Blood sugars and gliclazide im so confused

sandysan

Well-Known Member
Messages
263
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Hello I'm back again extremely confused ...cut a long story short...I had biopsy yesterday as I came out in a rash which I thought may of been metformin ....I came off metformin 2 in morning 2 at night ...as my nurse wanted to see if the rash would go without metformin.

I'm t2

Previous to this for the past 3 weeks I was taking metformin 2x morn and night I was also put on gliclazide 80 mg morn and night. My bloods came down pretty fast from a hb1ac of 13.5 ....I was getting readings in 5 and 6s.

So back to stopping metformin the nurse lowered my gliclazide to 40mg morn and after dinner..I noticed my blood is going high again in the 8s and 9s ,,,,,I've also been on a low carb diet and not lost an ounce .so today I thought I wont eat breakfast or lunch may e it might help but I was shocked morning on waking was 8.8 no breakfast lunch time was 9.6 no lunch I have only had 2 coffees ....I'm well upset over this.......does gliclazide increase insulin .

I hope you can understand my post thznks
 

JoKalsbeek

Expert
Messages
5,937
Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hello I'm back again extremely confused ...cut a long story short...I had biopsy yesterday as I came out in a rash which I thought may of been metformin ....I came off metformin 2 in morning 2 at night ...as my nurse wanted to see if the rash would go without metformin.

I'm t2

Previous to this for the past 3 weeks I was taking metformin 2x morn and night I was also put on gliclazide 80 mg morn and night. My bloods came down pretty fast from a hb1ac of 13.5 ....I was getting readings in 5 and 6s.

So back to stopping metformin the nurse lowered my gliclazide to 40mg morn and after dinner..I noticed my blood is going high again in the 8s and 9s ,,,,,I've also been on a low carb diet and not lost an ounce .so today I thought I wont eat breakfast or lunch may e it might help but I was shocked morning on waking was 8.8 no breakfast lunch time was 9.6 no lunch I have only had 2 coffees ....I'm well upset over this.......does gliclazide increase insulin .

I hope you can understand my post thznks
Glic forces your pancreas to produce more insulin, yeah. That said, what you're seeing is Dawn Phenomenon... Your liver is dumping glucose to help you start the day. And it just keeps on doing that until you eat. (Which is what the metformin was for: it cut down the glucose dump by up to 75%). As you're used to somewhat higher numbers your liver thinks that is the "norm", what it should be aiming for, which is also why fasting blood glucose is the last to come down once you diet. (Also the reason why it's usually a waste of strips at the start, because it'll be a while before you see that coming down... Before and 2 hours after a meal are more telling. If the differences are 2.0 mmol/l or lower, your body is coping.... And the fasting blood glucose will follow. Takes weeks, months, sometimes years though).
 

sandysan

Well-Known Member
Messages
263
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Glic forces your pancreas to produce more insulin, yeah. That said, what you're seeing is Dawn Phenomenon... Your liver is dumping glucose to help you start the day. And it just keeps on doing that until you eat. (Which is what the metformin was for: it cut down the glucose dump by up to 75%). As you're used to somewhat higher numbers your liver thinks that is the "norm", what it should be aiming for, which is also why fasting blood glucose is the last to come down once you diet. (Also the reason why it's usually a waste of strips at the start, because it'll be a while before you see that coming down... Before and 2 hours after a meal are more telling. If the differences are 2.0 mmol/l or lower, your body is coping.... And the fasting blood glucose will follow. Takes weeks, months, sometimes years though).


When I stopped the metformin .?why would they keep me on gliclazide if it makes your pancreas produce more insulin I'm so lost ..I'm giving up ....

I was told the dawn phenomenon was just for people who take insulin ...I'm going g to see a diabetic clinic tomorrow I'll have good discussion.......
 

lucylocket61

Expert
Messages
6,435
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
I am a type 2 diabetic on no meds. I control my condition by diet only, and have done so for eight years.

