Metformin

[kevsta]

Hi everyone

Not been on for awhile, hope your all ok

So had my yearly review the other day and my Hba1c is 76mmol and the doctor said that she wants me to go on metformin

And I politely asked her to wait until I processed what she was saying and also speak to the nurse and my partner about it

I’m just not sure

I don’t like the idea of adding a chemical to my body that, inhibits my body’s natural response

Or is that crazy talk?

I also asked the doctor about the LibreLink, about getting it on prescription and she said that basically you can only get it if I’m on insulin

Whilst I agree with what she said

Surely putting people who have T2 on a LibreLink to help them manage the sugar levels before they advise them to go on metformin.

I did it use it but it’s expensive!!

Lockdown hasn’t been kind and I’ve got lower back issues on my L4 and L5 and have been referred to a consultant as I use to do kung fu and now I feel
I’m at risk of injuring my back further as I would like to go to the gym but I know I can’t


I don’t know I’m just a bit confused really and was helping some people
Might to give me some friendly advise

I know the decision is ultimately mine at the end of the day

Thanks

 

[Resurgam]

I used an ordinary cheap to use meter to see that the meals I ate did not cause me to spike, got my levels down to normal and used the knowledge of what I could eat to go on in the same way ever since - coming up to 5 years from diagnosis now.
Did you not have time to settle into a way of eating which would keep your levels down when you could see your blood glucose levels?

 

[EllieM]

Surely putting people who have T2 on a LibreLink to help them manage the sugar levels before they advise them to go on metformin.

The NHS aim to only fund 20% of T1s for libre, and don't even fund blood glucose testing strips for T2s if they aren't on meds which can cause hypos. (Though some people report that sympathetic GPs have funded testing strips for them.) While I agree with you that many many diabetics would benefit from libre the NHS doesn't want to pay for it. My advice would be to get a blood testing meter (or get strips for the one you already have) and test at first bite of a meal and 2 hours after to see what your levels are doing.

If you don't want to take medication, then you might want to consider reducing the carbs in your diet to see if that works. (Or do both, you can always stop meds if your levels reduce.) But an hba1c of 76 is an average blood glucose of 11.9, which will be damaging your body. I strongly urge you to do something to reduce it.

As T2 drugs go, metformin is relatively benign and has been around long enough for people to understand any side effects. I personally didn't hesitate to take it for a couple of years in a double blond trial to see if it would help T1s.

Good luck.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Hi everyone

Not been on for awhile, hope your all ok

So had my yearly review the other day and my Hba1c is 76mmol and the doctor said that she wants me to go on metformin

And I politely asked her to wait until I processed what she was saying and also speak to the nurse and my partner about it

I’m just not sure

I don’t like the idea of adding a chemical to my body that, inhibits my body’s natural response

Or is that crazy talk?

I also asked the doctor about the LibreLink, about getting it on prescription and she said that basically you can only get it if I’m on insulin

Whilst I agree with what she said

Surely putting people who have T2 on a LibreLink to help them manage the sugar levels before they advise them to go on metformin.

I did it use it but it’s expensive!!

Lockdown hasn’t been kind and I’ve got lower back issues on my L4 and L5 and have been referred to a consultant as I use to do kung fu and now I feel
I’m at risk of injuring my back further as I would like to go to the gym but I know I can’t


I don’t know I’m just a bit confused really and was helping some people
Might to give me some friendly advise

I know the decision is ultimately mine at the end of the day

Thanks

If you're hesitant to get onto medication, maybe look at your diet again? What you're eating and drinking in a day may leave loads of room for improvement, so if you could list an average day? The gym might not be a good idea, but for lower back pain, walking is usually the first thing a therapist or doc'll come up with, and that happens to be an excellent thing for T2's to do too, so... Half an hour's walk at least to start with, to get those muscles to limber up some? Then if all goes well, follow it up with pilates? (My husband had lumbago, that was his route, aside from getting severely beaten up by his physical therapist. ).

