Wake up-----BS high

[hrpuffnstuff]

Just wondering if this happens to any of you guys and could help with suggestions.
Ive spoke with my diabetes staff, and they not heard of this.
I could be insulin resistant but wont know until i can get to the hospital for tests.

I'm on libre freestyle
Type 1 novarapid, levemir.

BS are great during the night and before bedtime, all in single figures

Wake up at 9am, take the levemir, and around 12/1pm BS are in double figures. above 13
NO breakfast, only tea about 3/4 cups until 1pm lunch time then i eat.

Diabetes staff said could be caffiene, so i stopped....still the same.
Sooo I eat breakfast, inject nova rapid for the carbs...and at 1pm BS are still double figures.
Before breakfast BS are around 7-9

Sooo no matter what i do I cant get the BS down to single figures.
After lunch around 5pm BS are back to single figures

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Just wondering if this happens to any of you guys and could help with suggestions.
Ive spoke with my diabetes staff, and they not heard of this.
I could be insulin resistant but wont know until i can get to the hospital for tests.

I'm on libre freestyle
Type 1 novarapid, levemir.

BS are great during the night and before bedtime, all in single figures

Wake up at 9am, take the levemir, and around 12/1pm BS are in double figures. above 13
NO breakfast, only tea about 3/4 cups until 1pm lunch time then i eat.

Diabetes staff said could be caffiene, so i stopped....still the same.
Sooo I eat breakfast, inject nova rapid for the carbs...and at 1pm BS are still double figures.
Before breakfast BS are around 7-9

Sooo no matter what i do I cant get the BS down to single figures.
After lunch around 5pm BS are back to single figures

Stupid question, but don't T1's get Dawn Phenomenon too? (A liverdump of glucose to "help" you start the day.). A liver'll keep dumping until you eat, sometimes... Mine does anyway... Not sure if this applies, but if it does, it's weird your team didn't know about it...? https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/diabetes/expert-answers/dawn-effect/faq-20057937

 

[KK123]

Stupid question, but don't T1's get Dawn Phenomenon too? (A liverdump of glucose to "help" you start the day.). A liver'll keep dumping until you eat, sometimes... Mine does anyway... Not sure if this applies, but if it does, it's weird your team didn't know about it...? https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/diabetes/expert-answers/dawn-effect/faq-20057937

Hi there JoKalsbeek, the answer to that is yes. Everybody gets it to differing levels and as we all know, the issue for us diabetics is that for a variety of reasons, once it's up (without corrective action), it stays up due to lack of insulin/insulin not getting through, before then eventually going down. x

 

[KK123]

Just wondering if this happens to any of you guys and could help with suggestions.
Ive spoke with my diabetes staff, and they not heard of this.
I could be insulin resistant but wont know until i can get to the hospital for tests.

I'm on libre freestyle
Type 1 novarapid, levemir.

BS are great during the night and before bedtime, all in single figures

Wake up at 9am, take the levemir, and around 12/1pm BS are in double figures. above 13
NO breakfast, only tea about 3/4 cups until 1pm lunch time then i eat.

Diabetes staff said could be caffiene, so i stopped....still the same.
Sooo I eat breakfast, inject nova rapid for the carbs...and at 1pm BS are still double figures.
Before breakfast BS are around 7-9

Sooo no matter what i do I cant get the BS down to single figures.
After lunch around 5pm BS are back to single figures

I have recently been on a course and someone posed a very similar issue. The Diabetes specialist said that outside of the normal Dawn phenomenon, it is likely the body has sensed that its glucose levels are going too low (not hypo low but too 'low' for what it considers its normal level which in most type 1s is probably higher than a non diabetics). It then helpfully releases glucose from the liver (because that response is still working fine) and up goes the levels. To combat this, she said to eat something just after you get up, this means the body might not go into panic mode and won't release its stored glucose. I note you have said you tried breakfast and before it was 7 to 9 and double figures afterwards but were those double figures more than 2mmol? She also said that sometimes its down to injecting too much insulin rather than too little, ie, the insulin immediately gets to work lowering the levels, then the body panics because its going low too quickly so....yep, you guessed it. Anyway, one of the group tried having 15 carbs first thing for breakfast (whilst taking NO bolus insulin) and said that although their levels were still higher than they wished, they DID improve to single figure levels!!! I do hope this helps, talk about a complicated condition!! x

 

[urbanracer]

Just wondering if this happens to any of you guys and could help with suggestions.
Ive spoke with my diabetes staff, and they not heard of this.
I could be insulin resistant but wont know until i can get to the hospital for tests.

I'm on libre freestyle
Type 1 novarapid, levemir.

BS are great during the night and before bedtime, all in single figures

Wake up at 9am, take the levemir, and around 12/1pm BS are in double figures. above 13
NO breakfast, only tea about 3/4 cups until 1pm lunch time then i eat.

