How long does it take for beta cells to regenerate

[Mbaker]

Type 2 tends to be progressive if the standard treatment is administered and followed. I actually feel it is criminal to advise Type 2's to eat "normally" and cover with diabetic drugs; I have 2 closed ears to any statement saying this is ethical (unless someone is in a palliative care situation). 600,000 plus supermarket items is also progressive, but not in a good way, unless you are a shareholder.

I lump all of the excellent theories into what I call "energy clearance", by this I mean the reduction of glucose in the body as a whole, the reduction of fat in and around the organs, the removal of inflammatory agents (certain foods, drugs etc), resolution of sleep issues (cell cleansing), and the reduction in circulating insulin. For me if at least 3 of these areas can be mitigated then remission is a possibility, allowing efficient beta cell usage .

If our diets were a airplane, there would be crash after crash, I know how Engineers would solve this issue. There have been 2 recent air fatalities on an otherwise complex system with an excellent track record. The root cause (change) has been identified which should bring reliability back. The changes in the late 70's to diet and eating frequency have a correlation that has had a profound influence on beta cell function in my view (as well as weight and a myriad of dysfunction). When the input is exported to another country, that country gets the same illnesses; when an individual removes the input they get healthier.

I don't need any further studies to tell me that our panceas's (and the rest of our body) cannot cope with the man made / altered foods.

 

[Guzzler]

Statements have a clear context:

"I was borderline, and these are the changes I made. Lost: 15kg (>2 stone) in 2 months. Cycled last year: 2,000 miles; 150,000ft elevation (5 x Everest). I'm fairly careful what I eat, but not overly so now, and have an A1c of 5.3% (34.4)"

was clearly indicating that lifestyle changes can lead to radical improvements.

If you actually want to help people, then a simple, 'tends to be progressive' correction (or whatever with perhaps a link to a peer reviewed study indicating that this is the case), rather than being unhelpfully snarky would make your comments carry some weight.

Language is indeed extremely important. Given what you have said I should have kowtowed to the practice nurse on diagnosis and taken the insulin she was going to foist on me. With a diagnostic A1c of 98 for her it was a no brainer, for me it meant some hard choices but those choices led to a recent non Diabetic A1c. Never take away hope because you stymie any incentive.

 

[Caeseji]

This last one, dedifferentiation, is interesting. Cells have evolved to preserve themselves. So beta cells it seems can turn into other cells, so there is a question of whether they can turn back into beta-cells again. A lot of research is ongoing in this area.

According to the study I posted which was on human pancreatic cells when restored to a normal environment either a lack of fatty acids that induced the T2 or hyperglycaemia they reverted back to beta cells rapidly so it makes me wonder.

I'm taking part in this Diabetes research at Exeter University. I'm glad to see that they have made some progress!

That is fantastic though, I really hope it goes well and keep us posted okay? Rooting for you!

 

[LittleGreyCat]

In December 2017 my insulin production was in the lower part of normal and my fasting BG was elevated so I had (I think moderate) insulin resistance.

So I am not awash with insulin.

I assume that my Beta cells aren't producing well, or that some other part of the mechanism which controls the release of glucose into the blood stream and the release of insulin to manage it isn't working.

At 6 foot tall and a weight wavering around 12 stone and a 35" waist I should be within the OK range.
Getting more weight off is a constant battle.

 

[Jessielouiseb]

In December 2017 my insulin production was in the lower part of normal and my fasting BG was elevated so I had (I think moderate) insulin resistance.

So I am not awash with insulin.

I assume that my Beta cells aren't producing well, or that some other part of the mechanism which controls the release of glucose into the blood stream and the release of insulin to manage it isn't working.

At 6 foot tall and a weight wavering around 12 stone and a 35" waist I should be within the OK range.
Getting more weight off is a constant battle.

How are your blood sugars now? Have you managed to increase insulin sensitivity?....at 6 foot you wouldnt really want to lose more weight as it can be unhealthy,

 

[LittleGreyCat]

How are your blood sugars now? Have you managed to increase insulin sensitivity?....at 6 foot you wouldnt really want to lose more weight as it can be unhealthy,

Struggling with BG control at the moment.
With a gentle nod to BMI I am still above the middle of "normal" range so not anywhere near dangerously under weight.

My waist veers between 35" and 36" so that is right at the top of the advisable range and I could do with losing some visceral fat to give my internal organs some breathing room. This may be one factor in me developing T2.

