So now I know weetabix are out!

[Ronancastled]

We will have to agree to disagree that spiking into 8 plus is ok for health.

Although I'll agree with the 7.8 cutoff is consistent across the studies you've listed don't most of them only reference it as the 2 hour value.
Who's to say where you've peaked in those 2 hours yet according to the medical profession once you're <7.8 @ 2 hours you're good.
Pre-CGMs the only 1 hour data we had on non-diabetics came from OGTTs with multiple draws.
Only GD offer a diagnostic cutoff at one hour which I believe is 180mg/dl or 10mmol/L.

Although we differ on the definition of an allowable spike I hope we can agree on hyper insulin & the role it plays in inflammation & obesity feeding this viscous cycle.
I'm glad you mentioned Kraft, I'm aware of private labs in the US offering his insulin assay.
I'd love to have one done.

All the best

 

[Mbaker]

Although I'll agree with the 7.8 cutoff is consistent across the studies you've listed don't most of them only reference it as the 2 hour value.
Who's to say where you've peaked in those 2 hours yet according to the medical profession once you're <7.8 @ 2 hours you're good.
Pre-CGMs the only 1 hour data we had on non-diabetics came from OGTTs with multiple draws.
Only GD offer a diagnostic cutoff at one hour which I believe is 180mg/dl or 10mmol/L.

Although we differ on the definition of an allowable spike I hope we can agree on hyper insulin & the role it plays in inflammation & obesity feeding this viscous cycle.
I'm glad you mentioned Kraft, I'm aware of private labs in the US offering his insulin assay.
I'd love to have one done.

All the best

Take your points, especially the hyper insulin and inflammation. I love the works of Chris Knobbe. His hypothesis for me is the most compelling route cause on the seed / vegetable oils causing the inflammation. I particularly like the words at 42.10 as to why low carb diets work, and 43.50 about the condition of people in 1911 with no dietary advice and what they were eating:

 

[Tannith]

Not sure that either of those points is correct.

The LDL number in the UK is usually calculated and not measured and rarely if ever is it split into LDL sub-types.

And as many of us are now "normoglycemics" it's a moot point anyway?

"Diabetic dyslipidaemia includes not only quantitative lipoprotein abnormalities, but also qualitative and kinetic abnormalities that, together, result in a shift towards a more atherogenic lipid profile. The primary quantitative lipoprotein abnormalities are increased triacylglycerol (triglyceride) levels and decreased HDL-cholesterol levels. Qualitative lipoprotein abnormalities include an increase in large, very low-density lipoprotein subfraction 1 (VLDL1) and small, dense LDLs, as well as increased triacylglycerol content of LDL and HDL, glycation of apolipoproteins and increased susceptibility of LDL to oxidation. The main kinetic abnormalities are increased VLDL1 production, decreased VLDL catabolism and increased HDL catabolism. In addition, even though LDL-cholesterol levels are typically normal in patients with type 2 diabetes, LDL particles show reduced turnover, which is potentially atherogenic." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4392164/

• Just because we don't usually measure this split into LDL sub types in the UK doesn't mean its not there. If it were routinely measured people might be more aware of the more dodgy LDL profile of T2 diabetics. I'm trying to keep my LDL down now I know that it's in a riskier form in T2s

 

[coby]

depends on how you are defining 'essential'

for me, fibre is essential for my whole health. Period.

I watched the video you linked and found it interesting. Particularly as the participants in the study had pretty severe digestive issues, all of them. So not representative of a range of the digestion of a population, There was no description of their previous diet or the cause of their unusually severe constipation/bleeding/anal tears, or how long it had been a problem, or what other interventions had been tried, or what medications they may be on.

It didnt say how long the experiment lasted. Or the type of fibre and amount people were eating during the experiment, in one group, or before the experiment as a whole group. The sex of the participants wasnt mentioned, or the ages. Hormones have a powerful affect on digestion, ask any woman what happens to her digestion over her monthly cycle and during menopause - there can be big fluctuations in transit, hardness and size over that time and cycle.

I am truly happy you have a way of eating which works for you, but we are all different. For some of us, including me, fibre is essential for overall health. There is more to food intake than nutrition.

