Covid and Work, Covid Advice and General Chat

[Robinredbreast]

@Robinredbreast Thanks for that link, I was not being sarcastic in any way it was a genuine question arising from my own ponderings on the ethical connotations associated with the vaccine.

For me at the moment is the question of is the Oxford vaccine a live vaccine more pertinent and as I am on a relatively high dosage of steroids that if it is a live vaccine should I take it or would I even be offered it.

Things are very confused.

Actually John, you made me think about it, so I decided to have a quick google about the vegan's and their stance on vaccines and medicines.

 

[JTL]

All new medicines and vaccinations are experimental, if people didn't volunteer or have some faith,, vaccines couldn't be used and I wouldn't be alive if it wasn't for Insulin............. just to add, it's sensible to be a little cautious, I am, but I would rather have it.
edited.

These Covid vaccines are literally experimental in that they have been passed under emergency rules not the normal years of trials that would normally apply to stuff like this.
To much damage done with vaccines for me to just rush into holding my arm out and saying yes please I'll have a shot.
Faith has to be based on something and I'm afraid that government men bankers and multi billion dollar corporations don't instill much of it in me but I only base that on the evidence.
The lies the embezzlements the selfishness and greed that kind of stuff.
I'm not an easy guy to get on side with important stuff like my health and wealth.
I am by no means anti vax as my medical records would show.
I had some disgusting work to do for a local council and went to see my doctor about it.
She said you're not leaving here without first having some vaccines ... this being about ten years back.
Hep vaccines diphtheria tetanus and a couple of others I can't remember but yes sounded good to me.
I asked are these well established vaccines the answer was a very satisfying and detailed yes so I had them there and then.
If I was off to certain parts of the world I'd have certain vaccines too.
What troubles me is people seem to have a blind kind of faith it must be ok they said so on the BBC.
Sometimes the truth can be a bit inconvenient and here's an inconvenient one .... they just eradicated polio in the whole of Africa through vaccination programmes that's great news.
They were holding back on an inconvenient truth though at the time they made the announcement.
They knew they had caused a serious problem.
The problem was the wild polio was gone but has now been replaced with a vaccine induced polio that inflicts more paralysis on its childhood victims than the wild one did and it's spreading.
Spreading across Africa and Asia.
In Asia it's in India and Pakistan and Afghanistan and will soon be in China.
There is no vaccine against this vaccine induced disease. and how would you go about convincing people in the towns cities villages where they are seeing and hearing first hand about what the last vaccine did?
How would your faith be then?
Would you still be wanting the next shot?
This thing at this moment in time cannot be stopped so how long before it heads west and when it does what do we do?
Lockdowns?
Yeah some serious lockdowns might help.
I don't mean to frighten anyone but if the truth frightens you should it not be told?
Here's the story in the Guardian >> https://www.theguardian.com/global-...-spreads-in-africa-after-defeat-of-wild-virus

 

[JTL]

The swine flu vaccine was rushed through under the same rules ..... https://www.theguardian.com/science...top-payouts-in-swine-flu-jab-narcolepsy-cases
and here are frontline workers who were as good as forced to have this stuff and that was the end of having a working life .... https://www.buzzfeed.com/shaunlintern/these-nhs-staff-were-told-the-swine-flu-vaccine-was-safe

Have faith but base it on something and make informed decisions not media led ones or we're all heading down a very dangerous road.
I hope these truths are not removed because they are inconvenient at this time.

 

[Max68]

Stumbled across this suite fascinating interview with Korea's top virus expert. Some interesting stuff on masks and aerosols around the 20 minute mark.

 

[lucylocket61]

for some reason this latest post didnt show on my alerts. I only found it by searching for this thread just in case anyone had posted.

 

[Max68]

Once again mixed messages from the government,. One minute it's panic stations re this new variant which allegedly spreads up to 70% more efficiently and also concern shown about the South African variant which allegedly is affecting more younger people but hey ho the schools are set to throw their doors open come January! Where is the emoji for confused?!?!

Also found the below interesting. Not quite sure what to make of it -

388 under 60 with no underlying health conditions died of Covid in UK (msn.com)

 

[lucylocket61]

Once again mixed messages from the government,. One minute it's panic stations re this new variant which allegedly spreads up to 70% more efficiently and also concern shown about the South African variant which allegedly is affecting more younger people but hey ho the schools are set to throw their doors open come January! Where is the emoji for confused?!?!

Also found the below interesting. Not quite sure what to make of it -

388 under 60 with no underlying health conditions died of Covid in UK (msn.com)

Considering obesity is a pre existing condition, high blood pressure,
Either of which affect a significant proportion of people in the UK, I suspect finding people without at least one pre existing condition over the age of 50 would be hard.

I can't find a list of what counts as a pre existing condition in this context either.

Obesity 29%
High blood pressure 30+%

 

[Max68]

Considering obesity is a pre existing condition, high blood pressure,
Either of which affect a significant proportion of people in the UK, I suspect finding people without at least one pre existing condition over the age of 50 would be hard.

I can't find a list of what counts as a pre existing condition in this context either.

Obesity 29%
High blood pressure 30+%

Totally agree with you. It's a shame there isn't more pinpointed evidence on what constitutes an underlying condition that is "higher risk."

I stumbled across these as well. -

COVID-19 deaths with no underlying health conditions, broken down by age - Office for National Statistics

UK prevalence of underlying conditions which increase the risk of severe COVID-19 disease: a point prevalence study using electronic health records (medrxiv.org)

Although the bottom one states the figures are taken from 2019, which is obviously an error unless the pandemic started a full 12 months prior!

