Obesity, T2 and my right to eat the diet that will heal me

[lucylocket61]

Part of the problem, as i see it (and I could be wrong) is the quantity of beans I would have to eat to get enough protein. The problem being that this also increases the amount of carbs as beans are mainly carb. Whereas I can have protein from an animal source and have no carbs.

 

[lindisfel]

So where does the protein in say, beans come from?

I used the term generally deliberately.
Animal protein is much more digestible than bean protein that can be problematic for some. Of course there are oils and protein in plants but generally there is a common energy source, from the Sun, unless the energy source comes from heat energy deep in the sea at the bottom of the deep ocean.
The main mass of plants is from the green stuff and carbohydrate in nature. That's why we can lock up carbon in carbon sinks.
D.

 

[lindisfel]

Mr Pots will put me right if I am wrong, but animal protein is more complex than plant protein. If we just eat plant protein our diets are deficient.
D.

Part of the problem, as i see it (and I could be wrong) is the quantity of beans I would have to eat to get enough protein. The problem being that this also increases the amount of carbs as beans are mainly carb. Whereas I can have protein from an animal source and have no carbs.

 

[lucylocket61]

Mr Pots will put me right if I am wrong, but animal protein is more complex than plant protein. If we just eat plant protein our diets are deficient.
D.

I think if you combine them correctly then a complete protein happens.

 

[Diakat]

“Drilling starts for 'hot rocks' power in Cornwall. Drilling work is beginning at what may become the first deep geothermal power plant in the UK. Two wells will be drilled 2.8 miles (4.5km) and 1.5 miles (2.5km) into granite near Redruth, Cornwall, where the temperature is up to 200C (390F)”

The work is ongoing.

There is also other work across the UK and the amount of geothermal work in Europe is quite substantial. I will leave you to google it and make of it what you wish. It may yet prove to be one of a number of sources of alternative energy to hydrocarbons, keeping our meat eaters in meat.

I should add that the term exploratory doesn’t apply in the sense that they know the heat sources are there, it is more the case of tapping into them in a viable and economically acceptable way.

Yes, so still exploratory and not commercial just as my previous post noted.

 

[Mr_Pot]

Mr Pots will put me right if I am wrong, but animal protein is more complex than plant protein. If we just eat plant protein our diets are deficient.
D.

Actually I had to look it up to be sure . Most animal sources of protein contain all 9 essential amino acids but vegetable sources in general do not contain the complete set. However you can mix your vegetable sources to get what you need, it's just requires more planning. As @lucylocket61 points out it gets more difficult if you want to have all the essential amino acids at the same time as having a low carb vegetarian diet.

 

[Brunneria]

Its actually very easy to combine plant foods to give complete protein in a single meal
https://www.verywellfit.com/vegan-protein-combinations-2506396

But it is no longer considered necessary to eat all the different amino acids in a single meal.
It is now believed to be ok to spread the different protein sources across the day
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein_combining

Many of the combos are very natural and appetising - although of very variable carb content.
There are also a number of plant foods (soy, amaranth, chia...) which have all the nec amino acids and are ‘complete’.

 

[Winnie53]

Its actually very easy to combine plant foods to give complete protein in a single meal
https://www.verywellfit.com/vegan-protein-combinations-2506396

But it is no longer considered necessary to eat all the different amino acids in a single meal.
It is now believed to be ok to spread the different protein sources across the day
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein_combining

Many of the combos are very natural and appetising - although of very variable carb content.
There are also a number of plant foods (soy, amaranth, chia...) which have all the nec amino acids and are ‘complete’.

Brunneria, thanks for the first link. It provided a needed refresher.

I understand the concept of combining plant foods. The author of Diet for a Small Planet was invited to present her story and dietary recommendations here in the 80's, and many of her recipes were quite good. But I was in my 20's then and a lot more metabolically healthy. I think most of those recipes would be too high in carbs for me today. What's the workaround for that?

 

[Winnie53]

I am currently reading Bee Wilson's new book: 'How We Eat Now'. She gives a very measured and down to earth account of how and what we eat in wealthy countries is dominated by fast food and the resulting poor nutrition and why people living in emerging economies are demanding more 'luxury' foodstuffs like meat and dairy to the detriment of their health and the further destruction of both local environments and our planet as a whole. Very enlightening and sobering.

The debate should not be about personal eating preferences being safeguarded but about creating a safe food future and a flourishing environment for our children and future generations.

