Why won't the NHS tell you the secret to treating diabetes?

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hankjam

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That's why I'm aiming for a full 2 weeks of low FBG levels eg 4.5

I would be surprised if this happens.... looking at the numerous threads on these forums where people report their FBG, with various levels of chat, anything close to 4.5 is pretty rare.

For myself I had a bit of surgery last autumn which knocked my FBG levels, +6.5, which was way above my "target", 5.2. Over time it came down and when I was more or less happy with the output it went bonkers over one month and climbed to 6.2, weekly mean. I dropped the carbs, two days a week did a 24 hr fast, other five days 14 hr fast and my FBG came down rapidly to 5.4, weekly mean.... and that's where I am at the moment...

I reckon my control is fine for me but I won't be getting anywhere near 4.5 any time soon.....
 

Tannith

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and your FBG, with any others measured, were what?
That morning before I ate anything, 5.9 this morning following that day of eating as described above, just over 1050 cals, 5.5. I would not expect a rapid improvement nor go by less than a couple of weeks' average.
 

Tannith

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I would be surprised if this happens.... looking at the numerous threads on these forums where people report their FBG, with various levels of chat, anything close to 4.5 is pretty rare.

For myself I had a bit of surgery last autumn which knocked my FBG levels, +6.5, which was way above my "target", 5.2. Over time it came down and when I was more or less happy with the output it went bonkers over one month and climbed to 6.2, weekly mean. I dropped the carbs, two days a week did a 24 hr fast, other five days 14 hr fast and my FBG came down rapidly to 5.4, weekly mean.... and that's where I am at the moment...

I reckon my control is fine for me but I won't be getting anywhere near 4.5 any time soon.....
You may well be right and I could be being over optimistic. But I shall try anyway, that can't do any harm. And if it doesn't work that well at least I am back to (just) prediabetic which is a lot better than nothing.
 

zand

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You may well be right and I could be being over optimistic. But I shall try anyway, that can't do any harm. And if it doesn't work that well at least I am back to (just) prediabetic which is a lot better than nothing.
If it doesn't work maybe you could start listening to the rest of us?
(No, I thought not.)
 
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Daphne917

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Yesterday orange juice200 cal half tin mushy peas 76 cal half tin chicken in whitesauce 254 cal 100g pasta 400 cal half tin fruit cocktail 128 cal = 1058 cal. Maybe a bit less pasta -son cooked it so I'm a bit unsure.
Edit to correct Actually 200 ml (not cals) orange juice that's only 140 cals but also forgot 3x tea with semi skimmed milk so total cals probably about the same or a tad more.
As others have said that’s a lot of carbs which may scupper your attempt to reduce your FBS. Have you tried to cut carbs 8nstead?
 

kokhongw

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Yesterday orange juice200 cal half tin mushy peas 76 cal half tin chicken in whitesauce 254 cal 100g pasta 400 cal half tin fruit cocktail 128 cal = 1058 cal. Maybe a bit less pasta -son cooked it so I'm a bit unsure.
Edit to correct Actually 200 ml (not cals) orange juice that's only 140 cals but also forgot 3x tea with semi skimmed milk so total cals probably about the same or a tad more.

Wow, it would be interesting to see a Flash CGM reading for the meals... If we recall, the spikes themselves could be causing microvascular damages all over... that's why many of us chose the glucose /insulin stability that fats friendly meals offers...
 
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MeiChanski

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Hello, it’s hard when someone does not take into consideration that carbohydrates raises our blood sugars, whereas fat doesn’t. I’d say just let them be, what more can we do? We’ll continue enjoying our little to no carb foods because the holidays are coming :)
 

Andydragon

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3,324
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
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Yesterday orange juice200 cal half tin mushy peas 76 cal half tin chicken in whitesauce 254 cal 100g pasta 400 cal half tin fruit cocktail 128 cal = 1058 cal. Maybe a bit less pasta -son cooked it so I'm a bit unsure.
Edit to correct Actually 200 ml (not cals) orange juice that's only 140 cals but also forgot 3x tea with semi skimmed milk so total cals probably about the same or a tad more.
I know others have commented on the carb angle and I’m not getting into that, but that’s not a lot of calories. If you go for the advice on calorie counting the recommendation is to not go below 1200 on a daily basis.

that sort of crash diet doesn’t sound particularly healthy or long term sustainable, is this a temporary diet?
 