 

[Max68]

Found this interesting -

Asymptomatic transmission of covid-19

https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4851

 

[JTL]

If alcohol works in hand gel scenarios then alcohol surely needs gargling with because this thing lives in your throat.
Monkey Shoulder triple speyside blended malt of three top Speyside whiskies£ 23 quid Morrisons or an American bourbon called Makers Mark available in Morrisons for twenty quid and very easy and smooth to drink at 45% abv or your whisky of choice at 40% and above is worth a gargle each evening surley.
If not do a Trump. His idea was bleaches and disinfectants that worked in a petri dish on a lab work surface must be great it kills the virus but it was a crackpot idea but .... with possibilities.
TCP is a very powerful disinfectant which is basically phenolic acid which you can gargle with with a little water ... I drink it neat .... just enough to flood my throat after washing it around my mouth .... worth thinking about no?

 

[Max68]

If alcohol works in hand gel scenarios then alcohol surely needs gargling with because this thing lives in your throat.
Monkey Shoulder triple speyside blended malt of three top Speyside whiskies£ 23 quid Morrisons or an American bourbon called Makers Mark available in Morrisons for twenty quid and very easy and smooth to drink at 45% abv or your whisky of choice at 40% and above is worth a gargle each evening surley.
If not do a Trump. His idea was bleaches and disinfectants that worked in a petri dish on a lab work surface must be great it kills the virus but it was a crackpot idea but .... with possibilities.
TCP is a very powerful disinfectant which is basically phenolic acid which you can gargle with with a little water ... I drink it neat .... just enough to flood my throat after washing it around my mouth .... worth thinking about no?

I think a few tried that early on, albeit by drinking it!

Iran: Over 700 dead after drinking alcohol to cure coronavirus | Coronavirus pandemic News | Al Jazeera

 

[JTL]

Don't let those who go over the top put you off doing it in a more sensible manner.

 

[lucylocket61]

It doesn't live in our throats. We breathe it in and out. Gargling would only deal with one breath.


.https://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/3917/smpc#gref

Swallowing neat TCP is dangerous.

 

[Max68]

Caution - Victor Meldrew type rant coming!!

Well it seems having a walk and a bit of fresh air is becoming a health risk in itself what with all this crossing the road or walking in the road to avoid others! Not to mention the jogger who came flying around a blind bend on a pavement that left me jumping sideways into a puddled grass verge just to avoid her physical impact along with the obvious aerosols coming from her hard puffing! Fair enough go for a run but at the best of times let alone now why not jog into the road on blind bends to avoid unsuspecting on comers? If I had been 82 rather than 52 I would have gone flying! And don't get me started on cyclists whizzing past on the pavement!

Rant Over!!

 

[JTL]

Throat gargling could reduce the viral load in the throat of patients with URTI. Although it cannot eradicate the virus, it can reduce the viral load in the oropharynx. SARS-CoV-2 shows tropism for the throat tissue, which is associated with disease transmission and severity. No effective antiviral treatment has been developed yet. Throat gargling habits with tap water or saline might be suggested for high-risk populations of quarantined people and medical staff. Throat gargling, which is virtually a cost-free modality, might benefit the general population during the current COVID-19 pandemic.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7266767/

 

[JTL]

SARS-CoV-2 is initially most active in the throat
The team’s suggestion is supported by recent studies showing that the virus is most active in the throat during the early days of SARS-CoV-2 infection. Research has also suggested that gargling with tap water or hypertonic saline can reduce viral load and disease severity in cases of upper respiratory tract infections (URTIs).

Researchers in Hong Kong recently showed that among SARS-CoV-2 patients, viral loads were highest in oropharyngeal swabs taken during the first week of infection, with loads peaking on day four.

Researchers in Germany found that SARS-CoV-2 infection could be diagnosed using throat swabs taken on the first day of symptom onset when illness would typically be mild. During the initial week of infection, viral replication was highest in the throat, while no evidence of infection was identified in feces samples. Furthermore, genome sequencing identified that SARS-CoV-2 present in the throat differed from the virus present in the lung of the same patient.
Another study of SARS-CoV-2 conducted in China showed that a higher viral load in the nasopharynx was associated with more severe disease.
“Reducing the amount of virus in the body tissue at the initial stage of infection might positively influence the course of the disease,” they write. “Thus, throat gargling, an ancient therapeutic method, might be potentially useful in controlling the COVID-19 pandemic.”
More here>>>> https://www.news-medical.net/news/2...-beneficial-during-the-COVID-19-pandemic.aspx

 

[zand]

I gargled with a solution of tap water and salt during the early stages of Covid19, I always do this with sore throats. Not sure if it helped, maybe it reduced the viral load a bit, who knows? It was soothing for a short while and that was why I did it.

 

[bulkbiker]

Considering obesity is a pre existing condition, high blood pressure,
Either of which affect a significant proportion of people in the UK, I suspect finding people without at least one pre existing condition over the age of 50 would be hard.

I can't find a list of what counts as a pre existing condition in this context either.

Obesity 29%
High blood pressure 30+%

this is from the data the 388 figure comes from

 

[lucylocket61]

Link? I notice it also has an unspecified ' other'

 

[HSSS]

That's not the case. If you Watch a thread, you have a choice of having email notifications, plus an alert up on the top right of your browser window, or just an on-screen alert. You can also choose whether you have emails at a thread level.

You receive one alert when there is a new post. If there are 2,4 or 44 new posts since you last visited the thread, you would see one alert.

The thread is watched. I have emails off but alerts on. I’ve had no notifications since this thread was moved. As is always true in this posting area.