Ideal Diet to Avoid Diabetes

M

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It's not just diabetes, though. Diabetes (type 2) is just one symptom of metabolic syndrome. For every person who doesn't have it, there will be at least five others with one or more related conditions. Pretty much all the modern diseases of civilisation are all under the same umbrella.

I would once have said that avoiding sugar and seed oils would be sufficient to protect the majority from metabolic meltdown, but apparently the ancient Egyptians were riddled with tooth decay, heart disease and diabetes, so it would seem that grains alone are enough to cause serious problems when consumed in excess. Sadly amusing since that is exactly what we are still being told to consume with gay abandon.
 
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KK123

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When we were both working full time and our son was at school, every morning I would get up early and set out plates of prepared fruit (typically sliced banana, grapes, strawberries, slices of nectarine), a carton of orange juice or a fruit smoothie, a big container of muesli (specially chosen for no added salt), low fat milk and, of course, all the necessary bowls, glasses and spoons. I thought I was being a wonderful wife/mother.
I should have been making a big omelette or crustless quiche or serving up slices of cold meats or good quality sausages.
On the diet I used to provide, we were, of course, hungry by mid morning and biscuits (whole grain ones, naturally) kept us going.
I'm sure James wouldn't have become T2D if I had known to serve the meat/eggs breakfast. that breakfast was probably the worst meal of the day and, with a bit of advance cooking, it all could have been so much better.
sally

Hi Sally, but you ate the same presumably and you are not type 2? I am sure James also had something in his DNA that contributed to it as well otherwise many more people would get diabetes. You sound like a great Mum anyway and as I am sure you know, it is certainly not your fault. x
 
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sally and james

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Hi Sally, but you ate the same presumably and you are not type 2? I am sure James also had something in his DNA that contributed to it as well otherwise many more people would get diabetes.
No, I'm not T2 (or T1) and I would agree that some people are simply more susceptible than others. I was, however, over weight. That fell off within weeks of going low carb and I've stayed the same for the past six years, despite butter, lard, cheese etc, so I do think I was metabolically challenged, even if I don't qualify for full membership!
My advice to anyone wanting to avoid any variety of metabolic syndrome would definitely be to start by getting rid of almost all carbs at breakfast time. They cause every day to start with a problem. You're only half way to work and you are thinking about cake/biscuits/crisps, then comes lunch (sandwiches/crisps/cake) followed by struggling to keep awake in the afternoon. More snacks, then pizza for dinner.
Begin the day (or your first meal, whenever taken) with low carb and you are on your way to health - at least that's my take on it.
Sally
 
M

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It's also important to remember that you don't get diabetes based on carbohydrates per day. It's a lifetime of glucose accumulation played off against personal fat threshold. Fat threshold being the maximum capacity in the individual to create new fat from glucose via lipogenesis. There's so many variables, both genetic and environmental, that it's impossible to answer the question of how many grams per day is safe.

Sucrose is a massive driver due its fructose component, and seed oils, as well as being inflammatory, also damage mitochondrial function and limit the cell's ability to take-up glucose. Don't eat artificial food, stay away from excess grains, seed oils and fructose, and the majority should probably be ok. So that's pretty much avoid the standard western diet in its entirety. All in my opinion only, of course :nurse:
 
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Cocosilk

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On a recent post the OP asked about introducing more carbs into a low carb diet if they were in remission.

It made me wonder what diet members would say they could have safely eaten before they were diabetic, for the diabetes never to have developed. Assuming that we are talking about Type 2, and assuming diet is a cause of diabetes. Of course people’s requirements for food are different; a petite lady in her 70’s probably needs less than a professional rugby player, to use two stereotypes, but there must be a general principle.

Let’s call this an “Ideal” diet for want of a better word. This is the diet we should have been eating, to avoid becoming diabetic; this is the diet we would recommend to normal healthy people if only they would take notice. More controversially this would be the diet we could eat if we wanted to, if we were truly in remission, reversed or “cured”, rather than controlled. Obviously some people have adopted diets like keto, carnivore or very low calorie and intend to keep to them, but these diets are adopted as a remedy rather than prevention and are unlikely to work as a blanket recommendation for the as yet healthy general public.