Prof Roy Taylor told me that the aim should be to have the weight and waist measurement you had in your late teens and early 20s.
For me that would be 11 stone 7 lbs and a 32" waist.

The only way I am likely to get near that is on a short term starvation diet.

 

[Member496333]

Prof Roy Taylor told me that the aim should be to have the weight and waist measurement you had in your late teens and early 20s.

I also subscribe to this idea. I dislike the notion of the “middle aged spread” as though it’s normal for people to become rotund and podgy just because they’re getting older. It may be “normal” but that doesn’t mean it’s ok. It’s only normal because it’s normal for people to spend their life eating bad ‘food’.

Only in my opinion, of course.

 

[Jessielouiseb]

Struggling with BG control at the moment.
With a gentle nod to BMI I am still above the middle of "normal" range so not anywhere near dangerously under weight.

My waist veers between 35" and 36" so that is right at the top of the advisable range and I could do with losing some visceral fat to give my internal organs some breathing room. This may be one factor in me developing T2.

Prof Roy Taylor told me that the aim should be to have the weight and waist measurement you had in your late teens and early 20s.
For me that would be 11 stone 7 lbs and a 32" waist.

The only way I am likely to get near that is on a short term starvation diet.

Yeah I’ve read a lot of research on prof Roy Taylor, seems very interesting.
If you do have any visceral fat I’m sure getting rid of it will help if your able to do it.
With my waist measurements going back to my late teens (I’m in my early 20s), would not be helpful as I was overweight then, I lost my mum at the age of 13 so comfort eating was what I did to cop for many years. So I’m sure I have a lot of visceral fat as I still have 6 stone to lose, but already have my blood sugars in normal range

 

[Veryanxious]

I also subscribe to this idea. I dislike the notion of the “middle aged spread” as though it’s normal for people to become rotund and podgy just because they’re getting older. It may be “normal” but that doesn’t mean it’s ok. It’s only normal because it’s normal for people to spend their life eating bad ‘food’.

Only in my opinion, of course.

I too agree with the idea. I used to have flat tummy and no bloating. I now have bulgy tummy and bloating even after achieving my early 20's weight.

 

[bisalimo]

In December 2017 my insulin production was in the lower part of normal and my fasting BG was elevated so I had (I think moderate) insulin resistance.

What were your fasting insulin and fasting BG then?

 

[bisalimo]

and that the beta cells can regenerate once the fat is gone if I understand right. I know I had fatty liver. Just got bloodwork done last week, and my liver enzymes have returned to normal. Wonder if pancreas takes similar path as liver?

What is fatty liver? can someone who is underweight all the time and has flat stomach (assuming he has no visceral fat) have fatty liver? My brother who is 175 cm (5' 9") and weighs 54 kg (8 and a half stones) is type 2 or at least prediabetic, fasting BG >120 (6.7) and his total cholesterol level is 7.4

 

[LittleGreyCat]

What were your fasting insulin and fasting BG then?

Fasting BG was 7.94 mmol/L

Fasting insulin was 7.17 mIU/L

Insulin Resistance Index was 2.28

 

[Caprock94]

What is fatty liver? can someone who is underweight all the time and has flat stomach (assuming he has no visceral fat) have fatty liver? My brother who is 175 cm (5' 9") and weighs 54 kg (8 and a half stones) is type 2 or at least prediabetic, fasting BG >120 (6.7) and his total cholesterol level is 7.4

Someone else can probably explain it better, but essentially there is too much fat in the liver. Your liver enzymes (via blood test) will be elevated. Good news is it can be remedied quickly with weight loss usually. Pancreas supposedly takes longer. Not sure on your brother since it doesn't sound like he is overweight. Losing body fat overall allows you to lose the liver fat. Again, perhaps someone else can explain better.

 

[Caeseji]

Someone else can probably explain it better, but essentially there is too much fat in the liver. Your liver enzymes (via blood test) will be elevated. Good news is it can be remedied quickly with weight loss usually. Pancreas supposedly takes longer. Not sure on your brother since it doesn't sound like he is overweight. Losing body fat overall allows you to lose the liver fat. Again, perhaps someone else can explain better.

It is possible to be lean and have fatty liver, either through alcohol or lack of adipose tissue to store subcutaneous fat but visceral forms quickly. You’re right on the money there, it only takes a little bit of a loss to make a big difference to visceral fat around organs.