By the way, most of the crops grown in deforested areas are destined for animal feed, not direct human consumption. Obviously, once it gets into an animal's stomach, it ends up in the human food chain anyway and soya products (as the biggest example) are ubiquitous in fast food formulas.

dms1, it's not a food preference for me. It's a necessity.

Gosh, I know I'm repeating myself but there is no one diet that works for everyone. And when you add autoimmune disease on top of the diabetes, what one can eat and not eat becomes even more complex.

And diabetes medications and/or insulin, while necessary some, is not a good long term strategy for most type 2's. That leaves diet, physical activity, time restricted feeding, and fasting to maintain blood glucose levels.

I think we need to be honest about what's workable and not workable when discussing diet and climate change. India has a huge problem with diabetes. When the mother is undernourished during pregnancy, the child is far more likely to be predisposed to developing type 2 diabetes despite having a normal BMI...

 

[Listlad]

Yes, so still exploratory and not commercial just as my previous post noted.

Not exploratory but not commercial yet. Be positive and see how it goes. It looks very promising.

As you are interested. Did you look to see how much geothermal work is being carried out across Europe? It is quite substantial.

 

[Diakat]

Not exploratory but not commercial yet. Be positive and see how it goes. It looks very promising.

As you are interested. Did you look to see how much geothermal work is being carried out across Europe? It is quite substantial.

Yes I am interested, that is why I asked and specifically about the UK. To me at present Cornwall means lithium.

 

[Listlad]

Yes I am interested, that is why I asked and specifically about the UK. To me at present Cornwall means lithium.

It’s a global problem though so geothermal solutions across the globe will be beneficial to us in the U.K. too.

Lithium. Yes Cornwall has always been a rich source of metals. Rich source of radon too.

Lookout for activity in other areas such as outside of Aberdeen where there is geothermal potential.

 

[lindisfel]

Its actually very easy to combine plant foods to give complete protein in a single meal
https://www.verywellfit.com/vegan-protein-combinations-2506396

But it is no longer considered necessary to eat all the different amino acids in a single meal.
It is now believed to be ok to spread the different protein sources across the day
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein_combining

Many of the combos are very natural and appetising - although of very variable carb content.
There are also a number of plant foods (soy, amaranth, chia...) which have all the nec amino acids and are ‘complete’.

The problem is in my book other considerations.
We have depleted our soils and they have lost much of their sequested carbon.
Mixed farming seems to be the best solution on farmed land to restore soils with good old fashioned muck.
D.

 

[Mbaker]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_pollution

seem whatever we do, it's between the devil and the deep blue sea.

and as for CJD.

now we are all pretty sure that SOMEONE said '
'It's oK, feeding cows this food stuff, will be ok, we did plenty of research .."..right.

it's always OK...
until it isn't.

whole food groups demonised for some spurious reasons,
chemical companies taking up the slack willingly $$$
food pumped stupidly full of sugars, like some crack dealer, trying to entice then retain the 'customer'

All this Has now led us to a world wide situation where the obesity crisis is looming large, pre diabeteic, diabettic *(t2) are increasingly moving down the age ranges,
( and its a headlong rush if the NFLD scenario works out.)
ALL from those in power who we trusted, who kept telling us //"It's ok..we done lots of research"

Now for a forum full of people trying desperately to find a solution to the foods THEY said were OK,
but we know now were slowly killing us.

i can only find one comfort.

That those we trust...
maybe we shouldn't.

Question everything. make them Prove their case, not cow tow to the noisiest groups or
those willing to pay to sway the impending actions

paper pollutes, plastic pollutes.

lets make sure we find the answers for tomorrow
NOT the problems for the Day after.

.

Great post, for a long time I was angry, as I ate alot of oats and sweet fruit not knowing how high the sugar was.

Actually I had to look it up to be sure . Most animal sources of protein contain all 9 essential amino acids but vegetable sources in general do not contain the complete set. However you can mix your vegetable sources to get what you need, it's just requires more planning. As @lucylocket61 points out it gets more difficult if you want to have all the essential amino acids at the same time as having a low carb vegetarian diet.

It is important to understand that the numbers are pretty much meaningless, e.g. 70 grams of plant protein is not the same as 70 grams of animal equivalent. The important aspect is bioavailability to your body. This should not be underestimated. Around 50% of Europeans can for example convert the beta carotene in carrots to Vitamin A. In addition the volumes of food required to extract the goodness is significant.

 

[lindisfel]

It’s a global problem though so geothermal solutions across the globe will be beneficial to us in the U.K. too.

Lithium. Yes Cornwall has always been a rich source of metals. Rich source of radon too.

Lookout for activity in other areas such as outside of Aberdeen where there is geothermal potential.

