Where to start?

[dillydally]

This is a bit of a ramble and a bit of saga so please bear with me - I'm not new to diabetes but I'm new to trying to take it seriously. I always felt, as an overweight Type 2, that I wasn't a 'real' diabetic and I think I've treated it accordingly. It must be at least 12 years since I was first diagnosed and before that, way back in '86 when my son was born, I had gestational diabetes so it was probably on the cards as I didn't really change my ways.

Over the years I've gradually ended up on more and more medication: 360mg gliclazide a day, 2000mg prolonged release metformin and 12ml Victoza plus Empagliflozin until I kept getting urinary infections so dropped that one. I've got the issues that often seem to go along with it - high BP and cholesterol (both ok on meds) but also hypothyroid and got pulmonary fibrosis and ended up on antidepressants. I had a relatively minor stroke about 7 years ago losing function in my right arm for a couple of weeks and it's still a bit weak at times.

I had been feeling nauseous or even been a bit physically sick almost every day for a very long time and gradually realised that it was the metformin so had to come off it. The doctor got me to try to ease back into them but it just started up again so I gave up. Then one day I saw a locum Diabetic Nurse and she said my levels weren't coming down so the Victoza clearly wasn't working so why take it? That was stripped away too with the result that my levels went up again.

Now they've got me on Abasaglar, starting off on 26 units and working up a couple of notches every 2 or 3 days, no other diabetic meds. The DN told me to monitor my bloods 4 times a day and when I told her that one morning I'd had a 7.9 she told me to stop increasing the dose and I only needed to monitor in the morning and last thing at night. That was the only time I'd ever got that low and never since and I was only on about 36 units by then. I never got anywhere near that again (having results ranging between 13.6 and 31.2) so I decided to increase the units again but I'm still only on 44.

The bottom line is that my last blood test came in at 21 for the plasma glucose 'snapshot' and 91 for the HbA1c so the DN asked me to start monitoring more often again. She discussed the idea of some kind of fast acting insulin to take before meals but wanted me to try to stop eating all the ****. I told her I keep having and to do a food diary.

Despite all you've read so far, I'm a reasonably intelligent 68 year old and I know WHAT I should and shouldn't be eating. I've read up on here about lowering carbs and would really like to try but almost everything I enjoy/crave is high and when I try cutting back I feel so hungry all the time. I've noted down what I've eaten for the past few days and can see it's effect but wondered if there's anyone out there who can relate to this and suggest how my discussion should go with the DN or give some advice - other than 'stop whinging and pull your socks up'!! which is what I say to myself. Here's an example of the last few days, I have maybe 2 or 3 cups of tea a day between meals but don't think I'm drinking enough:

8.45 AM Bloods 16.2 Breakfast: 2 egg mushroom omelette cup of tea milk no sugar

1.30 PM Bloods 15.4 Lunch: Ham roll butter cup of tea

7PM Bloods 16.1 Tea: Chicken and Vegetable Stir Fry using a bit of hoi sin sauce and 1 strip of noodles Can coke zero. 12 raspberries to follow, cup of tea

11.40PM Bedtime Bloods 19.1

Took 44 units Abasaglar before bed

NEXT DAY

8.00AM Bloods 16.4 Breakfast: porridge made with 200ml semi skimmed milk


1.10PM Bloods 15.2 Lunch: egg sarnie made with 1 slice white bread. 2 satsumas

18.05PM Bloods 14.1 Baked potato with tuna and bit of mayo, beetroot, cup of tea

19.00 One KFC chicken leg that I could no longer resist after rest of family had takeaway coke zero

21.00 Bloods 18.7 cup of tea and one cherry bakewell that forced its way into my mouth

24,00 Bedtime Bloods 17.8

i think you get the idea - I'm pretty useless really and it drags me down meaning I really can't get to grips with it all and have a constant headache. Another day I had bloods of 10.2 on waking - YAY but had 2 weetabix and 5 hours later my bloods were 16.4 so I think they're out but last night I had a chunky Kit Kat with a cup of tea at 19.00 (yeah told you I'm useless) and by midnight bedtime I was 11.9 and this morning I was 9.2 the lowest I've been for months. Does this mean I should live on chocolate???

