Just an update on keto/low carb high levels

[lcarter]

Hi guys.

Well, I’ve been trying to stick to under 20g of carbs daily for 12 days now. Whenever I’ve had ketones I haven’t been happy about it because my bloody sugar levels are still through the roof.

What’s worse is that I’ve spoke to my medical team and I’ve just got to wait for an appointment with my consultant but there’s a long list at the moment.

Diabetic nurse and dr happy for me to take correction doses of insulin but they’re not entirely sure why my levels are so high when I’m not eating hardly any carbs.

Is there any point in doing low carb and keto? I’m so fed up.

Why isn’t this working for me?

Is it insulin resistance that’s so severe even without carbs I’m soaring around at 18-20 without synthetic insulin?

Dr checked my c peptide and confirmed I’m deffo producing lots of my own insulin.

I’m scared to go into ketosis again despite showing blood ketones of 1.6, I felt well except for a headache.

Why aren’t my levels going down?

I’m on Metformin, the only regime that’s controlled my diabetes well enough so far was 25mg empagliflozin with Metformin, and I was eating carbs as the dr told me not to low carb.

I know you’re not medical professionals but even they seem to have given up on me.

For example today I took 10 units of insulin trying to get my levels from 17 down. Went for a walk, drank lots of water. Levels went down to 12 then shot back up.

I’m confident in making changes myself, and I’m really reluctant to go back onto background insulin and fast acting as it doesn’t make enough of a difference.

I feel like I’ve got glucose from years just sat in me with no way of letting it out.

I’m really upset today. Sorry but I feel hopeless.

 

[Jaylee]

Hi @lcarter ,

What insulin/s are you prescribed? (apologies if i've missed it mentioned elsewhere.)

 

[Antje77]

Dr checked my c peptide and confirmed I’m deffo producing lots of my own insulin.

Was this a recent test?

 

[Member496333]

Yes it is worth persisting with keto. Apart from anything else if you start eating lots of carbs this will drive you into using bigger insulin doses. In turn, if you really are producing lots of your own, this will not only further worsen resistance but it will also increase your chances of overdoing injections and setting yourself up for a major hypo failure somewhere in your low carb experiments.

At this stage until someone gives you contrary information regarding your insulin production then I see no other option. Really sorry to hear of your troubles. The NHS sucks at the moment and trying to be taken seriously can be like getting blood out of a stone. The only encouragement I can offer is that overcoming insulin resistance in myself was a monumental effort requiring lots of soul searching and brutal tenacity. But I did it. Through the lens of 20/20 hindsight it was actually very simple, but there were times along the journey where it seemed anything but.

Keep calm and carry on. Don't put glucose in. Burn what's already there. Get your insulin tested again ASAP.

 

[xfieldok]

It took me 4 weeks to break the carb addiction and to start to see lower bg levels. All sorts of things can raise your levels. Stress, sleep, vax, infections etc. I would say, hang on in there a bit longer.

 

[Ronancastled]

I’m really upset today. Sorry but I feel hopeless.

Well rest assured nobody here will give up on you.
I'm not an insulin user so can't advise on that I'm afraid.

So your C-pep came back fine, may I ask if the doctor gave you any metrics ?
Somebody here before spoke about a special unit for those with high insulin resistance, perhaps others can advise further.

Besides that please persevere with your Keto regime.
It's possible that your body/liver has become accustomed to higher glucose levels, the body fights to protect stasis.
Please persist as if/when it falls it may be rapid.

Good luck

 

[In Response]

As a Type 1 on insulin, I find low carb incredibly challenging (for me it is not worth the effort) as, in the absence of carbs, protein breaks down into glucose at a different rate and different ratios for different proteins. Just because I eat no or few carbs, does not mean my blood sugar levels remain low in the absence of injected insulin. It means the opposite - I still need insulin and the dosing is complex.
If I understand correctly, there is some debate about your type. If that is the case, keto may not be your friend.

 

[lcarter]

Hi @lcarter ,

What insulin/s are you prescribed? (apologies if i've missed it mentioned elsewhere.)

Levemier and fiasp x

 

[lcarter]

Was this a recent test?

Two years ago this Christmas…

 

[lcarter]

As a Type 1 on insulin, I find low carb incredibly challenging (for me it is not worth the effort) as, in the absence of carbs, protein breaks down into glucose at a different rate and different ratios for different proteins. Just because I eat no or few carbs, does not mean my blood sugar levels remain low in the absence of injected insulin. It means the opposite - I still need insulin and the dosing is complex.
If I understand correctly, there is some debate about your type. If that is the case, keto may not be your friend.

They told me I was a type 1 for 11 years until the c peptide test. I’m so over trying to understand my body when the doctors have no clue either

 

[lcarter]

Well rest assured nobody here will give up on you.
I'm not an insulin user so can't advise on that I'm afraid.

So your C-pep came back fine, may I ask if the doctor gave you any metrics ?
Somebody here before spoke about a special unit for those with high insulin resistance, perhaps others can advise further.

Besides that please persevere with your Keto regime.
It's possible that your body/liver has become accustomed to higher glucose levels, the body fights to protect stasis.
Please persist as if/when it falls it may be rapid.

Good luck

Ask I recall is him fasting ‘2000’ which was under type 1. Thank you for your kind words

 

[lcarter]

It took me 4 weeks to break the carb addiction and to start to see lower bg levels. All sorts of things can raise your levels. Stress, sleep, vax, infections etc. I would say, hang on in there a bit longer.

Thanks I’ll try

 

[lcarter]

Yes it is worth persisting with keto. Apart from anything else if you start eating lots of carbs this will drive you into using bigger insulin doses. In turn, if you really are producing lots of your own, this will not only further worsen resistance but it will also increase your chances of overdoing injections and setting yourself up for a major hypo failure somewhere in your low carb experiments.

