MY DIABETIC REVIEW AND THEIR OPINIONS VS YOURS.

Q007

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466
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Type 2
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Diet only
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People who tell lies.
My GP (Dr Doom).
Sounds scrummy, you know my fave is a full English with sausages, black pudding, 2 eggs and three bacon. No bread, I dont miss it now. Of course washed down with a cuppa tea. It keeps my full all day. Great talking with you. Kind regards Q.
There's nothing you can say about losing my boy, but I appreciate every mention, my faith keeps me going and prayer.
Best wishes Q.
 
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xfieldok

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4,182
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Tablets (oral)
You should definitely avoid trans fats as so should the rest of humanity.

Sausages are entirely another matter. Look for the very high meat ones. Most supermarkets stock them. I get 97 percent ones from a variety of shops. Taste and test.

We have been conditioned to believe that low fat is necessary. We must have 3 meals a day. Blah, blah, blah. I came across an article about not skipping breakfast. It came from the good scientists at the Kellogg's Laboratory. Hello?

You will see many headline articles that warn this or that. Follow the money. Often the research is paid for people you wouldn't want to be related to.

It's a large learning curve. Don't try to do everything at once. It will start to drop into place bit by bit. Keep asking questions.
 
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xfieldok

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Black pudding. Specifically , Doreen's Black pudding. I buy 3kg at a time. Slice it into portions and freeze. Approx 14g per 100g, a slice is around 50g. We used to get it at Tebay farm shop, it's not local to me so I buy it online.

We are a wealth of information
 
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daisy1

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@Q007
Hello and welcome to the Forum :) Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it interesting and helpful.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 600,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

  • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
  • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
  • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

  • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
  • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
 
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kokhongw

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2,394
Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
For decades, big food and pharma have successfully persuaded us to fear fats and fasting, effectively misdirected us all from the most effective T2D solutions in plain sight.

Then tell us we must eat carbs to keep our brains alive...inject more insulin when we often produce so much that our liver and cells had become resistant to it...and prevents us from burning our stored fats...sending us all on a fool's errand and believing we have done our very best...and any complications we suffer is inevitable because T2D is chronic and progressive...

Rant over.
 

JoKalsbeek

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5,937
Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
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You asked if my derailing back on to living on crisps and cakes which have done the damage was emotional, you're right.

My grandson died suddenly and it broke me, I didn't care anymore and that's why I can't control, and need help with, controlling the snacking and the pull to carbs is so strong. He was just 19.
Q.View attachment 33226
When someone passes, especially when they're so young, there's no desire to take care for oneself. The reason kindof goes out of your life, which is perfectly normal. It takes a while to come back from that, though we never really do, not 100%. Grief tends to stay with us, though the shape of it changes over time. Thankfully, otherwise we'd never get out of bed ever again after a loss.

Take care of yourself the best way you know how.
 
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bulkbiker

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19,576
Type of diabetes
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Sausages and fats and processed foods had brought me that day.
He was partly right on the processed foods part.. very little to do with high meat content sausages and fats though..
 

HSSS

Expert
Messages
7,465
Type of diabetes
Type 2
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Diet only
hoping they can get the stones out and keep to gallbladder as I dont fancy an 8" scar, hence the laparascopic interest.
So was I but apparently that’s not a thing they do in the way they do with kidney stones for example. They believe the stones will just reform so it the whole thing out. Knowing what I do now about long term dietary changes I’m not so sure that’s correct but I don’t suppose it’ll change anytime soon. Maybe once low carb eating and it’s benefits are more widely accepted and some of the cholesterol myths are also put to bed.

It’s my understanding that the vast majority of gallbladder removals (cholecystectomy) are done laparoscopically unless there are complications. So three little holes too small even for stitches, just tape.
 

Q007

Well-Known Member
Messages
466
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
People who tell lies.
My GP (Dr Doom).
Yep it is. We’ve all done the same abseil too though and lived to tell the tale and enthusiastically jump over and over again when we realise how good it is.
Yes, I can see now how you all have done so.
Can you answer one thing though please; how does atherosclerosis happen. I'm stented up pretty tight now but they told me heart attacks ( clots can still form) on the entrance outflow edge of a stent, but its rare.