Problem is since the Iapatus Ocean plate closed there have not been much thermal energy near enough the surface in UK to extract the heat.
Where does the heat come from on the granites, is from radiation from the rocks? Hence all that radon gas in some areas, it is apparently a major source of lung cancer. It's an alpha emitter like depleted Uranium. There was a lot of radon coming into homes on the escarpment south of Waddington in Lincs but that is limestone near the surface. My mother in law had to have an extract pump installed in her cottage because the in house levels were too high but she didn't smoke. Don't smoke if you live on radon deposits.
D.

 

[Listlad]

Problem is since the Iapatus Ocean plate closed there have not been much thermal energy near enough the surface in UK to extract the heat.
Where does the heat come from on the granites, is from radiation from the rocks? Hence all that radon gas in some areas, it is apparently a major source of lung cancer. It's an alpha emitter like depleted Uranium.

Haha. You are speaking my language. I have straddled the Iapetus Suture.

Exactly, radon isn’t good. Having said that it hasn’t harmed the average Aberdonian.

They have known about the hot rocks thing in Cornwall for many years. So it isn’t new. The current effort is seeking to put a power plant on the surface.

If you drill deep enough though, it will always get hotter. So outlayers (outwith granite sources) like the rest of the U.K. are still in with a shout, pending costs and technology.

It is of course one of a range of solutions to deal with climate change. And keep the meat eaters happy. They are having a lot of success in the Paris Basin with geothermal, for example.

 

[lindisfel]

Haha. You are speaking my language. I have straddled the Iapetus Suture.

Exactly, radon isn’t good. Having said that it hasn’t harmed the average Aberdonian.

They have known about the hot rocks thing in Cornwall for many years. So it isn’t new. The current effort is seeking to put a power plant on the surface.

If you drill deep enough though, it will always get hotter. So outlayers (outwith granite sources) like the rest of the U.K. are still in with a shout, pending costs and technology.

It is of course one of a range of solutions to deal with climate change. And keep the meat eaters happy. They are having a lot of success in the Paris Basin with geothermal, for example.

Hi Listlad,
Are you a geologist?

Climate change and man's actions are massive inputs.
I see Ireland is critical of Brazil's Trump!
But Ireland have destroyed a massive carbon sink in its use of the peat accumulated since the last Ice age in power stations.
Europe also are destroying and extracting peat. It has lessened in the UK.

We are now restoring our peat bogs in Cumbria.
We destroyed much of the Flow Country by putting in a far less productive carbon sink, pine trees!
Millionaire owners stored their cash there as a tax haven. Now we are taking out the trees and restoring the peat and water table, I just hope our Greenshank and other waders come back.

Its a case of him who has no sin (in his own eyes) not be reminded of throwing his last carbon sink!
D.

 

[Listlad]

Hi Listlad,
Are you a geologist?

Climate change and man's actions are massive inputs.
I see Ireland is critical of Brazil's Trump!
But Ireland have destroyed a massive carbon sink in its use of the peat accumulated since the last Ice age in power stations.
Europe also are destroying and extracting peat. It has lessened in the UK.

We are now restoring our peat bogs in Cumbria.
We destroyed much of the Flow Country by putting in a far less productive carbon sink, pine trees!
Millionaire owners stored their cash there as a tax haven. Now we are taking out the trees and restoring the peat and water table, I just hope our Greenshank and other waders come back.

Its a case of him who has no sin (in his own eyes) not be reminded of throwing his last carbon sink!
D.

I have been known to be one.

Getting the balance on everything is not going to be easy. We always seem to be robbing Peter to pay Paul. But the onus is on us all to sort the mess out so that our children etc can live on the planet and eat meat and dairy produce at will,

 

[Diakat]

I have been known to be one.

Getting the balance on everything is not going to be easy. We always seem to be robbing Peter to pay Paul. But the onus is on us all to sort the mess out so that our children etc can live on the planet and eat meat and dairy produce at will,

Surely the true geologist’s dream is to keep burning the fossil fuels creating more carbon and see what happens? That’s an amazing geological experiment.
Not being serious by the way.

 

[Listlad]

Surely the true geologist’s dream is to keep burning the fossil fuels creating more carbon and see what happens? That’s an amazing geological experiment.
Not being serious by the way.

That would be an experiment indeed.

I wouldn’t describe it as a geologist’s dream. Geologists have a role to ensure sustainability aswell as to exploit the geologically derived wealth on the planet.

In my case it has been my livelihood and one that has evaporated recently owing in part to alternative energy sources being developed.