruit and vegetables, pulses, and some dairy foods are good choices.

Eat regular meals every day
Aiming not to skip meals and eating a regular breakfast, lunch, evening meal (and healthy snacks when you need them) spread out evenly over the day helps control your blood glucose level and appetite.

Easy ways to eat less fat
It’s important to have some fat in your diet for good health, but not to have too much and to reduce your intake of saturated fats. When you're Food Optimising you automatically reduce your fat intake:

Fill up on fruit and veg

Include more beans, peas and lentils

The Glycaemic Index (GI) is used to group carbohydrate-rich foods according to their ability to raise the level of sugars in the blood. Choosing more slowly absorbed (low GI) carbohydrates – eg, fruit and vegetables, beans and pulses – can help you control your blood glucose levels. Wholegrain bread, pasta and breakfast cereals, sweet potato and basmati rice are also good choices. It’s easy to make low GI choices when Food Optimising, plus it ensures your overall diet is healthy and balanced too.

And a small qualification of

NB Some people with diabetes may be given specific advice on the amount of carbohydrate-rich foods or fruit to eat. If you’ve received this advice, it’s important to bear it in mind when choosing your Free Food.

 

[HSSS]

And with all due respect to the poster how many overweight and obese people have been going to slimming world for years? I certainly saw many (including myself) who either didn’t actually lose that much overall but just yoyo’d the same stone up and down. That either shows we were fighting against our own metabolism rather than working within it’s limitations or it was unsustainable. If it worked well in reality and long term for any of us we wouldn’t still have been so badly overweight.

 

[Flora123]

I rarely, if ever drink alcohol these days...I’d rather eat the food!

Do you enjoy alcohol or do you think it’s bad? Just asking as many people don’t drink because it’s seen as high cal. I honestly don’t think know could have achieved my results without it as that is my treat and it’s allowed. If you enjoy a tipple, have it x

 

[merrymunky]

And with all due respect to the poster how many overweight and obese people have been going to slimming world for years? I certainly saw many (including myself) who either didn’t actually lose that much overall but just yoyo’d the same stone up and down. That either shows we were fighting against our own metabolism rather than working within it’s limitations or it was unsustainable. If it worked well in reality and long term for any of us we wouldn’t still have been so badly overweight.

I lost 4.5 stone in 6 months on SW. when I stick to the plan it works amazingly well.

My problem is I have consciously sabotaged myself but eating bread like it’s going out of fashion alongside huge bags of crisps and chocolate a few times a week for months at a time when I fall off the wagon. The basic food optimising of the plan worked for me with weight loss. It just didn’t help my own stupid brain and willpower.

 

[HSSS]

I lost 4.5 stone in 6 months on SW. when I stick to the plan it works amazingly well.

My problem is I have consciously sabotaged myself but eating bread like it’s going out of fashion alongside huge bags of crisps and chocolate a few times a week for months at a time when I fall off the wagon. The basic food optimising of the plan worked for me with weight loss. It just didn’t help my own stupid brain and willpower.

It worked in spells well for me. Never lasted. I still would never entertain doing it as a diabetic now, particularly a vegetarian one.

Take a little time to digest (pun intended) all you are reading here, get a meter, experiment a little with different foods and then decide how you’re wanting to tackle this. You’re already leaps ahead of many newly diagnosed by being motivated to learn and make changes. Personally I think I’m healthier than I was at the time of diagnosis in lots of ways. I’ve heard a lot of others say similar. It can have a silver lining. Not the diabetes itself but the diagnosis if it’s already there hiding away.

 

[Hotpepper20000]

Hi all,

I was diagnosed with T2 on Friday. I’m still coming to terms with it, amongst other issues (see my post in introductions section for more info but in a nutshell this diagnosis came about as a result of investigations following the loss of our only baby at 16 weeks gestation in November.)