At this stage until someone gives you contrary information regarding your insulin production then I see no other option. Really sorry to hear of your troubles. The NHS sucks at the moment and trying to be taken seriously can be like getting blood out of a stone. The only encouragement I can offer is that overcoming insulin resistance in myself was a monumental effort requiring lots of soul searching and brutal tenacity. But I did it. Through the lens of 20/20 hindsight it was actually very simple, but there were times along the journey where it seemed anything but.

Keep calm and carry on. Don't put glucose in. Burn what's already there. Get your insulin tested again ASAP.

I think I need to get tested again. I’m going to call my doctor tomorrow and see if I can arrange another c peptide test, but I’m not holding out much hope.

What if I’m a type 1 after all?

How can I be this insulin resistant as a type 2? I’m trying to burn the glucose but I’m struggling to see anything positive. I’ve been at 18 most of today and even after 20 units over six hours my levels are 14.

I’ve had close to zero carbs. I’m hungry too, it’s crazy. Thank you for bearing with me.

 

[Member496333]

I think I need to get tested again. I’m going to call my doctor tomorrow and see if I can arrange another c peptide test, but I’m not holding out much hope.

What if I’m a type 1 after all?

How can I be this insulin resistant as a type 2? I’m trying to burn the glucose but I’m struggling to see anything positive. I’ve been at 18 most of today and even after 20 units over six hours my levels are 14.

I’ve had close to zero carbs. I’m hungry too, it’s crazy. Thank you for bearing with me.

You can be insulin deficient and simultaneously insulin resistant, but being deficient doesn’t automatically indicate true autoimmune type 1. There are a number of possible causes for a failing pancreas. Often it’s just fat deposits and this can be reversed or at least improved. To be honest even if you are deficient it seems like you’re still resistant so all the insulin in the world isn’t going to fix that.

Wow you’re really in a pickle. Are you sure you’re not unwittingly eating something with loads of carbs in??

 

[xfieldok]

Can you tell us what you have eaten today? Maybe we can spot something you missed.

 

[h884]

Hi lcarter

Really sorry to hear about the ongoing problems you are facing. You must be feeling terrible as well as frustrated.

Not the same circumstances as you are in but it took my GP a long time to stop simply prescribing medication which caused me no end of side effects and refer me to the diabetic clinic where they discovered I had type 1 not type 2.

Sorry I do not have any suggestions, apart from to keep going back to your Doctor to stress how you are feeling and hopefully they will do something to get you seen sooner by your Consultant.

Thinking about you

 

[Ronancastled]

Ask I recall is him fasting ‘2000’ which was under type 1. Thank you for your kind words

OK, this is a learning experience for me too.
I hit Google

Normal Range
The normal range for fasting blood C-peptide levels is around 0.8 – 3.85 ng/mL or 0.26 – 1.27 nmol/L (260 – 1270 pmol/L).

So you are correct, based on your most current labs you are actually over-producing insulin if your fasting level is 2000 pmol/L.
So, my next port of call is your meter & your strips, are you confident in them ? Have you a backup meter
What about all the classics, fatigue, blurry vision, constant thirst & urination ?

Stick with us & we'll get there

 

[lcarter]

You can be insulin deficient and simultaneously insulin resistant, but being deficient doesn’t automatically indicate true autoimmune type 1. There are a number of possible causes for a failing pancreas. Often it’s just fat deposits and this can be reversed or at least improved. To be honest even if you are deficient it seems like you’re still resistant so all the insulin in the world isn’t going to fix that.

Wow you’re really in a pickle. Are you sure you’re not unwittingly eating something with loads of carbs in??

I have coffee and double cream for breakfast every day. Usually three cups.

Lunch is usually a salad— tuna Mayo or chicken Mayo with round lettuce and cucumber.

If I’ve made the low carb carrot cake I have a slice of that—3.6g of carbs in total.

If I snack it’s two squares of 85% Lindt dark chocolate, meat (Cold Cooked gammon/ chicken) peperami (not often) cubes of cheese or olives. Full fat yoghurt and seeds, walnuts and cashews.

(I’ve tried bovril and didn’t like it…)

Dinner is the same—homemade chilli without the kidney beans with cauliflower rice, homemade guacamole with chicken and salad or I have cheese and meat if I can’t be bothered to cook.

I have sugar free caramel in all my coffees but I’m stopping that now as I’ve ran out. Stevia sweetener Or Candarel.

That’s what i eat, could the sugar free caramel be the culprit or the sweetener?

 

[lcarter]

Hi lcarter

Really sorry to hear about the ongoing problems you are facing. You must be feeling terrible as well as frustrated.

Not the same circumstances as you are in but it took my GP a long time to stop simply prescribing medication which caused me no end of side effects and refer me to the diabetic clinic where they discovered I had type 1 not type 2.

Sorry I do not have any suggestions, apart from to keep going back to your Doctor to stress how you are feeling and hopefully they will do something to get you seen sooner by your Consultant.

Thinking about you

Thank you ️

 

[lcarter]

OK, this is a learning experience for me too.
I hit Google



So you are correct, based on your most current labs you are actually over-producing insulin if your fasting level is 2000 pmol/L.
So, my next port of call is your meter & your strips, are you confident in them ? Have you a backup meter
What about all the classics, fatigue, blurry vision, constant thirst & urination ?

Stick with us & we'll get there

I use the freestyle LibreLink sensor, but I test with my meter too. I am confident in those.

I’m not showing any of the classic symptoms, I’m not even very thirsty. Since coming off the empagliflozin my urination has returned to normal.

I get the occasional headache and tiredness but I work too much so it could be that