Many posters have said that they were eating what they were told was a healthy diet before they became diabetic and/or obese and often the Eatwell Guide, Five a Day and “eat wholegrain and avoid saturated fat” are quoted. So if you were going to recommend this “Ideal” diet instead of the Eatwell guide to the general public, some of whom have limited budgets, what would it consist of and in particular how many carbs?


From what I can tell, not snacking or overeating is as important as what to eat or not to eat.

I know my own downfall has come mostly this past 5 years since I started having kids. Big change to my lifestyle, less active, very sleep deprived and snacking on sweet things all day long to keep myself awake. (My teeth have suffered too.) But I've always had a sweet tooth and a biscuit or cake or chocolate with every cup of tea or coffee. I've only been overeating more in this past 5 years mostly though. When I was younger, I never had time to eat - I had better things to do. Sitting in front of a screen is one of the worst times for snacking for me. (I'm even doing it now as I type this :hilarious:)

My father has made it to 81 years old and doesn't have diabetes. He may have some insulin resistance by this age though and is not without a few health problems, including being on meds for high blood pressure. But his diet has been an interesting one and he must be doing something right as far as not ending up diabetic by this age.

The main patterns to his diet that I think have got him this far is that in his early years, he often skipped breakfast and sometimes also lunch (fasting and even just what would now be called OMAD (one meal a day) but not because he was needing to lose weight - he was always very slim - he instead used to smoke cigarettes and drink a shot of brandy for lunch! Bad habits for a period of years in his earlier life.

His main meal of the day always consisted of big salads or vegetables with meat, chicken or fish, and always bread. His main snack in the late afternoon was an apple or pear. He swears bread and apples helped him survive sea sickness during the one month voyage as a refugee to Australia back in the 1950s.

Later in his life when he was eating 3 meals a day again it was still tonnes of salads, sometimes only salads and not always with oil or vinegar. He would just take a cucumber, tomato, capsicum and raw carrot into work and munch on them like you would an apple. He regularly would also eat an entire iceberg lettuce as a salad on its own but with oil and vinegar. He also ate cheeses, like cottage cheese.

The early part of this life he was eating what his Croatian mother was cooking - and she was a great cook! She was definitely using seed oils like sunflower oil though and cooking in aluminium pans. My grandmother also lived to her 80s. She had a couple of strokes, the first one left her in a home for 2 years unable to walk or talk much.

My father has never liked to cook so nowadays he just uses a pressure cooker and pops in some kind of meat or chicken with 1/2 a mug of rice, potato and carrot, then makes a soup from all of the juice and fat and pops in the meat, rice and vegetables. (Add a bit of paprika and salt and it's pretty tasty!) He also makes roast pork quite often and always uses bread to soak up the lard and drippings. His generation were not fat phobic.

So the foods he eats are usually off the menu for a diabetic, but because he wasn't indulging a sweet tooth or overeating on those things, he's managed to get to his 80s and not be diabetic yet. I imagine if you keep your quantities of those carby vegetables fairly small and fill up on your salads, fish and meats (and dairy if you can tolerate it), you should be good.

He also ate nuts as snacks too. You gotta watch your quantity of those too though!

There are other foods that he ate regularly that I haven't mentioned I'm sure. I know he makes crepes (palacinke, we call them in Croatian) with jam, cream and cottage cheese, and he eats biscuits sometimes, so he was not without the odd dessert. But the last few years he's been complaining of the belly fat that has come from snacking while in front of the TV, so he's probably heading towards diabetes now if he's not careful.

A few years ago his doctor told him his cholesterol was a bit high, so he said "Leave it with me" and ate nothing but one boiled egg a day for 2 weeks. The next blood test, his cholesterol was back in the normal range. So he seems to be pretty good at not eating if he needs to be strict.
 
