Two Year Clinical Trial Outcomes For Ketogenic Diet Published Today

[Guzzler]

Apologies if I've misunderstood (I don't know what 'crickets all around' means) but you seem to be saying that this is an RCT. The title indicates that it is not an RCT (randomised clinical trial) but is a non-randomised clinical trial. (That doesn't make it worthless, but does need to be considered when assessing the results.)

Crickets all around is akin to saying that the silence was deafening.
Even non random trials should, by rights, answer some of the detractors qualms, no?

 

[Dark Horse]

Crickets all around is akin to saying that the silence was deafening.
Even non random trials should, by rights, answer some of the detractors qualms, no?

Quite possibly - that's why I added the comment 'that doesn't make it worthless'.

 

[kitedoc]

Thank you @Winnie53,,
Yes i am aware of True Grit Type 1 and forum discussions from there and Dr Bernstein's Advocates plus Dr Ludwigs
'S blog and survey of True Grit members.
In Australia we have the complicating factor of the DaAA ( Dietitians Association of Australia who registers dietitans, controls undergraduate curriculum via accreiditing corses and also controls post grad education and has deregistered dieirtians in the past for prescribing low carbs diets to T2D/s here PLUS been sponsored by the food industry. They have manged to been implicated in sanctions against one Aussie doctor, Dr Gary Fettke and tried to persuade their NZcounterpart to deregister a well known NZ dietitian and promoter if low carb diet.. See also Jennifer Elliott vs DAA. Since retirement of thevprevious CEOat end of 2018, DAA now deny that they have any ties with the food indusytry even though some of their members are high up employees of that industry.
Of course LowCarbDownUnder are trying to do their bit with representatives consisting of docs and private ( nonDAAaffiliated ) dietitians in each Aussie State and Territory.
So i have been plugging away with local health authoritues and my endocrinologist here in Adelaide..
Of interest is that Western Australia sent a parliamentary delegation to the UK to see the Low Carb for T2Ds program directors at end of 2018. So there are signs of some change.
There are a number of very unhappy dietitians here because of the actions of DAA and hopefully things will change.
There is a lot of interest in low carb and keto diets in TIDs here but not much support from health professionals so this 2 year trial report is most welcome regarding T2Ds and that helps also to break down the barriers for TIDs as well.

 

[Winnie53]

My husband and I have been following the Fettke's story. We found Ivor Cummins recent interview with them illuminating. Hoping someone here posted a link to it and everyone has watched it.

My hope is that you all in Australia are on the other side of your difficulties now. Low Carb Dowm Under has played a huge role in my education, and I am so grateful.

One of the dietitians at our clinic was teaching diabetes clients the low carb/ketogenic diet here prior to her retirement. My hope is that one of the other dietitians continued that work after she left. Will soon find out.

Thanks for letting me know it was Dr. Ludwig who did the work with the TypeOneGrit group. I don't know why, but I have a hard time understanding his presentations. I need to find and read his blog.

Here in the US, I'd say Nina Tiecholz is on the frontlines of the battle here. Last night I listened to a recent debate between her and David Katz that was uploaded to the ReasonTV channel on YouTube. It was really difficult to listen too. I learned nothing from him and was very disappointed. He's hurting, not helping the vegan way of eating, which is unfortunate because I have friends who do very well on the diet. He appears to be heavily funded by corporations. It's heartbreaking seeing what our elderly are fed in independent and assisted living facilities. Nina is fighting for science based dietary guidelines that hopefully will improve the variety of foods provided to them. Right now, the food provided is ridiculously high in carbs and one of my friends has to supplement the food she's given with healthier foods from our local food co-op, which is very costly.

There are others here fighting the good fight: Stephen Phinney who arranged funding for the clinical trial led by Sarah Hallberg, Jeff Volek, Mark Hyman, Robert Lustig, Gary Taubes, Peter Attia, David Ludwig. And that's just in the US.

Thanks to this forum, I've been introduced to so many other's work around the world. So glad I found my way here 4 years ago.

 

[Guzzler]

My husband and I have been following the Fettke's story. We found Ivor Cummins recent interview with them illuminating. Hoping someone here posted a link to it and everyone has watched it.

My hope is that you all in Australia are on the other side of your difficulties now. Low Carb Dowm Under has played a huge role in my education, and I am so grateful.

One of the dietitians at our clinic was teaching diabetes clients the low carb/ketogenic diet here prior to her retirement. My hope is that one of the other dietitians continued that work after she left. Will soon find out.

Thanks for letting me know it was Dr. Ludwig who did the work with the TypeOneGrit group. I don't know why, but I have a hard time understanding his presentations. I need to find and read his blog.

Here in the US, I'd say Nina Tiecholz is on the frontlines of the battle here. Last night I listened to a recent debate between her and David Katz that was uploaded to the ReasonTV channel on YouTube. It was really difficult to listen too. I learned nothing from him and was very disappointed. He's hurting, not helping the vegan way of eating, which is unfortunate because I have friends who do very well on the diet. He appears to be heavily funded by corporations. It's heartbreaking seeing what our elderly are fed in independent and assisted living facilities. Nina is fighting for science based dietary guidelines that hopefully will improve the variety of foods provided to them. Right now, the food provided is ridiculously high in carbs and one of my friends has to supplement the food she's given with healthier foods from our local food co-op, which is very costly.

There are others here fighting the good fight: Stephen Phinney who arranged funding for the clinical trial led by Sarah Hallberg, Jeff Volek, Mark Hyman, Robert Lustig, Gary Taubes, Peter Attia, David Ludwig. And that's just in the US.