I hope you'll feel better soon.
Jo

 

[DJC3]

Hi @kevsta I’d reiterate what the others have said - the most important thing is to get your numbers down pronto so addressing your diet is probably the best way to go.
Yes I agree that Libre is expensive - I get one now and again but usually just test before and after meals with a finger prick. I have a Tee2 meter - if you ring spirit healthcare they will give you a meter free, then you just need to buy the strips. https://www.spirit-health.co.uk/for-patients
I was on metformin for a year or so to begin with. I might even ask to go back on it as a lot of other benefits are being researched, such as protection against some cancers. It’s your choice, but bringing those numbers down with diet is perfectly possible. What is your typical days food?

 

[OB87]

I started out with hba1c of 76 and 9 weeks later it was 45 and out of diabetic range. Recent tests are normal at 31 most recent. It can be done without metformin ( though I do take a small dose once a day 500mg). The key is dietary changes and reducing carbs. I didn't go extreme and didn't cut them out completely but I aimed for 100-120g a day. Remain active and test with a finger prick monitor to see how you react to foods.

 

[t.g.chand]

Hi everyone

Not been on for awhile, hope your all ok

So had my yearly review the other day and my Hba1c is 76mmol and the doctor said that she wants me to go on metformin

And I politely asked her to wait until I processed what she was saying and also speak to the nurse and my partner about it

I’m just not sure

I don’t like the idea of adding a chemical to my body that, inhibits my body’s natural response

Or is that crazy talk?

I also asked the doctor about the LibreLink, about getting it on prescription and she said that basically you can only get it if I’m on insulin

Whilst I agree with what she said

Surely putting people who have T2 on a LibreLink to help them manage the sugar levels before they advise them to go on metformin.

I did it use it but it’s expensive!!

Lockdown hasn’t been kind and I’ve got lower back issues on my L4 and L5 and have been referred to a consultant as I use to do kung fu and now I feel
I’m at risk of injuring my back further as I would like to go to the gym but I know I can’t


I don’t know I’m just a bit confused really and was helping some people
Might to give me some friendly advise

I know the decision is ultimately mine at the end of the day

Thanks

 

[t.g.chand]

75 yrs old - T2 for 20+ yrs. - Metformin +sitagliptin controlled Diabetes . only recently Metformin stopped due to side effects and Sugars are out of control.
1. If the body can take care of itself we don't have any illness and no Drs & medicines needed.
2. Some get mild Diabetes which can be controlled with low carb diet & exercise, others get it in a severe form and needs lot of medicines. So one Diabetic's own experience can not apply to all.
3. Keeping weight in the healthy range (Body mass Index -BMI less than 25) is also important.
4. Putting chemical in body - coffee, alcohol, smoking and health supplements with out proven benefit all have chemicals.

 

[Rachox]

It is definitely up to you to decide if you want to take meds but while you are considering your options I think you need to address two things. Firstly review your diet, check how many carbs you are eating daily and reduce til you reach a level that works for you. Secondly invest in a blood glucose meter to see the effect of what you have consumed.
And just a side note, I take Metformin, have done so for 4 and a half years now and apart from the first couple of weeks I don’t suffer any ill effects from it. It is only a small, but often very vocal, group of people who get side effects.

 

[Andydragon]

I was on metformin slow release for well over a decade with no side effects. Normal release did have some impact but nothing substantial, however it was enough to make slow release better

it is your choice. It can, for some, cause issues but for many minor which pass or none. For those who can’t tolerate then clearly find a different approach is always my advice.

There are alternative approaches and when that works and avoids drugs then great, but what I would say is the impact of uncontrolled high blood sugars is potentially a lot worse than taking the drugs. If we need a helping hand via antibiotics, painkillers or diabetic drugs then there is nothing wrong in that in my opinion.

but as I said, if you can find an alternative approach, then that’s good too but whichever approach, the key thing to me is controlling those levels

 

[Mbaker]

Hi @kevsta, I love your point regarding putting another chemical into your body. Metformin is said to be safe. This is akin to what I have seen with computer operating systems in my career. Last night to continue my analogy I was applying patches to what would have been thought to be somewhere near perfect 36 year evolution of the Windows Operating System for a city law firm (other IT systems have the same issues by the way). Similarly Metformin has had multiple what IT people would call Security Advisories in the States, even within the last few months.