I still have dawn phenomenon. Some people just have bodies which do this.
 

JoKalsbeek

Expert
Messages
5,937
Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
When I stopped the metformin .?why would they keep me on gliclazide if it makes your pancreas produce more insulin I'm so lost ..I'm giving up ....

I was told the dawn phenomenon was just for people who take insulin ...I'm going g to see a diabetic clinic tomorrow I'll have good discussion.......
Insulin gets your blood sugars (glucose) down, that's why they keep you on it. As for Dawn Phenomenon, even my non-diabetic husband gets that... It's a normal, natural process, just your liver giving you energy (glucose) to start the day, except for diabetics it can go a little (or a lot) too high because they either don't make insulin (T1) or are insensitive to the insulin they do make so need more to get the desired effect (T2).

Don't give up. You know what, I'll do you one better: start from scratch! Forget everything anyone's ever told you up to this point and get yourself The Diabetes Code by Dr. Jason Fung. Together with a notebook and a highlighter. (I am not kidding.) It covers all the bases in very clear, non-dry explanations, and it will give you more answers than you knew you had questions for. I mean, I'm Dutch and I read it in the original English, so if I can make sense of it, so can you. Right now you're getting too much information all jumbled up, and with a lot of nonsense tossed in for good measure. It's easier if you have one actually knowledgeable source which can and will explain everything you're wondering about. I know it was a lifesaver for me. It could well be one for you. Once you've digested what's in that book, there's a whole world of information out there to discover, but you'll know the basics and what all the terms mean, and what they mean specifically when looking at your own situation. You can take control of this, but it's not going to happen overnight. There's a lot to learn and feeling overwhelmed goes with it all... Been there, done that. And used the notebook and markers. Give yourself some time to grasp all this... It's a lot to take in.

You'll be okay. It's not a hopeless situation, I promise you.
Jo
 

ianf0ster

Moderator
Staff Member
Messages
2,399
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
exercise, phone calls
Dawn Phenomenon, within reason, isn't a bad thing. for those who are doing a Low carb 'Way Of Eating' it is a good way of getting excess visceral body fat burned off quickly.
However if you consider trying Low Carb, you will have to be careful due to being on Gliclazide ( or on Insulin) since if you take too much Gliclazide or Insulin for the amount of Carbs being eaten some people can experience Hypos (extreme BG lows) which can be dangerous. So people on those medications need the cooperation of their HCP in order to make Low Carb work for them.

Others are lucky enough never to be put on anything more than Metformin, in which case it is safe to try Low Carb without involving a GP or DN.
 

DavidGrahamJones

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,263
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Other
Dislikes
Newspapers
why would they keep me on gliclazide if it makes your pancreas produce more insulin I'm so lost ..I'm giving up ....

May I start with the simple stuff. Type II diabetes means that either your pancreas isn't producing normal amounts of insulin or your body isn't using that insulin in the normal fashion, in other words you are insulin resistant.

What I found very useful is knowing what my pancreas was up to and what my insulin resistance was. I had a c-peptide test that showed my insulin production was in the normal range and an insulin resistance test, showing that my body was resisting the insulin it was given.

One way to "overcome" insulin resistance is to increase the amount of insulin being produced, hence the Gliclazide.

I was told the dawn phenomenon was just for people who take insulin

Dawn phenomenon can be experienced whether you inject insulin or not and on top of that, you don't always experience it. I can go through patches where the BG increase is significant and then other times when it is hardly noticeable.

Don't forget that we are all different so will have different experiences. My intermittent dawn phenomenon is an example of that.

I'm going g to see a diabetic clinic tomorrow I'll have good discussion.......

Make sure you have your questions written down, it helps. I hand my questions over and both my GP and DN are happy with that because we get things done much more quickly. No time to go off topic and miss something out.

Oh, by the way. DON'T GIVE UP! All the best, I hope your appointment went well.

