Did you achieve remission by following HCLF?

[pr126]

Thanks for the new replies folks. I am still interested in hearing from anyone who has achieved remission with high carb low fat.

@JohnyT2 Could you maybe copy your post onto the thread below as it could be useful to others. Thanks.

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/th...to-achieve-remission-excl-lchf-and-nd.156354/

I don't think you'll find anyone with Hi carb low fat in remission. Not going to happen. How can it?

 

[ianf0ster]

You might say I was on HCLF for about 15yrs on doctor's and NHS advice.
I achieved 3x CAB and then T2 Diabetes.
I also gained about 20lbs in weight.

After that and the numerous videos by Dr Jason Fung, Tim Noakes, Peter Attia, 'the fat emperor' and many more I had no qualms about giving LCHF a go.

LCHF doesn't have to mean eating meat so long as you like at least one of the following:
Avocado, Tree Nuts, Cream, Olive Oil, Eggs, Cheese.
And can live without root veg and grains

 

[Member496333]

HCLF pretty easily turned me into a metabolic calamity. So no, not really

 

[zand]

I don't think you'll find anyone with Hi carb low fat in remission. Not going to happen. How can it?

It can if the fat is low enough. I don't believe meat eaters can achieve this as even lean meat will usually contain more fat than is required in HCLF. I have seen a couple of presentations about it in the past. I like to keep an open mind, even if something doesn't work for me it may work for others.

The big problem is the mix of carbs and fat. If one or other is low enough then I believe remission is possible. As I believe I said above, by far the easiest way of doing is to low carb. We don't need carbs, we do need fat. I failed in HCLF because I either had the fat too high or so low that I got ill.

I believe that most of us who say they have done HCLF have in fact followed HC Low Fat products. Hence the fat part of the ratio can still be too high to be called low fat in the sense that I mean for the purposes of this thread.

 

[zand]

I started these 2 threads as options to those who didn't want to follow or couldn't follow the ND or LCHF for their own reasons, whatever they may be. We already know that LCHF and ND work, there's hundreds of posts about them in this forum.

Please don't turn this into a negative thread about why something didn't work for some of you. We know LCHF is the most popular and most effective way. I am just exploring other alternatives, and yes, there are some.

 

[TriciaWs]

I was accidently high cal, high carb, ultra low fat and losing weight due to gallstones - and became prediabetic and lost a couple of teeth plus aching joints due to low Vit D.
The recent success stories, and support from the NHS for studies on using very low calorie instead of low carb, feature diets of less than 700 calories a day instead - so inherently low carb too but that information is in the small print. And only to be used for a few weeks under strict doctors' support as they are dangerously short of essential nutrients if used long term.

 

[zand]

I was accidently high cal, high carb, ultra low fat and losing weight due to gallstones - and became prediabetic and lost a couple of teeth plus aching joints due to low Vit D.
The recent success stories, and support from the NHS for studies on using very low calorie instead of low carb, feature diets of less than 700 calories a day instead - so inherently low carb too but that information is in the small print. And only to be used for a few weeks under strict doctors' support as they are dangerously short of essential nutrients if used long term.

Yes, my bones suffered over just 7 weeks of low cal, low fat, but I didn't have any fat at all apart from the minute amount that is found in veggies. I have heard that gallstones are caused by going too low fat as well.

 

[KK123]

Yes, my bones suffered over just 7 weeks of low cal, low fat, but I didn't have any fat at all apart from the minute amount that is found in veggies. I have heard that gallstones are caused by going too low fat as well.