My initial worries with managing this condition is that I follow slimming world which works so well for me when I am fully on plan. I need to lose weight as I am obese, especially if I want to ever conceive again before time runs out. I’m already 38 with irregular cycles so time is of the essence.

As a vegetarian a lot of my diet is made up of potatoes, rice and pasta. I know that carbs are a massive issue with diabetes. I’m already a fussy eater and taking out these from my diet on top of having to cut out chocolate etc is going to turn me into a miserable sod!

I have made some substitutions over the last year such as using red lentil pasta instead of white pasta. I did this in a bid to reduce gluten intake as I am slightly intolerant. This was before I had an inkling I had diabetes. I also sometimes use the butternut squash spaghetti on place of rice when I make a quorn chilli etc.

I rarely eat bread when I am 100% on plan.

I’ve heard so many different opinions. Some saying just to continue SW as usual. Others saying to just tweak with carbs etc and others saying to discard everything and do the low carb hi fat diet. This would mean coming off slimming world as I would be over my daily suns every day.

I really want to get my weight down and get this condition under control. My hba1c level was 75 (9%) which seems quite high to me. However I am only just learning about these numbers and what they mean so I have no real comparison. I have been put onto metformin. Just finished my first week. Tomorrow my dose increases to two tablets a day, then next week, to three. I think most people on metformin have started this way. So many people say they have lost weight on metformin but you have to adopt healthy eating principles in order to do so...which I do when my head is in the game on SW. However, I have a big appetite and have never exercised portion control on SW when I am eating a free foods meal, (nor have I needed to, I’ve still had great losses). I don’t know how this will be impacted going forward.

Any advice?

Thank you.
Emma

Maybe this can be of help.

https://wordtoyourmotherblog.com/ve...al-plan-90-ketogenic-recipes-for-weight-loss/

 

[Daibell]

Hi. You've had a lot of good advice on this forum so far but it must be difficult for you seeing that it conflicts with what you have been used to. We all have very different metabolisms which means the weight gain with carbs will vary a lot. As long as you can maintain both your weight and BS with your current SW diet then there is no need to change but I suspect you won't be able to do that. Bear in mind that all of these organisations such as SW, Diabetes UK (not this site), BHF and so on rely several levels down on research that is strongly funded by powerful, global food companies that want to sell low-cost carbs. They trust this 'research'. Many of us have realised that we have to work out what really works and not what we may be told and that includes the NHS which follows PHE advice. I was pleased that my own DN recently told me I had to keep the carbs down to reduce my BS levels and I was pleased that she had also broken ranks with NHS central advice. Bear all the advice in mind and find out what works for you.

 

[zauberflote]

@merrymunky my heart is still going out to you for the miscarriage. I remember days and weeks and months of being on the verge of tears all the time after my second one. I think it’s hormonal. You have so much healing to do and have been given yet another problem on top of that! How are you even still standing?, you know?
At 38 I was fuller vegetarian than I am 29 years later. Since then I do eat turkey and chicken on occasion, but my ordinary diet is lacto-ovo-pesca-vegetarian. Where we differ is while I am picky about what I put in my mouth it’s not usually a flavor or texture issue. But I have gone from (discovered at 42) a lifelong dairy addiction, squelched soon, to a probably lifelong carb addiction until a few months ago....and now back to the dairy addiction!
I totally understand about never eating meat- I cannot envision ever eating red meat or pork etc again. It’s been 45 years since I did!. Of course come the apocalypse and I have to hunt meat or die, all bets are off!
All that to say, I have done well for myself on the LC front, and am probably eating more HF than necessary, as I lost 20 or so lbs quickly, but it’s very slow now. I didn’t set out to lose weight, but it’s been a good thing for me.
Whatever you choose, however you eat, we are here for you! Check out the “what have you eaten today?” in the low carb section, and the vegetarian diet part of food and nutrition. Loads of ideas both places. Just ignore the people raving about streaky bacon
Edit for clarity