(Mod edits in line with forum language policy)

 

[EllieM]

Welcome to the forums @dillydally .

First I''m going to give you a really useful link about T2 and food by @JoKalsbeek

JoKalsbeek's blog | Diabetes Forum • The Global Diabetes Community

As a T2 your body is intolerant to carbs, and the so called healthy diet that has been pushed for the last few decades (ever since the now discredited study that demonised fats and pushed carbs) is full of carbs. Most T2s find their blood sugars shoot up after cereals, bread, rice, pasta and (most) fruit (though berries are OK).

I think your problem is that you have been taking out all the so called "bad" stuff (but leaving in lots of carbs) and you haven't replaced it with low carb alternatives. I'd be starving if I ate your diet.

So what about bacon and egg for breakfast? Or unsweetened Greek yoghurt with reheated frozen raspberries? (And yes your omelet breakfast was perfect.)

Use cream instead of semi skimmed milk. Ditch the bread and cereals, including porridge. Hopefully some T2s will post soon to make more low carb suggestions.

And forget the blame. Would you blame someone with coeliac's disease who got sick because they'd been eating gluten? You have a genetically low tolerance to carbohydrates and the food industry continually promotes as healthy low fat food which has had the fat replaced by carbs.

Good luck.

 

[kvetiny]

Your blood sugars are similar to mine. Any carbs I eat even the smallest portion size and my blood sugars sky rocket. I've been trying hard to reduce my carbs recently but just remain hungry still. Love my carbs but they hate me. Hope I don't loose weight trying to be more healthy. I'm already slim. Guess I have to experiment more with meal ideas. HBA1C is 68. Want to bring it into the 50s.

 

[Brunneria]

You aren’t eating much, are you?
I would be ravenous on that lot. All those carbs (which just make you hungry for more) and precious little else.
Am I right that you are trying to cut down fat?

I’m going to suggest two things, because they are relatively simple and because they will add nice appetising things to your food that will make you want to eat them.

firstly, have a read of the www.dietdoctor.com website.
Browse through the recipes. Pick a couple. Enjoy. The food and flavours are fantastic.
By adding in more protein you will get less hungry for carbs.

secondly, swap out your bread for low carb options. That way you can cut all the carbs but still enjoy toast and buns.
The ‘seriously low carb’ brand do delicious rolls and loaves. Expensive, but my husband loves them.
Or try the Live Life brand you can get in some supermarkets.
Burgen do some lower carb breads too.

as you know, your weetabix isn’t doing you any favours, but it isn’t easy to remove anything unless you can replace it with something better, nicer, more deliciously appealing. So, what would a fabulously delicious breakfast look like to you?
Greek yoghurt with blueberries and a drizzle of syrup?
You can have that. Just get a low carb/keto syrup from Amazon.
Scrambled egg with smoked salmon?
You can have that with a dollop of cream cheese too.
Bacon sarnie?
Yup, you can have that too. Just use a low carb bread and plenty of bacon...

and if you want cake, then you can. No guilt.
Just buy low carb ones from companies like Deliciously Low Carb, or make a two minute microwave low carb mug cake.
Just check out these recipes:
https://www.inspiredherway.com/keto-mug-cake-recipes/

You will feel much better, more positive, more energetic, if you get your blood glucose lower.
Just remember to keep checking it with your meter. Dropping the carbs will drop your insulin needs too, and you don’t want to end up hypoing.

 

[dillydally]

Hi everyone. Sorry I haven't responded but I had to go away the day after posting this to go 'up north' for a funeral and have just got back a short while ago and learned I have to go back for another one next week. Neither linked to Covid but both family members I had been close to growing up so I do want to be there.