In 1987 I read a book called 'The Change Your Life Diet' on this very subject. After reading it I remember thinking "Oh my goodess! My dad's going to get bowel cancer" I was so worried that I passed on the book to mum, hoping she would se what I had seen. She either didn't read it, or dismissed it. My dad was diagnosed with bowel cancer in 1990 and died in 1992 aged just 66. He had a bland diet, living mainly on Chicken soup, and meat that was minced twice over to make it soft. He had no fibre whatsoever.

 

[Tannith]

S

In 1987 I read a book called 'The Change Your Life Diet' on this very subject. After reading it I remember thinking "Oh my goodess! My dad's going to get bowel cancer" I was so worried that I passed on the book to mum, hoping she would se what I had seen. She either didn't read it, or dismissed it. My dad was diagnosed with bowel cancer in 1990 and died in 1992 aged just 66. He had a bland diet, living mainly on Chicken soup, and meat that was minced twice over to make it soft. He had no fibre whatsoever.

So sorry to hear that Coby. Console yourself that even if your Dad had changed his diet in 1987 it would be unlikely that that would have been soon enough to prevent the cancer.

 

[coby]

S

So sorry to hear that Coby. Console yourself that even if your Dad had changed his diet in 1987 it would be unlikely that that would have been soon enough to prevent the cancer.

I know Tannith, but it was the shock of realising, and that there was nothing I could do

 

[Ushthetaff]

Weetabix is one of those what I call “ magic” foods ! I’ve seen the carb content and adjusted insulin to suit in fact have over compensated and still wooosh high bs , so I now don’t eat “ magic “ foods

 

[bulkbiker]

Just because we don't usually measure this split into LDL sub types in the UK doesn't mean its not there. If it were routinely measured people might be more aware of the more dodgy LDL profile of T2 diabetics. I'm trying to keep my LDL down now I know that it's in a riskier form in T2s

You are conflating two very different things.. calculated "total LDL" which as a number is pretty meaningless as your article appears to state and the subfraction which is rarely if ever measured. Looking at one is pointless and the other is not measured so monitoring your total LDL is a meaningless exercise.

Most people use Trig/HDL ratios as a proxy for subfractions with a lower number implying large dense particles and a high number (greater than 1) as implying the "dangerous" small dense particles.

"The primary quantitative lipoprotein abnormalities are increased triacylglycerol (triglyceride) levels and decreased HDL-cholesterol levels"

I'm sorry to say you are looking at the wrong metric.

 

[Jaylee]

Hi everybody,

To quote the old advertising "strap line,"
some members "must have had their Weetabix" what with some of the derailing in process..

Please keep it on track.

Thanx in advance for your compliance..

 

[kvetiny]

I used to love eating cereals, Weetabix and porridge. Far too carb heavy resulting in very high BG. I eat 1/2 a Weetabix to fix a hypo. About 6.5 grams of carbs there which breaks down quickly and gets me out of trouble.

 

[Tannith]

I used to love eating cereals, Weetabix and porridge. Far too carb heavy resulting in very high BG. I eat 1/2 a Weetabix to fix a hypo. About 6.5 grams of carbs there which breaks down quickly and gets me out of trouble.

Thank goodness I can eat wheatabix. I had dental treatment last month and it was the only thing I could comfortably eat for days!

[Mod edit inline with topic.]

 

[DC10]

Ahahhhhh. Such is the power of self testing. There's no getting away from that immediate feedback, right before your eyes?

Keep up the good work. Your big learning adventure has begun.

You'll be fine.

When I became type 2 I just got told to eat healthily. I had to request a meter so that I knew what I could/couldn’t eat. I had gestational diabetes before becoming type 2 which taught me a lot. Insulin with the first but a meter with the second and managed the whole pregnancy adjusting my food. So many people could diet this way and manage diabetes this way. I see a lot of people that don’t change their habits at all, most likely down to bad advice. I have read lots of books and am currently reading Dr Perlmutter and his advice against eating grains which contribute so many diseases today.

 

[DC10]

I’m type 2 but I can’t find any medication to take as everything I take gives me diarrhoea and headaches I also have multiple sclerosis so identifying the 2 symptoms of both is impossible to tell what Symptoms go with what

Read Dr Perlmutter books….. the effects of grains on ms and diabetes