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Tannith

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I know others have commented on the carb angle and I’m not getting into that, but that’s not a lot of calories. If you go for the advice on calorie counting the recommendation is to not go below 1200 on a daily basis.

that sort of crash diet doesn’t sound particularly healthy or long term sustainable, is this a temporary diet?
Yes, it's only temporary.
 

Resurgam

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Yesterday orange juice200 cal half tin mushy peas 76 cal half tin chicken in whitesauce 254 cal 100g pasta 400 cal half tin fruit cocktail 128 cal = 1058 cal. Maybe a bit less pasta -son cooked it so I'm a bit unsure.
Edit to correct Actually 200 ml (not cals) orange juice that's only 140 cals but also forgot 3x tea with semi skimmed milk so total cals probably about the same or a tad more.
I have been in remission for over three years now and would not eat any of those foods - they really are not the sort of thing to eat if you want to control your blood glucose levels or Hba1c. Do you test your after meal levels?
 

Tannith

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I have been in remission for over three years now and would not eat any of those foods - they really are not the sort of thing to eat if you want to control your blood glucose levels or Hba1c. Do you test your after meal levels?
No I don't test after meals. I have never understood what that is for.
 

Alexandra100

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3,738
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
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Tablets (oral)
this morning following that day of eating as described above, just over 1050 cals, 5.5
Unless you were to have a huge blowout meal before bed, it is not calories but carbs that will raise your bg. Have you tried totting up the grammes of carbohydrate in the meals you mention?
 

Alexandra100

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Type of diabetes
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No I don't test after meals. I have never understood what that is for.
The idea is to see how your food choices impact your bg. Other factors can impact bg too, but what we eat is probably the easiest for us to control.
 

HSSS

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No I don't test after meals. I have never understood what that is for.
It shows what the food you’ve eaten does to your blood glucose levels. In a non diabetic they briefly rise (food depending) and then quickly are returned to baseline. As a type 2 they rise higher and take longer to return. The better your insulin sensitivity the close to normal the response would be. A typical guideline would be a comparison from before and 2 hrs after food. Ideally no more than 2mmol rise but as close to the pre reading as possible is ideal. I think you will be horrified by the effect of your food choices should you test them.

the fact that you don’t understand this testing of food perhaps explains your resistance to the idea of low carbing. This and your insistence on low calories means I’m not sure you understand carbs and their effects. You’ve obviously looked closely at professor taylors work but have you done the same for the low carb methodology or any of its proponents or have you only looked at one side of the debate? We can suggest some good starting points if interested. Eg dr Jason fung the diabetes code and many others. Have you looked at the links I posted earlier?
 

DCUKMod

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Guys - Whilst there are clearly wide variances in how individuals choose to live with their Type 2 diabetes and what steps they are willing and/or able to take to improve their lives in the shorter or longer term, is it very important that we continue to respect others' choices.

The choices I make may not suit you or any other person, but that doesn't make my choices wrong for me, provided I understand the risks and benefits of my actions.

I think there have been many posts in this thread demonstrating frustrations with others' approaches, some with their personal backing rationale, and others less so, but please do remember we must respect other's ways of doing things.

One size does not fit all.

Thanks
 
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Resurgam

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As I don't restrict calories, but know that those foods would cause me to have very high blood glucose levels, I was wondering just how effective the low calorie diet was at preventing spikes after eating.
If there aren't significant rises, then it is fine, but knowing just how high I would be - high teens at least - I thought it would be a good idea to check.
 

HSSS

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Type of diabetes
Type 2
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Guys - Whilst there are clearly wide variances in how individuals choose to live with their Type 2 diabetes and what steps they are willing and/or able to take to improve their lives in the shorter or longer term, is it very important that we continue to respect others' choices.

The choices I make may not suit you or any other person, but that doesn't make my choices wrong for me, provided I understand the risks and benefits of my actions.

I think there have been many posts in this thread demonstrating frustrations with others' approaches, some with their personal backing rationale, and others less so, but please do remember we must respect other's ways of doing things.

One size does not fit all.

Thanks
If you right and we’re demonstrating a lack of acceptance then you’re totally right in your comments. However I think many of us are concerned that it is not a choice being made but a lack of wider information that’s driving the decisions. My sincerest apologies to @Tannith if I have that wrong.
 

bulkbiker

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Type of diabetes
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provided I understand the risks and benefits of my actions

I think that is exactly where most of us are trying to be useful here.

Trying to explain the risks of some people's actions.
 
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