I'm not sure if it's best to reply to each individual post so I thought I'd do one post to everyone. Please do advise if it's better individually thanks.

First of all thank you EllieM I did manage to see your post but not do anything with it until now but I have followed the links and will read everything you've recommended!

Good luck with your attempts to reduce your levels kveteeny. We'll have to compare notes altho as I'm a fat Type 2 I don't know if I'll face quite the same issues as you!! I imagine tho we'll still have issues in common trying to find stuff that keeps us full and doesn't send our bloods soaring. My son's friend has type 1 and whenever he visited he would check all the ingredients in whatever I had made and inject insulin accordingly so in my naivety I thought that made everything ok. My doctor sent me an email today about a separate health issue which I now need to see her about (nothing to do with diabetes) and when I logged on to my records I noticed that my HbA1c was actually 97 last time, not 91, so a bit worse than I thought.

Thank you too Brunneria. I can sadly assure you that I have been eating more than that - mostly junk or carb heavy stuff as I get very depressed and just eat anything **** the consequences - but was trying to start cutting down and still not amending what I was doing. I think a low carb diet is the only way for me but I did try to start that before - I had a go at making some low carb bread and low carb ''cereal' for breakfast but they were gross! I think really need to do some planning and start with a shopping list then do menus so I always know what I'm going to have and that it's easily to hand that way I might not just pick up what's easiest. I'll be reading the suggested links everyone has sent me and get back to you to let you know how I get on once my other funeral is out of the way.

Thanks again

Just another question for those doing low carb - do other members of your household do it with you?

 

[dillydally]

Sorry just one more thing - I've just seen something about my first post being edited because I had used words that 'don’t fit with the forum language policy. As the forum is open to people of all ages and from different cultures, we have rather a high bar. Most ‘offending’ words are automatically censored but some that can be used in different contexts are not'. and I've also just seen a word has been asterisked on my latest post. I'm very sorry if anything I wrote might have offended anyone so might limit what I put in future as I have no idea what I said to cause this. Please forgive me

 

[Antje77]

Hi @dillydally , I'm sorry about the losses you are experiencing. I hope you'll have a good time with your family, being together does help.

Please do advise if it's better individually thanks.

One post makes more sense!
As you can see, you can simply select the part you want to reply to and a little reply button appears
Alternatively, you can use @ plus a name, and the person tagged that way will get an alert.

I had a go at making some low carb bread and low carb ''cereal' for breakfast but they were gross!

For myself, I don't use much 'low carb alternatives' as, like you say, many of them aren't very tasty. (Although there definitely are exceptions to this!)
Instead my meals are usually centered around food I already ate before diabetes with the obvious carby part left out. So meat, veggies, cheese, cream, yoghurt.
Bacon and eggs taste fine without the bread, and I often add cheese or cream to my veggies, and usually have more than one kind of vegetable for dinner.
I'm a snacker as well, especially late at night. I prefer snacks not needing insulin before bed, so my go to's are nuts, pork scratchings (with aioli ), dark chocolate, chicory leaves with hummus, olives, cold meats like salami, different cheeses, cheese crisps.

You might like to have a look at this thread for inspiration and a bit of a chat: https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/what-have-you-eaten-today.75781/page-2222#post-2393918

 

[dillydally]

I've just had a chance to re-read what I originally wrote and see that the editing seems to be linked to some 'rudish' words i used although I had asterisked them myself - won't happen again promise

 

[Antje77]

Sorry just one more thing - I've just seen something about my first post being edited because I had used words that 'don’t fit with the forum language policy. As the forum is open to people of all ages and from different cultures, we have rather a high bar. Most ‘offending’ words are automatically censored but some that can be used in different contexts are not'. and I've also just seen a word has been asterisked on my latest post. I'm very sorry if anything I wrote might have offended anyone so might limit what I put in future as I have no idea what I said to cause this. Please forgive me

Don't worry about it, nothing bad!
The asterisks in your last post were automated by the forum filter, the ones in your first post were very mild expletives. If you try to avoid any words you wouldn't use in front of your very conservative 98 year old great aunt (even half-asterisked) you should be fine! You won't get in trouble with us for 'bad words' when it's clearly not your intention to offend

 

[MrsA2]

Just another question for those doing low carb - do other members of your household do it with you?