Thanks to this forum, I've been introduced to so many other's work around the world. So glad I found my way here 4 years ago.

Is this the interview you were thinking of?

 

[Winnie53]

Yes, that's the interview Guzzler. It provides an important piece of the puzzle.

 

[Mbaker]

This is superb work. Maybe Ms Alison Tedstone, Dr Katz and several others I could mention should take note. Those who keep saying yeah but, will have issues. They are very clever and always find a counter; which is why when there is a chance to stand up a be counted I would urge all concerned to do. This might take the shape of a register or similar.

Many have given video testimonials and newspaper articles, but there is no common voice, when I know there are probably 10's of thousands of us anecdotes, with medical records and results similar to Virta's, e.g on this site, Diet Doctor, the 1.6 million on the Banting site, Wric Westmans patients, Ted Niamens patients and many more. Consider the impact if we were all on one register.

 

[Caeseji]

This is superb work. Maybe Ms Alison Tedstone, Dr Katz and several others I could mention should take note. Those who keep saying yeah but, will have issues. They are very clever and always find a counter; which is why when there is a chance to stand up a be counted I would urge all concerned to do. This might take the shape of a register or similar.

Many have given video testimonials and newspaper articles, but there is no common voice, when I know there are probably 10's of thousands of us anecdotes, with medical records and results similar to Virta's, e.g on this site, Diet Doctor, the 1.6 million on the Banting site, Wric Westmans patients, Ted Niamens patients and many more. Consider the impact if we were all on one register.

Count me in for that if it ever came up because it s something that would give so many hope for the future!

 

[Winnie53]

Reading Dr. Ludwig's blog now. Forgot he is an endocrinologist. Thanks @kitedoc

Here's the link overviewing the work Dr. David Ludwig did with members of the Facebook group TypeOneGrit...

https://www.drdavidludwig.com/type1-diabetes/

And here's the link to the published results...

Management of Type 1 Diabetes With a Very Low–Carbohydrate Diet
https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/141/6/e20173349

 

[Mbaker]

Count me in for that if it ever came up because it s something that would give so many hope for the future!

Fantastic.

 

[ianf0ster]

I see that (at least in the MSN headline stories I see) the Dieticians are in full attack mode on Low Carb. Claiming higher Colon cancer, lack of fibre and vital nutrients etc. And claiming that only epileptics under medical supervision should do Low Carb!

Apparently nobody has told them that there are low carb high fibre veg - like Celery, Kale etc

 

[Guzzler]

I see that (at least in the MSN headline stories I see) the Dieticians are in full attack mode on Low Carb. Claiming higher Colon cancer, lack of fibre and vital nutrients etc. And claiming that only epileptics under medical supervision should do Low Carb!

Apparently nobody has told them that there are low carb high fibre veg - like Celery, Kale etc

See Paul Mason and Zoe Harcombe on the subject of fibre. There seems to be no proof from trials that fibre is essential.

 

[Winnie53]

@Guzzler, I think the science on whether fiber plays a role in good health is still evolving. It's my opinion that it's too soon to know. That said, I do value Zoe Harcombe's opinions.

One of the things I'm focusing on now is how to increase my potassium intake. I can only eat so much salmon and tuna. I need the plant foods too.

Potassium is an important mineral and electrolyte. Not sure, but I doubt I'm getting even half of what I need.

There's some research suggesting that potassium is protective of healthy kidneys - (please note that potassium intake needs to be limited and monitored once the kidneys begin to fail). I'll try to post a link to that study tonight.

 

[Guzzler]

@Guzzler, I think the science on whether fiber plays a role in good health is still evolving. It's my opinion that it's too soon to know. That said, I do value Zoe Harcombe's opinions.

One of the things I'm focusing on now is how to increase my potassium intake. I can only eat so much salmon and tuna. I need the plant foods too.

Potassium is an important mineral and electrolyte. Not sure, but I doubt I'm getting even half of what I need.

There's some research suggesting that potassium is protective of healthy kidneys - (potassium intake needs to be limited and monitored once the kidneys begin to fail). I'll try to post a link to that study tonight.

This 22 minute presentation may interest you. Enjoy.

 

[Winnie53]

Will view it again. But I think the science is still evolving.

 

[HSSS]

@MEValentijn for reference

 

[Winnie53]

@Guzzler he spoke to the issues of fiber and constipation, obesity, IBS, and IBD. He did not address how important a healthy microbiome is to health broadly enough. He's cherry picking research to support his position. Something some advocates of the vegan diet do all the time. It's not helpful.

My paternal grandparents, who were well educated and should of known better, were first cousins. Two of their three children developed two genetic conditions: IBD and a rare eye disease that causes blindness. Due to the IBD, my father and aunt both limited vegetables in their diet. They both died from cancer in their 60's. They're parents lived well into their 90's in good health. I am 58 now, and I have IBD so finding the right diet greatly concerns me. My father's and aunt's sister is in her 80's now, and doing just fine. She eats a normal diet.

My heritage is european (sp?) I have always eaten vegetables and fruit. I greatly limit grains. I've only had three IBD flares in 20 years. I'm having a mild one now. I am symptom free 99% of the time despite eating fiberous vegetables and fruit.

I think when deciding what diet is best for each of us as individuals, we need to look to our heritage, our family health history, and our health history. I will say this again and again. There is no one right diet for everyone.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Winnie53]

HSSS thanks for referring MEValentijn here. I hope she finds it helpful.