My bias is that I am wary of long term drug use, I would say would good reason (List of largest pharmaceutical settlements - Wikipedia). Insulin is different, it was not originally created for profit and was meant to be free. I am not saying Metformin is in the same league as some of the referenced issues, but some people have gut disturbances even with slow acting versions.

If your pancreas is working then why not go for potential remission naturally. It is not easy, but at the same time it is simple technically to see if you can do this. Below is a template that might work for you:

Set protein at around 35-40% of your meals, if you are omnivorous real meat and fish, shell fish). For vegetables only those that fit Keto (keto vegetables google images - Google Search). For fruit, around a quarter of a cup of anything ending is berry and Avocado. Around a quarter cup of hazelnuts, almonds, pecans, 1 brazil nut. Any salad items, with standard dressings. 6 grams per 100 Coconut flakes. If you want the convenience of bread then make your own egg protein version (Maria Emerrich), and use avocado or cottage cheese as the buttering agent (ideas: bacon and seabass sandwich, left over beef and eggs). Walk after each meal and as much as you can, then when your back gets better resistance train. This is may not be perfect, but I follow the 80 / 20 rule, so it is somewhere in the right direction.

 

[AMak]

Hi everyone

Not been on for awhile, hope your all ok

So had my yearly review the other day and my Hba1c is 76mmol and the doctor said that she wants me to go on metformin

And I politely asked her to wait until I processed what she was saying and also speak to the nurse and my partner about it

I’m just not sure

I don’t like the idea of adding a chemical to my body that, inhibits my body’s natural response

Or is that crazy talk?

I also asked the doctor about the LibreLink, about getting it on prescription and she said that basically you can only get it if I’m on insulin

Whilst I agree with what she said

Surely putting people who have T2 on a LibreLink to help them manage the sugar levels before they advise them to go on metformin.

I did it use it but it’s expensive!!

Lockdown hasn’t been kind and I’ve got lower back issues on my L4 and L5 and have been referred to a consultant as I use to do kung fu and now I feel
I’m at risk of injuring my back further as I would like to go to the gym but I know I can’t


I don’t know I’m just a bit confused really and was helping some people
Might to give me some friendly advise

I know the decision is ultimately mine at the end of the day

Thanks

Unfortunately as you’ve said yourself the continuous blood monitoring devices are expensive and they’re not much cheaper for the NHS to buy and supply and yet another strain on the purses of the local health authorities. Whilst you are concerned (rightfully so) about starting medication Metformin is the first step in “helping” you control your condition it works by making your liver filter out excess sugar and not releasing it as glucose into your system letting your bodies natural insulin to help control the diabetes. Although it is recommended long term (sometimes life long) there’s no reason if through diet you can control the condition, loose weight and go into remission and possibly even stop taking it. Ultimately it’s up to you to make this decision, rather than ignoring the help offered and finding this option is no longer suitable and having to rely on insulin which would be for life.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

75 yrs old - T2 for 20+ yrs. - Metformin +sitagliptin controlled Diabetes . only recently Metformin stopped due to side effects and Sugars are out of control.
1. If the body can take care of itself we don't have any illness and no Drs & medicines needed.
2. Some get mild Diabetes which can be controlled with low carb diet & exercise, others get it in a severe form and needs lot of medicines. So one Diabetic's own experience can not apply to all.
3. Keeping weight in the healthy range (Body mass Index -BMI less than 25) is also important.
4. Putting chemical in body - coffee, alcohol, smoking and health supplements with out proven benefit all have chemicals.

Just to say... With glucose regularly at 22.0 mmol/l and over every single day, I wasn't what anyone'd call a "Diabetic Light". But I did achieve normal glucose numbers with diet alone, within months. It's not so much a question of how mild or not it is, but more a question of, how much insulin do you still produce? If you still make ample amounts, reducing carbs should make one heck of a dent in one's insulin insensitivity. If after a couple of decades a pancreas is absolutely knackered, doesn't produce much insulin anymore, then yeah.... One could need some additional help. Or for whatever other reason. Some don't want to follow a diet or can't, some need a little extra help because meds for other issues make their bloods go up, maybe someone's T2 is unpredictable or.... Who knows? There's no shame in needing help. But there's also none in leaving medication as a last resort. Personal choice. Lots of people here go for diet and metformin, or diet only, or medication only. Whatever works.