Diabetes staff said could be caffiene, so i stopped....still the same.
Sooo I eat breakfast, inject nova rapid for the carbs...and at 1pm BS are still double figures.
Before breakfast BS are around 7-9

Sooo no matter what i do I cant get the BS down to single figures.
After lunch around 5pm BS are back to single figures

Hi there hrpuffnstuff

You probably have not heard of the term insulin profile yet?

If you wake up and inject at 9am, your Levimir takes a good few hours to get up to speed as illustrated by the graphic below.

If 0 on this graph equates to 9am your time, and if your liver likes to dump large amounts of glucose into your system after waking then you may struggle for the first few hours until it's really doing it's job.

Before moving on, please don't change your insulin regime before discussing it with your medical support team (that's the small print.)

I take Levemir at 7am and 7pm (split dose) and the idea behind this is that it goes some way to ironing out the peaks and troughs in the profile curve. As the infusion rate starts to lower, I am effectively giving it a top up, which 'adds' to what's already in the system and extends the peak.

Another thought, - have you ever checked the Freestyle Libre reading with a finger prick test? The further actual blood glucose moves away from the 'normal' range, the greater the Libre's errors often seem to be.

 

[Antje77]

I have a very clear 'foot on the floor effect', where my bg rises as soon as I get out of bed. I seem to have a friendly liver who wants to help me get going for the day by dumping glucose in my bloodstream.
I heard from many T1's experiencing the same, and many of us take some quick acting for it when getting out of bed.

Might be worth asking your diabetes team if that would be an idea for you.

 

[hrpuffnstuff]

I have a very clear 'foot on the floor effect', where my bg rises as soon as I get out of bed. I seem to have a friendly liver who wants to help me get going for the day by dumping glucose in my bloodstream.
I heard from many T1's experiencing the same, and many of us take some quick acting for it when getting out of bed.

Might be worth asking your diabetes team if that would be an idea for you.

Good reply...cheers I didnt think of that, as we say "dont know until we try"

 

[hrpuffnstuff]

Hi there hrpuffnstuff

You probably have not heard of the term insulin profile yet?

If you wake up and inject at 9am, your Levimir takes a good few hours to get up to speed as illustrated by the graphic below.

View attachment 42299
If 0 on this graph equates to 9am your time, and if your liver likes to dump large amounts of glucose into your system after waking then you may struggle for the first few hours until it's really doing it's job.

Before moving on, please don't change your insulin regime before discussing it with your medical support team (that's the small print.)

I take Levemir at 7am and 7pm (split dose) and the idea behind this is that it goes some way to ironing out the peaks and troughs in the profile curve. As the infusion rate starts to lower, I am effectively giving it a top up, which 'adds' to what's already in the system and extends the peak.

Another thought, - have you ever checked the Freestyle Libre reading with a finger prick test? The further actual blood glucose moves away from the 'normal' range, the greater the Libre's errors often seem to be.

Doing the 'prick' test today and not freestyle just to see...cheers for the reply well read

 

[ert]

Would you take levemir when you wake? It's what I do - a split dose at bedtime and on rising. They're not equal doses. I take twice as much levemir in the morning. I also follow the blood sugars numbers. Like you, I don't eat until lunchtime, but am not adverse in taking a unit or two of fast-acting with my morning coffee and cream, if I feel it's necessary. Mostly I don't need to.

 

[karen8967]

My bgs start rising about 4am regardless of anything i do i take a couple of units of fiasp as soon as i wake and that keeps me steady but if i dont eat breakfast bgs start rising again it mad

 

[Marie 2]

Like @Antje77 I have foot on the floor (FOTF) but I also have dawn phenomenon (DP) right now. I had major DP for a long time but it calmed down and FOTF started. I have a pump and a cgm luckily and that really helps. But I have a rise in BG at about 5:30-630 am then I'm fine, but at about 9:00-9:30 am I have another rise right after I get out of bed. I guess my liver thinks I need a lot of help to get going in the am........

 

[EllieM]

i dont eat breakfast bgs start rising again

Does breakfast need to have carbs? I've been struggling with DP for a while and don't really have breakfast (other than two coffees with milk). I am reulctant to eat when not hungry but would consider it....

 

[karen8967]

Does breakfast need to have carbs? I've been struggling with DP for a while and don't really have breakfast (other than two coffees with milk). I am reulctant to eat when not hungry but would consider it....

myself personally i have a couple of ryvitas with cheese for breakfast only 5g of carb each nothing for the cheese and not too filling depending on your carb ratio if you only had 1 you probably wouldnt have to inject for that but it does stop the rise in me wether it works for you you can only try as were all different as ive said if i dont eat breakfast bloods start rising ,goodluck x