how to stay under 20gm carbs

[nsh2111]

I'm not doing very good sticking to the keto either, I am bored with it and always have a strong taste in my mouth and it is unpleasant, I am having treats daily because i am suffering depression (biploar ) , my morning tests are 7 .4 maybe 7 .

I never went full keto as it's too restrictive. 20 grams is very few and having salad and veggy itself will tip over this amount.

 

[Mbaker]

Yes this will be something I will attempt after this experiment. I find easy to skip breakfast. Just need to find alternate to morning tea with cream.

As for works out, yes currently I am 2 days strength and one day cardio. Any advice on what the optimal mix should be?

I must say up front that I am hard core, due to previous sporting background where my mind was my strongest asset. I have been trying various combinations since January 2015. Loads of walking, light weights / weight machine, Karate punches and kicks, Tae-Bo and HiiT training at a gym class. This got me remission and good FBG around 4.4 and HbA1c's at best of 35 (from 134). This was physically and mentally very draining (but I was so grateful to be back from the dead).

What I have found is that muscle is something worthwhile building. This has benefits for Type 2 management in that glucose is up taken automatically via GLUT4 receptors independent of insulin. If you have more muscle then you have a greater surface area to uptake glucose. Recently I went really heavy with weights in a session, which yielded a 3.3 fbg the next morning. I had only achieved this figure after fasting a couple of days previously.

So my advice is to try and do functional cardio (I do Karate, blocks, punches and kicks with almost no rest) or a sport such as football / basketball /netball. If you are a runner, I would run shorter distances with sprints thrown in (much better than steady state (not knocking this, but if you optimising a push is required)). Specifically I would do lat pull downs, seated rows, bench presses / dumb bell presses, barbell squats and barbell dead lifts - the last 3 in particular is where I would look to make the gains.

It I very important to show respect to these movements as they can heal as was as cause injury. Over the last eight months I have improved my bench press by 36%, deadlift by 100% and Squat by 90%. I can train for a few minutes to have low 4 fbg's - massive bang for buck. It is possible to get great numbers via cardio, but this in my view takes more time and I personally did not like the really skinny look, I am more of a mid build now.

Now I like to back off on the weight on the barbell exercises by around 50 - 60% and rep out to exhaustion with good form. It is also important to know when to not push the weight too heavy, as this is taxing on the central nervous system, and additionally ego can lead to injury.

 

[nsh2111]

I must say up front that I am hard core, due to previous sporting background where my mind was my strongest asset. I have been trying various combinations since January 2015. Loads of walking, light weights / weight machine, Karate punches and kicks, Tae-Bo and HiiT training at a gym class. This got me remission and good FBG around 4.4 and HbA1c's at best of 35 (from 134). This was physically and mentally very draining (but I was so grateful to be back from the dead).

What I have found is that muscle is something worthwhile building. This has benefits for Type 2 management in that glucose is up taken automatically via GLUT4 receptors independent of insulin. If you have more muscle then you have a greater surface area to uptake glucose. Recently I went really heavy with weights in a session, which yielded a 3.3 fbg the next morning. I had only achieved this figure after fasting a couple of days previously.

So my advice is to try and do functional cardio (I do Karate, blocks, punches and kicks with almost no rest) or a sport such as football / basketball /netball. If you are a runner, I would run shorter distances with sprints thrown in (much better than steady state (not knocking this, but if you optimising a push is required)). Specifically I would do lat pull downs, seated rows, bench presses / dumb bell presses, barbell squats and barbell dead lifts - the last 3 in particular is where I would look to make the gains.

It I very important to show respect to these movements as they can heal as was as cause injury. Over the last eight months I have improved my bench press by 36%, deadlift by 100% and Squat by 90%. I can train for a few minutes to have low 4 fbg's - massive bang for buck. It is possible to get great numbers via cardio, but this in my view takes more time and I personally did not like the really skinny look, I am more of a mid build now.

Now I like to back off on the weight on the barbell exercises by around 50 - 60% and rep out to exhaustion with good form. It is also important to know when to not push the weight too heavy, as this is taxing on the central nervous system, and additionally ego can lead to injury.

Tennis and weights it is then for me.

I have also noticed tat if i do exercise in evening, morning fbg is always low 6's. May be i need to start at home 10 min of heavy exercise. some sort of home workout with dumb bells.

my problem is i never go lower than 6.2 unless i fast 24 hrs. then it goes to high 5's

 

[mojo37]

Hello @nsh2111
I feel I am on a similar journey to you in regards to I just can not get my levels down any further, I am 6 months into my journey so not as long as you. My hba1c was 95 on diagnosis and I managed to get it down to 50 in 3 months but I'm not hopeful I've brought it down any more (next hba1c is next month) as my fbg is hardly ever less than 6 and usually between 6-7 sometimes even 8 after food during the day and that's not due to a spike
I follow the lchf woe, usually about 25-30 carbs per day sometimes less as I often only have 2 meals a day as I just have coffee and double cream for breakfast. I don't fully understand whats going on. I know stress can be an indicator!
The nurse that did my 3 month review was so pleased with my hab1c so there is no way they will agree to me having a C-peptide or GAD test yet so I just have to wait and see what happens at my next hba1c and hopefully they don't just try and push medication on me!
Anyway sorry for ranting on I just wanted you to know you're not alone
It's so disheartening when others doing Lchf are doing so well
Hugs hope you get answers soon

So frustrating when you are obviously trying so hard

 

[Mbaker]

Tennis and weights it is then for me.

