Data-Driven Fasting?

Auto E

Well-Known Member
Messages
132
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
I'm just curious if anyone here has thoughts on this program:
https://optimisingnutrition.com/data-driven-fasting/

The premise is don't eat until your blood sugar drops below a personalized trigger level (for example, mine right now would be about 4.4; one of those perfectly healthy people might be 3.7.). They say it helps you find your right amount of "deprivation" basically to lose weight and improve your blood sugars. You are supposedly "hunger training" by noting your hunger levels and how they match (or don't) your blood sugar levels.

I have THREE skepticisms of the program, and I'd like to hear you agree or disagree or add other thoughts.

#1 - Yesterday and today I tried this. I woke up with a fasting glucose of 4.8, and I had to wait until noon before it dropped to below my 4.4 threshold, and I had to wait until 11am today. If I have coffee w/cream in the morning, I would have dropped sooner!!! So not sure what I think about this.

#2 - which brings me to skepticism #2. I definitely don't see a clear trend between when I am hungry and what my blood sugar is, and I've been tracking a long time! Indeed, my hunger seems best correlated to rapid SWINGS, not a specific "number".

#3 - is the idea that I am supposed to be increasing my insulin sensitivity while I'm waiting for my blood sugar to drop below my personalized trigger? because I'm not sure I'm buying that, either.

Anyway, I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts. I'm currently giving this a try as a new experiment to bring my fasting blood glucose down. I welcome your rebuttals to my skepticisms!
 

LaoDan

Well-Known Member
Messages
993
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
The term “new normal “
Doesn’t seem unreasonable, however there may be diminishing returns. At the levels you mention or below, your body could start scavenging glucose from other sources, most likely a combination of fat and muscle.
 

oldgreymare

Well-Known Member
Messages
537
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
Dislikes
Commuting, overcrowded spaces, especially after the arrival of covid-19...
Quick observation (with personal disclosure I have a PhD in physiology), IMHO so many similar formulas fall foul of false precision, way too little data, and hence I personally am more than a bit cynically of algorithms, etc that are not already correcting for in excess of 30-50 daily variables - sadly our bodies are hideously complex feedback machines, brilliant when they are working, big challenge when these break down.

Do experiment with what works for you, but no universal rules in this space - don't get stressed with unexpected results.
 

Auto E

Well-Known Member
Messages
132
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
Quick observation (with personal disclosure I have a PhD in physiology), IMHO so many similar formulas fall foul of false precision, way too little data, and hence I personally am more than a bit cynically of algorithms, etc that are not already correcting for in excess of 30-50 daily variables - sadly our bodies are hideously complex feedback machines, brilliant when they are working, big challenge when these break down.

Do experiment with what works for you, but no universal rules in this space - don't get stressed with unexpected results.

Thanks Oldgreymare! :) I have my Master's Degree in Physiology!!!! :) I teach at a community college. Your response pretty much matches my skepticism of this new plan...... I was willing to try it for a week or so, but the results have stunk. My fasting blood glucose just keeps going up and up with this plan. It's clearly not working for me.

Another thing we have in common is that I also self-fund my Dexcom. :) $350/month! Sheesh. Sometimes I take a month off to save $$ and just rely on finger sticks.

Fascinating about your T1D diagnosis at age 51. Do you think you had a low-level autoimmune response for many years/decades before diagnosis? I'd love to hear more of your story.

I am starting to wonder if I do have a combo form of blood sugar issues - perhaps some difficulty with insulin production as well as insulin resistance. My grandmother had T2D, and so I always assumed I was as straightforward as that. But I am not overweight and still struggle with my glucose responses.

I appreciate your encouragement to not get stressed. That's exactly what's been going on with me recently. Sometimes I get in a funk with my blood sugar - usually after a period of extreme restrictiveness with limited benefit (sort of like LaODan said).

And last - love your avatar name and the lovely horse.
 
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SMS1

Well-Known Member
Messages
95
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi, can I ask something without sounding clueless; how do we know if it's" real" hunger or just some nutrient deficiency? I have a "sweet tooth" always craving something sweet. The other day, I drank something ( healthy-organic tomato juice)after my usual meal and had no sugar craving at all which quite surprised me.Something had stopped my sugar craving which could be interpreted as hunger.Maybe I didn't read the article well enough..
 
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Auto E

Well-Known Member
Messages
132
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi, can I ask something without sounding clueless; how do we know if it's" real" hunger or just some nutrient deficiency? I have a "sweet tooth" always craving something sweet. The other day, I drank something ( healthy-organic tomato juice)after my usual meal and had no sugar craving at all which quite surprised me.Something had stopped my sugar craving which could be interpreted as hunger.Maybe I didn't read the article well enough..

I don't think we easily can tell if we are "truly" hungry! I have people tell me it's "from your stomach" or many other clues that make them think it's true hunger. For a type 2 diabetic, I really think it's much much more difficult. For me, if my blood sugar goes up a bit and then down somewhat rapidly, I feel nauseatingly hungry. I definitely don't need more "fuel" in my body, but my poor body is clearly having difficulty organizing and partitioning the fuel it does have!

And the nutrient deficiency thing is fascinating. The example you gave could even be that you needed some more salt!

I was intrigued by this particular method, but 1 week of experimenting has shown that it is not for me!