I can face a heart infarction if if I didn't pull through but not a stroke, I'm at a higher risk there as long as sugar is so high. I can't have a stroke CVA where I'm left with life changing outcome.

How does atherosclerosis happen if I subscribe to fats, saturated (unsure ATM what trans fats are, assuming dairy).

Hope your day is well. Q.
 
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Resurgam

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Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
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It is often overlooked that Dr Atkins of New Diet Revolution fame or is that infamy, started off life as a cardiologist, and that he got into diet and low carbing in particular because the accepted 'truth' wasn't working for his patients, nor for himself.
 

kitedoc

Well-Known Member
Messages
4,783
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
Dislikes
black jelly beans
Hi @Q007,
Given the recent tragedy you have faced and the pesky aspects of diabetes, grief counselling and counselling about eating problems are important considerations for you. Why your GP has not referred you for such is beyond belief.

Low carb high fat diet for T2Ds research has been published and the NHS has fast tracked the Low Carb for T2Ds program developed by the administration of this wensite in conjunction with Dr David Unwin's practice.
In fact Dr Unwin's wife is a clinical psychologist in the group practice and has made important contributions to the programme and patients in terms of helping people with decision-making and also with help about eating problems.

In the USA the low carb diet has been recognised as one of the three successful ways of weight reduction in T2Ds ( along with calorie restriction and gastric banding ( surgery).
I do wonder how up to date your health team really is.

With a very low carb diet ( ? < 35 g carbs per day) the amount of fat and protein one eats increases. These two are the best at relieving hunger and enable many of us to feel full enough that two meals a day is sufficient.
With carb intake that low we tend to switch from burning carbs for fuel to burning fat, as @bulkbiker describes above.
The switchover does create a temporary glitch in our well being called the keto flu, in the first few days on the diet and dietdoctor.com covers the explanation of this and what to do about it.

Fat has been demonised in the past but there was a lot of bad and misleading research involved and the food and pharmacetical industries have tried to falsify research to continue this myth in their own interest.( profit)
If you need a reference to rebutt what your DSN and doctor say about fat, ask them nicely to subscribe to zoeharcombe.com.
Zoe is a Welsh nutritionist, independent of food and pharmaceutical industry, lobby groups and Government who has reviewed all the literature about fat, heart disease, cholesterol and dug out all the statistical fudges which have been made to try to continue this myth about fats and heart disease and trying to discredit low carb diets.

If your health team cannot be bothered to read her work and others she references then they are truly blinkered and not open to change. A mind is like a parachute, it only works when open.

The choice of what you may do is yours and although we cannot give you medical/ nurse advice or opinion there are many on site who have embarked on the low carb high fat diet, some by themselves or with suggestions and support from this site and others through the program, and succeeded.
There is no shame in following exactly what your health team are suggesting. Those that have followed similar advice will be able to tell you of how they fared and why some changed.

Please obtain help for your eating troubles though as managing diabetes is a challenge without that added troubles.
The best success is to succeed, by hook or by crook.
BestvWishes:):):)
 

Q007

Well-Known Member
Messages
466
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
People who tell lies.
My GP (Dr Doom).
Hi @Q007,
Given the recent tragedy you have faced and the pesky aspects of diabetes, grief counselling and counselling about eating problems are important considerations for you. Why your GP has not referred you for such is beyond belief.

Low carb high fat diet for T2Ds research has been published and the NHS has fast tracked the Low Carb for T2Ds program developed by the administration of this wensite in conjunction with Dr David Unwin's practice.
In fact Dr Unwin's wife is a clinical psychologist in the group practice and has made important contributions to the programme and patients in terms of helping people with decision-making and also with help about eating problems.

In the USA the low carb diet has been recognised as one of the three successful ways of weight reduction in T2Ds ( along with calorie restriction and gastric banding ( surgery).
I do wonder how up to date your health team really is.