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Listlad

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This poster has a go at giving a guide and addresses the OP’s question...

B9D18822-8B38-4802-A1ED-89C35906F54C.png
 

Tophat1900

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This poster has a go at giving a guide and addresses the OP’s question...

View attachment 36550

Yes, but it doesn't state how...it's just statements with no info. I think JimLahey summed it up rather well in his most recent post. And I'd agree with the comments you made about your childhood way of eating. Pretty much meals cooked from real food. I think overall that is a or was a good way of eating before the demonizing of fat began.
 

Listlad

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Yes, but it doesn't state how...it's just statements with no info. I think JimLahey summed it up rather well in his most recent post. And I'd agree with the comments you made about your childhood way of eating. Pretty much meals cooked from real food. I think overall that is a or was a good way of eating before the demonizing of fat began.

No it doesn’t. Though it does use the word “balanced” which implies some carbs.

And includes other lifestyle changes too.
 
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Resurgam

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Out of curiosity, I ate a bread roll containing just over 30 gm of carbs as my total carbohydrate intake but kept my protein and fat the same. I ate it as part of my evening meal - and my blood glucose was over 10mmol/l where it would normally have been just over 7.
I noticed some years ago that legumes are the same, the BG level seems high compared to the carb content.
It seems that, just as with calories, not all carbs are equal in their effect.
 

Mr_Pot

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@Mr_Pot

Any thoughts of your own? :)
I agree that it is a very difficult to suggest what is an ideal diet, there are so many variables, age, culture, activity level to name a few. To get some idea of what might be a reasonable level of carbs for the general public I have made a list of what might be a typical day's consumption to get the recommended amount of calories and counted the carbs. Several people suggested we should go back to meals of the 50's and avoid ready meals and takeaways and snacks, so I have left them out, apart from some beer and crisps that my dad would have had. Obviously these are the meals of a meat and 2 veg Englishman which is probably not applicable to say a vegetarian of Asian origin, or possibly anyone else, but it's just my attempt at a ballpark figure.

The detail is below but it comes to about 200g of carbs a day to achieve 2,500 kCal.
 

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Listlad

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@Mr_Pot . Good that you have had a stab at it. I feel a game of higher or lower coming on. :D
 

JohnEGreen

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about 200g of carbs a day to achieve 2,500 kCal.
About the same as one of my nan's home made pasties.

Of which I must admit I as a youngster was only allowed one half of for my lunch.
 

Listlad

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I agree that it is a very difficult to suggest what is an ideal diet, there are so many variables, age, culture, activity level to name a few. To get some idea of what might be a reasonable level of carbs for the general public I have made a list of what might be a typical day's consumption to get the recommended amount of calories and counted the carbs. Several people suggested we should go back to meals of the 50's and avoid ready meals and takeaways and snacks, so I have left them out, apart from some beer and crisps that my dad would have had. Obviously these are the meals of a meat and 2 veg Englishman which is probably not applicable to say a vegetarian of Asian origin, or possibly anyone else, but it's just my attempt at a ballpark figure.

The detail is below but it comes to about 200g of carbs a day to achieve 2,500 kCal.
You forgot the gravy. So I am going to go higher and say 210g.
 

millenium

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I disagree with you that being active is more important than diet. Diet is key to prevention as well as maintenance. In terms of T2 Diet is key and exercise is secondary.

Exercise and diet work hand in hand in the prevention aspect.
 

HSSS

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I think whilst exercise is undoubtedly useful and beneficial to all aspects of health, it is diet that has the far bigger and more immediate effect on type 2. Many in here have achieved remission with diet alone as the don’t/can’t exercise. Not seen anyone I can recall that’s done it with exercise alone. Obviously the ideal would be both.
 

Guzzler

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Exercise and diet work hand in hand in the prevention aspect.
So what you are saying is that if one cannot exercise then there is no hope of remission? No hope of weight loss? A life of complications sooner rather than later?