Diagnosed T2 last July...

[MyMeltingBrain]

It was the age-old story of going for my 50+ check up; as I guess is the same with many people here, I had none of the common symptoms, so the call-back was a little shocking.

After consultation, I said I wanted to see if I could manage it by diet/lifestyle change. At the point of diagnosis, my HbA1C was 80, which I reduced to 76 by the next blood test. Today's result was 52, only down 1 from last time. Although I had reduced obvious sugar intake, I hadn't really focused on carbs.

Having attended the NHS 'DESMOND' course, I came away with a far better understanding of the disease, its prognosis and dietary advice. I have wrangled another three months of self-management before I finally concede to using Metformin.

The worst thing for me to accept is the inevitability of decline; that's something that sits heavily with me.

 

[Antje77]

The worst thing for me to accept is the inevitability of decline; that's something that sits heavily with me.

You already went from a hba1c of 80 to 52. Why would decline be inevitable when you've already proven it can improve?
I'm a type 1 myself, but we have quite a few long-standing members who have kept their blood glucose in a very healthy range for many years without meds.

Below is a link to our introduction to diabetes for new members, it may be helpful.
Good luck, you might well prove whoever told you 'inevitable decline' wrong

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/basic-information-for-newly-diagnosed-diabetics.17088/

 

[MyMeltingBrain]

Hi Antje77,

"Good luck, you might well prove whoever told you 'inevitable decline' wrong"

This was learned from the NHS Desmond session. Whilst T2 can be kept in check for (many) years, the insulin produced by pancreas eventually depletes, leaving induced insulin the only option.

 

[Rachox]

Hi MyMeltingBrain and welcome to the forum.
I agree with @Antje77 , many of us here, have reduced our HbA1cs to non diabetic levels. By keeping these normal levels we are reducing (dare I say eliminating?) the risk of complications which are the cause of any ‘decline’. By eating low carb I am not stimulating my pancreas to overproduce insulin. By losing weight (through low carbing, not calorie counting) I have reduced my visceral fat which helps my pancreas and liver work more efficiently. I was only diagnosed in May ‘17 so just a type 2 spring chicken by some members standards, but I have had non diabetic numbers since 4 months after diagnosis. I believe that Desmond type courses push the Eatwell plate (which wasn’t designed for diabetics in particular, just the general population), it is too high carb for us so all they see is deterioration and which confirms their belief that type 2 is a progressive disease. Stick around and have a read of the Success Stories here:
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/success-stories-and-testimonials.43/

 

[Antje77]

This was learned from the NHS Desmond session. Whilst T2 can be kept in check for (many) years, the insulin produced by pancreas eventually depletes, leaving induced insulin the only option.

Can it be that historical figures on the progression of diabetes were obtained during decades of pushing diabetics to have plenty of carbs with each meal?
When circumstances change (new insights about treatment) statistics will change as well. But not overnight, as those statistics are a build up of decades of data.

 

[Member496333]

I was told the same thing. More medication. Insulin. Eventual death. Three years later I have sub-30 HbA1c with no medication and I've never been healthier. "This one weird trick..."? I told the establishment to stick their dietary advice where the sun don't shine.

Courtesy of @JoKalsbeek;
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/blog/jokalsbeek.401801/

 

[bulkbiker]

Hi Antje77,

"Good luck, you might well prove whoever told you 'inevitable decline' wrong"

This was learned from the NHS Desmond session. Whilst T2 can be kept in check for (many) years, the insulin produced by pancreas eventually depletes, leaving induced insulin the only option.

Follow their advice and yes it may well follow that you decline. I too was told by the Area Diabetes Special Nurse that it was a chronic progressive disease. This was when my HbA1c was 87 mmol/mol ....luckily I had already read some of the success stories on this forum so knew what she had said was likely a crock of you know what.