With a very low carb diet ( ? < 35 g carbs per day) the amount of fat and protein one eats increases. These two are the best at relieving hunger and enable many of us to feel full enough that two meals a day is sufficient.
With carb intake that low we tend to switch from burning carbs for fuel to burning fat, as @bulkbiker describes above.
The switchover does create a temporary glitch in our well being called the keto flu, in the first few days on the diet and dietdoctor.com covers the explanation of this and what to do about it.

Fat has been demonised in the past but there was a lot of bad and misleading research involved and the food and pharmacetical industries have tried to falsify research to continue this myth in their own interest.( profit)
If you need a reference to rebutt what your DSN and doctor say about fat, ask them nicely to subscribe to zoeharcombe.com.
Zoe is a Welsh nutritionist, independent of food and pharmaceutical industry, lobby groups and Government who has reviewed all the literature about fat, heart disease, cholesterol and dug out all the statistical fudges which have been made to try to continue this myth about fats and heart disease and trying to discredit low carb diets.

If your health team cannot be bothered to read her work and others she references then they are truly blinkered and not open to change. A mind is like a parachute, it only works when open.

The choice of what you may do is yours and although we cannot give you medical/ nurse advice or opinion there are many on site who have embarked on the low carb high fat diet, some by themselves or with suggestions and support from this site and others through the program, and succeeded.
There is no shame in following exactly what your health team are suggesting. Those that have followed similar advice will be able to tell you of how they fared and why some changed.

Please obtain help for your eating troubles though as managing diabetes is a challenge without that added troubles.
The best success is to succeed, by hook or by crook.
BestvWishes:):):)
Good day to and thanks for taking a few minutes yo write to me.

I love to study, so sending me links or websites is great as I love to read.

I hear everyone saying the choice is mine, well I do get that anyway. Please walk a yard in my shoes, I'm trying to undo the hardwired information I had over 8 Tuesday mornings on XPERT. Being nurses there wasn't a question they couldn't answer and again, I heard that phrase 'its your choice' I suppose it was the slides I saw showing how fat especially saturated fat causes atherosclerosis and that was a reason most of us were sat there with heart disease. It's so tough.

I used to be a management trainer before becoming a director in a business consultancy before health destroyed my ability to work. In both we changed nothing but peoples beliefs, the rest will happen. People who tell us they respond well to change unaided are usually found to be fibbing when the test comes. Even though I know how the trick works my 'belief' on that course was strong as I respond well to facts and evidence.

I've had some fantastic replies on this thread and I've been going back over them and seeds of doubt have cast a shadow over XPERT and I'm eating to my meter in the transitional period and, that's reasonable to expect.

Few things bugging me though,

We need carbs for fuel dont we? Yep I get it, we burn fat but when the fat and weight under control what'd I do then?

Several versions of low carbs mentioned as a ceiling; 25, 35,75. 25 and 35 are extremely low it seems but what's the number I have scales now where portions need to be measured out. I'm on a mission here, please catch me when I'm in the mood to start and again when I waiver.

I've asked several times, maybe I've missed it somewhere but if fats dont cause atherosclerosis, then what does. I wouldn't survive another attack and I cannot go the CVA route, I'd have to take care of business if that happened and I'm incapacitated. Life then wouldn't be for me.

If you're not yet fed up, I'd be grateful for this data then I can be on my way.

Thank you so much all, I've decided, because you changed my beliefs, to change my GP primary care and moving away from Jurassic.com

I'm booking and appt to go see the new one, a friend who's an RGN also moved to the same practice. They're short of GP's but the nation is short but have a comprehensive diabetic team, twice the size of present, men will always tell you size isn't everything but it's a pathway forward.

In the end heart failure will catch up with me won't it and I can't stop that, but I can slow it's progression but beating sugar. My mind is set on remission in a maximum of 2x 90 day Hba1c takes, nothing else will do for me than 40 or below. They told me 40 is remission is that right.
 

Resurgam

Expert
Messages
9,849
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
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Well - officially 41 is the top of normal - but I wasn't too upset to get 42 last time - OK - I was a bit ticked off, then I found that the really expensive work done by the dentist was on the wrong tooth and I'd had an abscess in my gum for weeks.
I did Hba1c 91 to 41 in 6 months, without trying all that hard.
 