I am lucky in that my husband and adult son are both very supportive and mostly eat whatever I put in front of them. All of us have cut down on snacks and ready meals but often I just add carbs to their meals. For example tonight was fish, they had oven chips, I didn't . They have both lost weight, but not as much as me. Some nights the entire meal is low carb, I make lc treats for myself which I portion and freeze. The rule is , if they want soemthing I cant have and yet I would want, then they source and make it as I'm not good at refusing or saying no to food.
For example son did the shopping this week and came home with 2 doughnuts and 2 pies. I don't buy those when I shop for all of us.
However I think it would be very expensive for a large family to go low carb, just because carbs are cheap.
Its really a matter of finding what works for you and your family.

 

[Resurgam]

I find it quite easy to cater for the two of us and provide carbs for himself.
Tonight, for instance, I roasted a chicken and had stir fry with it, but warmed up some Yorkshire puddings for him and served up gravy and peas as well.
I felt a bit dismal this morning, so I had red jelly and cream for breakfast.
Tomorrow I plan on chicken and salad stuff unless I feel dismal again - then I might have purple jelly and cream.

 

[Brunneria]

There is just the two of us.
I do all the major cooking. Meat, fish, eggs, sauces, etc. Those are all usually batch cooking. Roasts, curries, stews, burgers, etc. Some have veg already in them. Every time I cook I try to make 8-10 portions of it. At the moment we have around 20 portions of home made 100% lamb or beef burgers and about 15 assorted other home made meals in portioned trays in the freezer.

Then, while the meal is cooking or reheating, he comes sniffing round like a prospecting bisto kid, sees what it is and then gets his own carbs. Bread rice, potatoes. Although he often chooses low carb veg and skips the potato. And his bread is one of the low carb ones. I would guess he eats about 80% low carb, and there is no sign he is suffering. He’s lost a chunk of weight, too.

if he snacks (v rare), he tends to go for carby options sitting at his desk. I usually don’t notice unless the crunching is extreme.

 

[Roggg]

Hey @dillydally. I'll give you my thoughts and experiences. Take it for what it's worth.

For type-2, diet is key. On the "standard American diet" (SAD), diabetes is a chronic progressive disease. That's what you have experienced, and that's what I experienced when I wasn't taking it seriously as well. A number of dietary changes have been studied, and several of them have shown to be able to make significant improvements, even remission.

I have personally tried "Newcastle" which is an ultra-low calorie, but short-term intervention. Typically it's around 8-12 weeks of eating around 800 calories a day. I have also tried low carb. In fact I eat "keto", which is ultra-low carb to this day.

I got good results on both protocols, but the low-cal was extremely hard to stick to. Keto for me is sustainable long-term. I find low carb/keto was hard to adjust to but gets easier over time. In my experience, the lower I go, the easier it gets after the initial adjustment period (ie the cravings). The cravings lasted for me several weeks, but there are also emotional attachments to certain foods that dont necessarily go away.

If you want a radical change in your health, you probably need to make a significant shift in your diet. If you want to give low-carb a serious go, I have three pieces of advice. Again, I am not an expert. This is not medical advice. Please look out for yourself, and take everything with a grain of salt.

1. Make sure your doctor knows what you are doing, and your meds get adjusted as you go. Some meds can cause hypo events if your carb intake drops quickly but your doses are not adjusted.
2. All-in works better (for me) than gradual. I fall prey to the slippery slope, but also, my cravings fade quicker when I'm all-in as presumably my body gets fat adapted.
3. Especially in the adjustment phase, make sure you dont try to limit calories. Eat when you are hungry, but eat low-carb foods.