I used my anger at her words to keep me motivated whilst cutting carbs and restricting my eating window. Just over 4 years later my HbA1c's are all sub 30 mmol/mol and I'm 120 pounds lighter.. I was even featured here

https://twitter.com/FastingMethod/status/1229783205311664128

Not so chronic or progressive as they said...

 

[Dr Snoddy]

I too was told this by the Diabetes Nurse (very overweight, has since retired). I went for all the advice I could get including a DESMOND course. The carb heavy diet promoted made no sense at all. Fortunately I was also given a half hour session with a young NHS dietician who suggested no more than 35g of carbohydrate per meal. Her reassurance and this forum gave me the confidence to ignore the NICE advice and to devise my own LCHF eating plan. Result, 20kg weight loss which I have maintained and an HbA1c reduced from 104 to mid 30's. I have stayed in this range for the last 5 years and now am off metformin. I cannot predict what will happen in the future healthwise but I am not terrified by the prospect!

 

[MyMeltingBrain]

@Jim Lahey, @bulkbiker & @Dr Snoddy

Thanks, everyone, that's encouraging. The DESMOND I attended didn't push carbs, rather promoted substitution and balance. I don't think it was as low as 35g per meal but I have been monitoring using the Carbs & Cals app (it's beginning to become an obsession!). I'm trying to stay within the 150-160g mark per day, along with daily moderate to heavy exercise.

Onward!

 

[Hotpepper20000]

@Jim Lahey, @bulkbiker & @Dr Snoddy

Thanks, everyone, that's encouraging. The DESMOND I attended didn't push carbs, rather promoted substitution and balance. I don't think it was as low as 35g per meal but I have been monitoring using the Carbs & Cals app (it's beginning to become an obsession!). I'm trying to stay within the 150-160g mark per day, along with daily moderate to heavy exercise.

Onward!

Also I would highly recommend getting a BG meter. That way you can test to see which carbs and how much spikes your BG.
I can eat above ground vegetables with out spiking, but grains of any kind no matter the quantity will spike my BG into double digits even if I start low before a meal.
We are all different and only having a BG meter will tell you how many carbs and what kind.

 

[bulkbiker]

@Jim Lahey, @bulkbiker & @Dr Snoddy

Thanks, everyone, that's encouraging. The DESMOND I attended didn't push carbs, rather promoted substitution and balance. I don't think it was as low as 35g per meal but I have been monitoring using the Carbs & Cals app (it's beginning to become an obsession!). I'm trying to stay within the 150-160g mark per day, along with daily moderate to heavy exercise.

Onward!

I try and stay around 10g per day!

 

[Resurgam]

There seems to be a failure in understanding the problem - sugars are carbohydrates, along with starches they are what we can't cope with as type two diabetics. If only more people got the full facts at diagnosis, there would be far fewer problems.
All the time you were avoiding sugar but not starches there was no way you were truly in control - and the advice not to test blood glucose which is set in stone for type twos - well just go and drive a car without a speedometer and see how many speeding tickets you get is analogous to relying on the Hba1c test rather than seeing how meals affect you.
There is no inevitability of decline, just surety of problems if good advice isn't given.

 

[DCUKMod]

@MyMeltingBrain - Until such times as I see a negative progression I have been unable to resolve by my best efforts, I do not accept the condition to be progressive, for me. My story, in brief:

HbA1c:

October 13: 73 or 8.8% (How did that happen?)
February 14: 37 or 5.5%
May 14: 34 or 5.3%
August 14: 32 or 5.1%
November 14: 33 or 5.1%
May 15: 31 or 5.0%
October 15: 33 or 5.1%
September 16: 31 or 5.0%
November 17: 33 or 5.1%
March 18: A "bonus", unexpected test due to other bloods - 30 or 4.9%. I joined the 4s club! I hadn't expected a reduction, having got used to toggling 33<>31<>33<>31 for the last 3 years, literally.
March 19: 27 or 4.6% Another surprising reduction.

I'm just about due another A1c test.

I am fit, slim and healthy. Over the last 2-3 years, I have developed an issue with my thyroid gland, which eventually seems to be coming under rein.