HSSS

Expert
Messages
7,465
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Please walk a yard in my shoes,
Pretty much we all have (minus the heart issues) been told the same as you. We chose try something else.
I'm eating to my meter in the transitional period and, that's reasonable to expect.
brilliant.
We need carbs for fuel dont we? Yep I get it, we burn fat but when the fat and weight under control what'd I do then?
Eat more fat, and maybe protein, til we maintain instead of lose
Several versions of low carbs mentioned as a ceiling; 25, 35,75. 25 and 35 are extremely low it seems but what's the number I have scales now where portions need to be measured out
keto is typically stated as being 20 carbs or under but can often work a bit higher. Everyone needs to find their own limits where they are achieving pre and post meal numbers they like and weight is going where they want it to. You need to know the carbs per 100g and then work how many in your portion. Online calculators or books can help with this.
but if fats dont cause atherosclerosis, then what does.
Excess carbs are more likely. I’ll try and find the fireman diagram that’s often used to explain this.
 

bulkbiker

BANNED
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19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
I've asked several times, maybe I've missed it somewhere but if fats dont cause atherosclerosis, then what does

Carbohydrate in the diet causes arterial inflammation. Plaques build up to repair the damage caused by the inflammation. Cholesterol is part of the repair mechanism. That at least is how I understand current thinking goes.

We need carbs for fuel dont we?

There are no essential dietary carbohydrates so no we don't "need" carbs at all. Protein and fats are essential.
 
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Bluetit1802

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Messages
25,216
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
Treatment type
Diet only
We need carbs for fuel dont we? Yep I get it, we burn fat but when the fat and weight under control what'd I do then?

We burn dietary fat when glucose from carbs is not readily available. Plenty of slim people with no body fat to lose are fat burners, and several of them are members of this forum. NO we do not need carbs for fuel. We need fats and protein to keep us alive, we do not need carbs at all. We can live healthy fat fueled lives without them. All carbs do is raise our blood sugar levels, make us fat because of the needs for too much insulin to keep the glucose levels down (insulin is a fat carrying hormone), and cause inflammation.

One excellent way to help heart and stroke issues is to avoid all liquid oils except olive oil. This means no vegetable or seed oils for cooking, and no commercially baked or fried foods, ready meals and junk food. We need plenty of foods that contain omega 3 and as few as possible that have excess omega 6. That means foods such as oily fish like salmon, tuna, mackerel etc., nuts and seeds (flax seeds, chia seeds) Foods that are antioxidants such as strawberries, raspberries, dark chocolate, kale, red cabbage, spinach, and believe it or not, red wine. Oh .... and a 20 minute brisk walk every day.
 

Q007

Well-Known Member
Messages
466
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
People who tell lies.
My GP (Dr Doom).
We burn dietary fat when glucose from carbs is not readily available. Plenty of slim people with no body fat to lose are fat burners, and several of them are members of this forum. NO we do not need carbs for fuel. We need fats and protein to keep us alive, we do not need carbs at all. We can live healthy fat fueled lives without them. All carbs do is raise our blood sugar levels, make us fat because of the needs for too much insulin to keep the glucose levels down (insulin is a fat carrying hormone), and cause inflammation.

One excellent way to help heart and stroke issues is to avoid all liquid oils except olive oil. This means no vegetable or seed oils for cooking, and no commercially baked or fried foods, ready meals and junk food. We need plenty of foods that contain omega 3 and as few as possible that have excess omega 6. That means foods such as oily fish like salmon, tuna, mackerel etc., nuts and seeds (flax seeds, chia seeds) Foods that are antioxidants such as strawberries, raspberries, dark chocolate, kale, red cabbage, spinach, and believe it or not, red wine. Oh .... and a 20 minute brisk walk every day.
Thanks very much for the reply, I've lived on cakes and ready meals for the past 6 month. So I'm adjusting gradually so I dont give up (I only ever do that once).
You mention strawberries?? Could I have some with some cream as a snack? If so what weight and single or double.

What's your personal view on saturated fat?

Kind wishes, Q.