I'm sorry to hear you're having a tough time. I hope you find a way to improvement that works for you. This community is very supportive and helpful, so stay in touch.

 

[dillydally]

Hey @dillydally. I'll give you my thoughts and experiences. Take it for what it's worth.

For type-2, diet is key. On the "standard American diet" (SAD), diabetes is a chronic progressive disease. That's what you have experienced, and that's what I experienced when I wasn't taking it seriously as well. A number of dietary changes have been studied, and several of them have shown to be able to make significant improvements, even remission.

I have personally tried "Newcastle" which is an ultra-low calorie, but short-term intervention. Typically it's around 8-12 weeks of eating around 800 calories a day. I have also tried low carb. In fact I eat "keto", which is ultra-low carb to this day.

I got good results on both protocols, but the low-cal was extremely hard to stick to. Keto for me is sustainable long-term. I find low carb/keto was hard to adjust to but gets easier over time. In my experience, the lower I go, the easier it gets after the initial adjustment period (ie the cravings). The cravings lasted for me several weeks, but there are also emotional attachments to certain foods that dont necessarily go away.

If you want a radical change in your health, you probably need to make a significant shift in your diet. If you want to give low-carb a serious go, I have three pieces of advice. Again, I am not an expert. This is not medical advice. Please look out for yourself, and take everything with a grain of salt.

1. Make sure your doctor knows what you are doing, and your meds get adjusted as you go. Some meds can cause hypo events if your carb intake drops quickly but your doses are not adjusted.
2. All-in works better (for me) than gradual. I fall prey to the slippery slope, but also, my cravings fade quicker when I'm all-in as presumably my body gets fat adapted.
3. Especially in the adjustment phase, make sure you dont try to limit calories. Eat when you are hungry, but eat low-carb foods.

I'm sorry to hear you're having a tough time. I hope you find a way to improvement that works for you. This community is very supportive and helpful, so stay in touch.

Thanks so much for your response. Everyone has been so helpful. I've been told how to reply to people but haven't quite understood it yet so hope this appears!!

Everything you've said fits me exactly. I tried the Newcastle style using VLCD meal replacements but most stuff apart from the 'milk' shakes were not very nice and I just couldn't go that low although the short time I tried did seem to make a difference.

I am definitely going to give the low carb a try but don't think I could go very low. Yesterday I was 9.6 when I got up - the lowest I've been in the morning for a long time - I'd had fish and chips the night before after travelling home from a funeral but ended up dumping most of the chips which were horrible and leaving off half the batter. Yesterday morning I had a full cooked breakfast (bacon, egg, tomatoes, mushrooms and some ASDA sausages that were about 2.2g carbs per 100g) by the time I felt like eating again at nearly half 2 my bloods were 7.7 I can't remember the last time I had anything like that!! Needless to say I ended up having a bit of cake about 8 in the evening (because it was there) so was 16.4 by the time I went to bed at midnight but I got up this morning with a 9.9 so as long as I can find low carb treats for when I really want something sweet I reckon I could have a shot at getting this right.

I've been using the links mentioned on here to check out best foods and recipes so I just need to spend some time doing shopping lists etc and then get going. Thanks again everyone. I'll stop writing now cos I'm a bit slow at this and had to check pictures of bikes to prove I'm not a robot

 

[dillydally]

I find it quite easy to cater for the two of us and provide carbs for himself.
Tonight, for instance, I roasted a chicken and had stir fry with it, but warmed up some Yorkshire puddings for him and served up gravy and peas as well.
I felt a bit dismal this morning, so I had red jelly and cream for breakfast.
Tomorrow I plan on chicken and salad stuff unless I feel dismal again - then I might have purple jelly and cream.

Jelly! I forgot jelly - I used to love the low sugar ones as a treat and I know I've still got some packets in the drawer. Mmmm where's the kettle? And tonight I had stir fry.