My health markers show no signs of diabetes, although, based on my family medical history, the Endo I see has said a couple of times I should be a ware that LADA (late onset T1) can creep up. Right now, I have noted his words, but don't notice any signs.

Should I find myself faced with either a deterioration of my T2, or the Endo's prediction/warning comes true, I guess I'll have to deal with it, but until such times, I refuse to live under that sort of cloud.

I'm not foolhardy in my approach. I have a good and varied life,living and eating well. When asked if this is as good as it gets, I can confidently state my current situation is pretty positive all round. Bearing in mind we're all clicking miles on the clock, there will be a time when I finally grow up ( ) that I'll have to take things steadier, but until then, as my avatar says, I'll get busy living.

(The Get Busy Living avatar is courtesy of the Matt Hampson Foundation. https://www.matthampsonfoundation.org/ No association, just great admiration for a young man taken down in his prime, getting on with his life and helping others.)

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Thanks, everyone, that's encouraging. The DESMOND I attended didn't push carbs, rather promoted substitution and balance. I don't think it was as low as 35g per meal but I have been monitoring using the Carbs & Cals app (it's beginning to become an obsession!). I'm trying to stay within the 150-160g mark per day, along with daily moderate to heavy exercise.

Onward!

That's... Still quite a bit of carbs. More than I could handle myself, honestly. I'm at 20 grams a day or less. And have been happily in the non-diabetic range for a few years now, medication-, complication-, and progression-free. So yeah, it can be done. T2 is only a progressive condition if you stick with the carbs, really... Cut them, "eat to your meter" (Meaning testing before a meal and 2 hours after the first bite, and aiming for a rise of no more and preferably less than 2.0 mmol/l), and you'll see a little miracle happen.

 

[VashtiB]

hello and welcome,

I too was diagnosed in July. I found Thi site and received some great advice and support and my HbA1C was within normal levels within 3 months and continues to be.

I like m any others have lost weight without trying and I test regularly and am usually in the 5s with some 4s and an occasional 6 thrown in.

I went very low carb. Always less than 20 grams a day and usually much less.

Nomne of this was with the advice b y my doctor- if I followed her advice I'm sure it would be progressive. Even my doctor concedes that she considers my blood sugar levels well controlled and no longer considers it a real problem- more concerned about my cholesterol but that's for another thread.

Get a meter, and test regularly- think seriously about reducing your carbs dramatically and see what your meter tells you.

I'm also in my 50s and still need/want to work so I need my health. I love carbs but my body doesn't.

Good luck.

 

[Member496333]

I try and stay around 10g per day!

Gluttony! I don't think I even moved the needle yesterday. Definitely under a gram

 

[bulkbiker]

Gluttony! I don't think I even moved the needle yesterday. Definitely under a gram

Don't talk about yesterday.. too much Oppo..! 22g of carbs in total.. the ignominy of it...
Edit to add still in ketosis tho.. just...phew..

 

[Member496333]

Don't talk about yesterday.. too much Oppo..! 22g of carbs in total.. the ignominy of it...
Edit to add still in ketosis tho.. just...phew..

Go and stand in the corner

 

[DCUKMod]

Don't talk about yesterday.. too much Oppo..! 22g of carbs in total.. the ignominy of it...
Edit to add still in ketosis tho.. just...phew..

Was that a full tub?

I haven't sampled Oppo, so no idea if it was delicious, therefore understandable, or you just had a rush of blood to the head.

 

[bulkbiker]

Was that a full tub?

I haven't sampled Oppo, so no idea if it was delicious, therefore understandable, or you just had a rush of blood to the head.

No it wasn't only the Oppo also had some Lindt 85% and of course the cream in me coffee.. and some milk in me afternoon tea!
The Oppo by weight is about 16.6 g of carbs per 100g but some of that is polyols.. I just count them all as carbs tho..
It was on special offer in Waitrose and I was enticed by its chocolate and hazelnut seductiveness..