Hi Zand, I fully understand what you are asking but I'm not sure you are going to get many (if any) replies from people who do follow a relatively higher carb diet (say around 130carbs) and achieve remission. My guess is it's because you are on a forum that is fairly extreme about low carbing (and I don't mean that in a bad way, I'm a bit like that myself). Remember although there are lots of very low carbers on this site, in the general population of diabetics that is not necessarily the case. I am sure there are people (not on this site) who have achieved remission by eating more than 50 or 130 carbs a day, maybe with increased exercise or weight loss contributing. So many variations of course but as everyone says whatever works, works. x

 

[zand]

Hi Zand, I fully understand what you are asking but I'm not sure you are going to get many (if any) replies from people who do follow a relatively higher carb diet (say around 130carbs) and achieve remission. My guess is it's because you are on a forum that is fairly extreme about low carbing (and I don't mean that in a bad way, I'm a bit like that myself). Remember although there are lots of very low carbers on this site, in the general population of diabetics that is not necessarily the case. I am sure there are people (not on this site) who have achieved remission by eating more than 50 or 130 carbs a day, maybe with increased exercise or weight loss contributing. So many variations of course but as everyone says whatever works, works. x

Yes, I agree with all of your post.

I am a low carber (sometimes a very low carber) myself, but unlike some I still have an open mind that there may be other methods out there. This is a huge forum and I thought it would be a good idea to let the others have their say. It's been said that folks who don't low carb aren't listened to on this forum and that's a shame. Such a large forum should attract all sorts of members, not just low carb or low cal followers. If there are people out there who do follow high carb successfully and they won't join here because we are low carb then we are failing our diabetic brothers and sisters. This should be a forum for all diabetics regardless of how they choose to control their diabetes.

When I joined this forum 6 years ago it wasn't really all low carb. In fact I had well known posters telling me I would make myself ill if I followed low carb and we low carbers really had to shout loud to be heard. How times change! Or maybe they don't, it seems others are still ready to disrespect those who try something different and that's a shame.

 

[ianf0ster]

I am a low carber (sometimes a very low carber) myself, but unlike some I still have an open mind that there may be other methods out there. This is a huge forum and I thought it would be a good idea to let the others have their say. It's been said that folks who don't low carb aren't listened to on this forum and that's a shame. Such a large forum should attract all sorts of members, not just low carb or low cal followers. If there are people out there who do follow high carb successfully and they won't join here because we are low carb then we are failing our diabetic brothers and sisters. This should be a forum for all diabetics regardless of how they choose to control their diabetes.

When I joined this forum 6 years ago it wasn't really all low carb. In fact I had well known posters telling me I would make myself ill if I followed low carb and we low carbers really had to shout loud to be heard. How times change! Or maybe they don't, it seems others are still ready to disrespect those who try something different and that's a shame.

I try to have an open mind, it may not always come across that way, but I try to respect all people except for those whoclaim the impossible and appear smart enough to know that they are deceiving.

I agree that we are all different in that many can tolerate more carbs and even higher GI carbs than others.
However when a High Carb (Low GI) Low fat lifestyle followed for 15years with very few days backsliding, has delivered exactly the opposite of what was intended. And not just in my case, but in many others, then people who claim that I didn't go high enough Carb or Low enough Fat are pushing my tolerance levels to their limits!

 

[zand]

I try to have an open mind, it may not always come across that way, but I try to respect all people except for those whoclaim the impossible and appear smart enough to know that they are deceiving.

I agree that we are all different in that many can tolerate more carbs and even higher GI carbs than others.
However when a High Carb (Low GI) Low fat lifestyle followed for 15years with very few days backsliding, has delivered exactly the opposite of what was intended. And not just in my case, but in many others, then people who claim that I didn't go high enough Carb or Low enough Fat are pushing my tolerance levels to their limits!

I only lasted 2 weeks on low GI low fat! I put on 8 pounds in those 2 weeks and was at that time usually gaining 'only' 7 pounds a year. My doctor told me I must have cheated and I never went back. I assumed I was the only one in the world who stuck to very many diets and still didn't lose weight.

I was not telling you personally that you didn't go low enough fat, it's more that the low GI low fat diet isn't right for T2s or for prediabetics, which was what I unknowingly was when I was given the diet by my doctor.

 

[zand]

I reiterate what I said in post 3 on this thread...

OK to clarify further … I would like only those people who have achieved remission through HCLF with or without Metformin to post on this thread. The reason for this is that I would like to give them a fair chance to have their say without it being swamped by those who followed other methods because there's plenty of threads for us elsewhere.