 

[Sapien]

Struggling with BG control at the moment.
With a gentle nod to BMI I am still above the middle of "normal" range so not anywhere near dangerously under weight.

My waist veers between 35" and 36" so that is right at the top of the advisable range and I could do with losing some visceral fat to give my internal organs some breathing room. This may be one factor in me developing T2.

Prof Roy Taylor told me that the aim should be to have the weight and waist measurement you had in your late teens and early 20s.
For me that would be 11 stone 7 lbs and a 32" waist.

The only way I am likely to get near that is on a short term starvation diet.

You can reduce the waist without losing overall weight if you do strength training to built up muscle. That is a double benefit for glucose regulation. Less visceral fat improves insulin resistance and more muscle to take up more sugar.

Some people in their fifties and sixties weigh the same as the their twenties but with a much larger waist and much less muscle. BMI and the scale can be misleading.

 

[LittleGreyCat]

You can reduce the waist without losing overall weight if you do strength training to built up muscle. That is a double benefit for glucose regulation.

I'm a little dubious about this.
I accept that building more muscle can reduce Insulin Resistance and benefit BG regulation. However I am not convinced that building more muscle automatically takes the fat out of your viscera.
I am reasonably light at 11 stone 12 lbs at the moment and am still building muscle in my legs by extending the distance and duration of my cycling.
Riding with drop bars also strengthens your core.
However I seem to be losing more fat from my bum than my waist.

Less visceral fat improves insulin resistance and more muscle to take up more sugar.

Some people in their fifties and sixties weigh the same as the their twenties but with a much larger waist and much less muscle. BMI and the scale can be misleading.

I certainly have less muscle overall especially in the upper body.
This happens to you as you get older.
This would suggest that my target weight should perhaps be lower than that in my late teens/early twenties to allow for less muscle mass, and assuming that there is more body fat and less muscle to give the same weight.

Weight training is an interesting thought, but although I enjoyed it as a youth I don't find it as enjoyable now with all my joints being less flexible, despite regular Yoga. It might, however, be something to explore in the future. It takes me a lot longer to build muscle these days.

 

[Sapien]

Here is a body fat calculator (estimator):

https://www.calculator.net/body-fat-calculator.html

Maybe someone knows of a better calculator.

My target is to be around 10% body fat based on a weight and waist size that I feel well and look good.

My BMI when in university was just over 25, but this says fat was about 8.5%.

Now my BMI is only 22.8 and body fat about 10.8. I need to gain the right kind of weight since I look too thin overall but my waist is close to where I would want it to be. Unfortunately, I injured my shoulder and haven’t been able to work on my upper body (even simple pushups) for several months.

I think my glucose regulation issues likely have to do with loss of muscle more than to much fat although I probably have some visceral fat that isn’t obvious.

 

[Resurgam]

In my early 20s my waist was 24 inches, I was very active and muscular - I could lift a dead drunk folk singer off the pavement and onto the sidecar, as I did rowing, climbing, sailing and caving, plus dancing and running about. I was told I was overweight.
I don't think I'll ever get back to that sort of measurement, but my strength is improving.

 

[bisalimo]

Fasting BG was 7.94 mmol/L

Fasting insulin was 7.17 mIU/L

Insulin Resistance Index was 2.28

Thank you, in my calculation your homa ir is 2.53 as i divide your FBG x FI by 22.5
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeostatic_model_assessment , but you seemed to divide it by 25, where did you get that equation from?

Pravastatin 40mg for the cholesterol now discontinued due to side effects.

What kind of side effects? I used to take Simvastatin, but it gave me unusual tiredness and weakness, so I changed to Atorvastatin and have no problem so far

 

[LittleGreyCat]

Thank you, in my calculation your homa ir is 2.53 as i divide your FBG x FI by 22.5
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeostatic_model_assessment , but you seemed to divide it by 25, where did you get that equation from?

What kind of side effects? I used to take Simvastatin, but it gave me unusual tiredness and weakness, so I changed to Atorvastatin and have no problem so far

The IR calculation is directly from the Medicheck website.

Simvastatin turned me into a zombie.

Pravastatin turned me into a grouch.

There may be statins out there which can reduce my cholesterol numbers, and also not have the side effect of increasing the risk of T2 diabetes or making T2 worse if you have it.
However I have come to the view that high cholesterol levels aren't necessarily bad if the ratios are good; in fact they may well be beneficial.
So I am not in the market for any statins; this has the full support of my health care team.