I've also been on a low carb

There's low carb and there's low carb. Personally I'm down to less than 50gms a day and I know that because I weighed everything I ate and used some software to tell me what was in that food. I could have googled and worked it out for everything individually, it's just that I've been using something called "weight by date" for ages. Initially to track my food intake for dieting.
 

Daibell

Master
Messages
12,642
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
Hi. Worth mentioning that your weight may be a factor here. If you have excess weight then you may be insulin resistant and then Glic may help but is not the real solution as the insulin increase from the Glic may encourage you to eat more carbs as your BS will be lower. You may gain weight with those increased carbs - not good. So do reduce the carbs if you have excess weight to break the resistance cycle BUT be careful when reducing the carbs as the Glic dosage may also need to be reduced to avoid a hypo. If you are slim then just keep a eye on the BS to check that it doesn't rise a lot which would imply being T1 and not T2.
 

sandysan

Well-Known Member
Messages
263
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Insulin gets your blood sugars (glucose) down, that's why they keep you on it. As for Dawn Phenomenon, even my non-diabetic husband gets that... It's a normal, natural process, just your liver giving you energy (glucose) to start the day, except for diabetics it can go a little (or a lot) too high because they either don't make insulin (T1) or are insensitive to the insulin they do make so need more to get the desired effect (T2).

Don't give up. You know what, I'll do you one better: start from scratch! Forget everything anyone's ever told you up to this point and get yourself The Diabetes Code by Dr. Jason Fung. Together with a notebook and a highlighter. (I am not kidding.) It covers all the bases in very clear, non-dry explanations, and it will give you more answers than you knew you had questions for. I mean, I'm Dutch and I read it in the original English, so if I can make sense of it, so can you. Right now you're getting too much information all jumbled up, and with a lot of nonsense tossed in for good measure. It's easier if you have one actually knowledgeable source which can and will explain everything you're wondering about. I know it was a lifesaver for me. It could well be one for you. Once you've digested what's in that book, there's a whole world of information out there to discover, but you'll know the basics and what all the terms mean, and what they mean specifically when looking at your own situation. You can take control of this, but it's not going to happen overnight. There's a lot to learn and feeling overwhelmed goes with it all... Been there, done that. And used the notebook and markers. Give yourself some time to grasp all this... It's a lot to take in.

You'll be okay. It's not a hopeless situation, I promise you.
Jo

Thankyou jo x you have been most helpfull
 

sandysan

Well-Known Member
Messages
263
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Insulin gets your blood sugars (glucose) down, that's why they keep you on it. As for Dawn Phenomenon, even my non-diabetic husband gets that... It's a normal, natural process, just your liver giving you energy (glucose) to start the day, except for diabetics it can go a little (or a lot) too high because they either don't make insulin (T1) or are insensitive to the insulin they do make so need more to get the desired effect (T2).

Don't give up. You know what, I'll do you one better: start from scratch! Forget everything anyone's ever told you up to this point and get yourself The Diabetes Code by Dr. Jason Fung. Together with a notebook and a highlighter. (I am not kidding.) It covers all the bases in very clear, non-dry explanations, and it will give you more answers than you knew you had questions for. I mean, I'm Dutch and I read it in the original English, so if I can make sense of it, so can you. Right now you're getting too much information all jumbled up, and with a lot of nonsense tossed in for good measure. It's easier if you have one actually knowledgeable source which can and will explain everything you're wondering about. I know it was a lifesaver for me. It could well be one for you. Once you've digested what's in that book, there's a whole world of information out there to discover, but you'll know the basics and what all the terms mean, and what they mean specifically when looking at your own situation. You can take control of this, but it's not going to happen overnight. There's a lot to learn and feeling overwhelmed goes with it all... Been there, done that. And used the notebook and markers. Give yourself some time to grasp all this... It's a lot to take in.

You'll be okay. It's not a hopeless situation, I promise you.
Jo
Thanks jo