 

[MrsA2]

I don’t like the idea of adding a chemical to my body that, inhibits my body’s natural response

Could you perhaps adjust your thinking to regard carbohydrate as a chemical, and avoid it as much as possible? It is a chemical after all, just a natural one whereas metformin is man made or manufactured, as indeed some carbohydrates are.

 

[kevsta]

Wow I just want to say thank you for your input it’s definitely given me something to think about

I’m sat here currently eating a coop ham and egg salad.

I have my review with the nurse on the 19th - should be interesting to see what she says

I don’t feel unhealthy and I do eat some rubbish but at the same time I don’t feel over weight last time I weigh my self I was 14st 12.6lbs and my bmi was 30.9 on 25/9/21

And that is going of Renpho scales

@Mbaker was you patching windows 11 - lol I work in IT I feel you pain

I have heard of slow release of metformin and I believe someone mentioned it in this thread,

How have people managed with this I have heard it’s better in the sense of less side effects is that true?

I feel being diabetic there is such a fine line in being either side and then putting pressure on ones self to counter balance the effects and then in the same spin end up worst of

But I am very grateful for the advise and encouragement that people have posted so thank you

 

[Mbaker]

Wow I just want to say thank you for your input it’s definitely given me something to think about

I’m sat here currently eating a coop ham and egg salad.

I have my review with the nurse on the 19th - should be interesting to see what she says

I don’t feel unhealthy and I do eat some rubbish but at the same time I don’t feel over weight last time I weigh my self I was 14st 12.6lbs and my bmi was 30.9 on 25/9/21

And that is going of Renpho scales

@Mbaker was you patching windows 11 - lol I work in IT I feel you pain

I have heard of slow release of metformin and I believe someone mentioned it in this thread,

How have people managed with this I have heard it’s better in the sense of less side effects is that true?

I feel being diabetic there is such a fine line in being either side and then putting pressure on ones self to counter balance the effects and then in the same spin end up worst of

But I am very grateful for the advise and encouragement that people have posted so thank you

Glad to be of some help. I wasted around 9 months doing the wrong things such as soda bread and oats, hence being explicit about what broadly can work. Nurses have to follow the standard of care, so it is likely you will be told the opposite of low carb.

My updates were to remote access Citrix Servers and Microsoft Exchange - 4 hours of non-fun.

Slow release metformin does work for some who have digestive upset via the regular version.

I would say being diabetic can be mentally difficult depending on acceptance. The balance for me is being given a second chance to eat the foods my body will tolerate and lead a normal life.

The best advice I can give is to either learn to flavour base foods or have people around you who can. My last 3 days of eating have been truly amazing. I am able to tolerate carrots and butternut squash without spiking. And I definitely have more variety (as does the family) then before I became diabetic.

 

[Lakeslover]

Glad to be of some help. I wasted around 9 months doing the wrong things such as soda bread and oats, hence being explicit about what broadly can work. Nurses have to follow the standard of care, so it is likely you will be told the opposite of low carb.

My updates were to remote access Citrix Servers and Microsoft Exchange - 4 hours of non-fun.

Slow release metformin does work for some who have digestive upset via the regular version.

I would say being diabetic can be mentally difficult depending on acceptance. The balance for me is being given a second chance to eat the foods my body will tolerate and lead a normal life.

The best advice I can give is to either learn to flavour base foods or have people around you who can. My last 3 days of eating have been truly amazing. I am able to tolerate carrots and butternut squash without spiking. And I definitely have more variety (as does the family) then before I became diabetic.


View attachment 51542

do you have a link for your coconut flatbread recipe?

 

[Mbaker]

do you have a link for your coconut flatbread recipe?

This one in which I swap the coconut oil for 3 tablespoons of cream cheese:

and this one I also add cream cheese to as well. I use the same silicon mats. When the dough is formed best results for rolling and cutting I have found is to put the dough in cling film for 15 to 20 minutes. When cooking the flat breads I use a non-stick pan with no oil :

 

[Resurgam]

@Mbaker Thankyou for the links - I have loads of the ingredients but have not done any baking for ages, I can give them a try out tomorrow see how they go with kippers.