I have also noticed tat if i do exercise in evening, morning fbg is always low 6's. May be i need to start at home 10 min of heavy exercise. some sort of home workout with dumb bells.

my problem is i never go lower than 6.2 unless i fast 24 hrs. then it goes to high 5's

That combination is excellent. I remember I time I was getting 5's and plateaued. I would then see people posting 4's. One chap was walking 4 miles a day etc. My theory is that if you optimise as much as you are in control of, carb intake, lifestyle, stress, body composition, great things can happen. I feel it is like a blocked pipe which just needs different agents to clear. Good luck, except it won't be luck with the hard work.

 

[nsh2111]

Today I woke up with 8.6 but it's mainly due to muscle spasm I have in my lower back.

Lunch was chicken with peas and halloumi. Now I am 6.7. will try today as well with se carbs

 

[EllieM]

If it were me, I would be seriously upset that I had toast with breakfast, since it is considered very important to keep the BG spikes down below 8.0 - or even 7.8 as I have read in some places that at around 7.6 to 7.8 is when the retinopathy and other damage is done.

Look, T1 here so obviously I'm in the wrong forum but....

I am amazed at how tight you T2s seem to need to keep your blood sugars.

T1 for 49 years, no complications yet (other than on again off again background retinopathy) , and my blood sugars are nowhere like the ones you're aiming for. My first 15 years were pre-glucometer, and now I'm hovering at the 6.5 to 7 hba1c with my main risk being that of losing hypo awareness if I go too low....

Probably I'm lucky in that my body is tolerant of 50 years of blood sugar spikes (think Mount Everest on occasion), but, genuine question.,

Are higher blood sugars worse for T2s than T1s?

 

[Goonergal]

Are higher blood sugars worse for T2s than T1s?

Hi @EllieM

A very interesting question, to which I don't know the answer.

It's probably worthy of its own thread to avoid the possibility of derailing this one for the OP.

 

[Brunneria]

Look, T1 here so obviously I'm in the wrong forum but....

I am amazed at how tight you T2s seem to need to keep your blood sugars.

T1 for 49 years, no complications yet (other than on again off again background retinopathy) , and my blood sugars are nowhere like the ones you're aiming for. My first 15 years were pre-glucometer, and now I'm hovering at the 6.5 to 7 hba1c with my main risk being that of losing hypo awareness if I go too low....

Probably I'm lucky in that my body is tolerant of 50 years of blood sugar spikes (think Mount Everest on occasion), but, genuine question.,

Are higher blood sugars worse for T2s than T1s?

I think (and this is based on no more than hanging around the forum, and reading both the T1 and the T2 threads), is that there is a vast difference between the two. It comes down to beta cells and insulin resistance.

T1s have already lost (or are rapidly losing) their beta cells. Its auto immune. They are dying. T1s have lots of valid concerns about maintaining bg at their target levels, to prevent all the complications, but sooner or later their beta cells are gonna kick the bucket, or they have already done so. Their complications are going t9 be mainly from high bgs damaging nerves and blood vessels, and so on.

On the other hand, T2s are killing healthy functioning beta cells every time their blood glucose rises high enough. That is generally considered to be above 7.8 mmol/l ( yes, there is some debate on that, but whatever the actual figure is, damage happens above that figure). So for a T2, every time you go above 7.8mmol/l you are slowly and incrementally killing more of the beta cells, raising insulin resistance, raising the knock on risks of insulin resistance (heart disease, Alzheimers, strokes, etc.), AND risking the same damage that T1s get with high blood glucose. T2s are also, spike by spike, inching closer to more medication and eventual insulin as their beta cells die off.

So I totally get why T2s are often preoccupied with not going above the 7.8mmol/l ceiling.

(Of course, T1s with insulin resistance get the disadvantages of both worlds, minus the beta cells.)

 

[ShortStuff]

I think (and this is based on no more than hanging around the forum, and reading both the T1 and the T2 threads), is that there is a vast difference between the two. It comes down to beta cells and insulin resistance.

T1s have already lost (or are rapidly losing) their beta cells. Its auto immune. They are dying. T1s have lots of valid concerns about maintaining bg at their target levels, to prevent all the complications, but sooner or later their beta cells are gonna kick the bucket, or they have already done so. Their complications are going t9 be mainly from high bgs damaging nerves and blood vessels, and so on.

On the other hand, T2s are killing healthy functioning beta cells every time their blood glucose rises high enough. That is generally considered to be above 7.8 mmol/l ( yes, there is some debate on that, but whatever the actual figure is, damage happens above that figure). So for a T2, every time you go above 7.8mmol/l you are slowly and incrementally killing more of the beta cells, raising insulin resistance, raising the knock on risks of insulin resistance (heart disease, Alzheimers, strokes, etc.), AND risking the same damage that T1s get with high blood glucose. T2s are also, spike by spike, inching closer to more medication and eventual insulin as their beta cells die off.

So I totally get why T2s are often preoccupied with not going above the 7.8mmol/l ceiling.

(Of course, T1s with insulin resistance get the disadvantages of both worlds, minus the beta cells.)

That’s a great concise explanation! And I like the ‘spike by spike’ sound bite!

I’m having a hard time with it all at the moment despite 11weeks of very low carbing (under 30g a day), IF and drinking lots of water, my BG’s are still not great and I’ve only lost 2kg, I’m feeling very ‘F@#£ it’ - which is why I’m reading & posting (it helps remind me why I’m doing this) and I’ll grab any ‘sound bites’ I can to keep me on the wagon. ‘Spike by spike’ like it thanks!!