I might learn where I went wrong in my experiments and it would be good for newbies to be able to see all of the choices available.

 

[KK123]

I try to have an open mind, it may not always come across that way, but I try to respect all people except for those whoclaim the impossible and appear smart enough to know that they are deceiving.

I agree that we are all different in that many can tolerate more carbs and even higher GI carbs than others.
However when a High Carb (Low GI) Low fat lifestyle followed for 15years with very few days backsliding, has delivered exactly the opposite of what was intended. And not just in my case, but in many others, then people who claim that I didn't go high enough Carb or Low enough Fat are pushing my tolerance levels to their limits!

Hi Ian, just as a matter of interest, how may carbs per day do you reckon you were eating in those 15 years? I'll bet it was more than 130. I think sometimes that's why things get messy and many get confused, there is a massive difference between consuming 500 carbs a day (easily achievable by your average person if you think about the eatwell plate and the carby snacks) and just above 130 carbs. I wonder how many people that eat in the range of 130 carbs a day (non diabetic) would never stray into diabetic range? I am not saying that diet would necessarily be good but it might be just enough to keep their carb intolerance within range. Hence, going back to that ball park figure MAY be enough for a person to go into remission. Food for thought! (Low carb of course).

 

[ianf0ster]

Hi Ian, just as a matter of interest, how may carbs per day do you reckon you were eating in those 15 years? I'll bet it was more than 130. I think sometimes that's why things get messy and many get confused, there is a massive difference between consuming 500 carbs a day (easily achievable by your average person if you think about the eatwell plate and the carby snacks) and just above 130 carbs. I wonder how many people that eat in the range of 130 carbs a day (non diabetic) would never stray into diabetic range? I am not saying that diet would necessarily be good but it might be just enough to keep their carb intolerance within range. Hence, going back to that ball park figure MAY be enough for a person to go into remission. Food for thought! (Low carb of course).

Hi,
Yes it was certainly a lot more than 130gm - in fact I think as per government guidelines back then 130 would be considered low Carb or even very low carb.
I was eating large bowl of porridge (made with water - not milk) and a large banana for breakfast every day. Typical Lunch was large bowl of lean chicken(breast) with salad leaves and raw carrots dressed with balsamic vinegar and a little Olive Oil accompanied by 3 or 4 slices of wholegrain bread. A typical Dinner was stir-fried chicken (breast) and vegetables (almost always including carrots ) and 3/4 cup of brown rice (that was the dry uncooked measurement- not after cooking). During they day I would have several more fruits (often apples. pears, mangoes) to make up my '5 a day'.
Note that until I 'doubled down' on that diet after my bypass op (on doctors advice) I was never overweight. In fact I only put on 20lbs up until my T2 diagnosis - so diet rather than lifestyle was never an issue.

 

[pr126]

Dr. J. Fung explains:

 

[zand]

Oh dear, this is what I feared would happen. Some of you just don't get it. I know low carb works! grrr Here's a thread I made a little earlier lol.

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/help-i-have-so-much-weight-to-lose.55901/

And if you want to see extreme keto here's another

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/my-5-day-dairy-fat-fast.81433/

This thread is not about LCHF, so why posters keep trying to turn it into an echo chamber of most of the rest of the forum I don't know. This thread is no place for Jason Fung, who I like and respect and follow. This was supposed to be a safe area for one or two who have made it here without (heaven forbid) following the diet chosen by me and most others at this site. Too much to ask obviously, LCHF rules and *** the rest of them eh?

@Diakat @Juicyj @Antje77 @Brunneria @Goonergal @DCUKMod @Rachox @urbanracer please will you close this thread now. It has no hope of ever serving its purpose while people keep ignoring my pleas to keep it on track. I have far too much going on in my life right now to have the added stress of people teaching me to suck eggs (which I hate with a passion lol)

Oh and mods feel free to edit anything in this post which you think is unsuitable, I am not in the right frame of mind to express myself properly today.

Back to the real life problems of PTSD, depression and agoraphobia and other **** then.