chinese takeaway

[LittleWolf]

I am not diagnosed diabetic.

Had some fried wantons, rice, shredded pork, duck slices and a little sweet n sour sauce

1 hour 8.3, 2 hours 9.

Meh. It was a nice treat I hadn't had for a long time. Friends birthday party. Maybe i could have it more often if I reduced portions...


Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

 

[JanAus08]

Hi to those wanting to know more about benefits to eating Chinese food.
Please read my story, it's worth it.

1 billion people on low carbohydrate diet in China cannot be wrong.
Through all my life I was a bit chubby. I always wanted to lose weight and I have been exercising in the gym for many years doing the usual things: super circuit, aerobics, treadmill and pushing some weights. I tried a few diets such as Weight Watches but I was forever hungry – it did not work for me. Despite being reasonably fit, my muscles were always covered with some fat. The worst I got to was above 90kg in weight (height of 1.66cm). For the past few years my blood pressure shot up and the doctor gave me some pills which did not seem to help much as I could not get the pressure below 150/95 or so. Then came the high cholesterol and more tablets – again the tablets did not help much. For the past few years my blood sugar started to creep up and sure enough, the tests showed the Diabetes type 2. My doctor said “you have to do something if you want to live long”.
At this point of time I started thinking about what I was eating. For breakfast at about 8am I had some toast, coffee and some orange juice then went to work. By 10:30am I was light headed and starving. I had a sandwich or two, coffee and some biscuits and by lunchtime I was starving again and if I would not eat soon I would feel like I was going to pass out. This repeated at 3pm at 6pm when I had a generous dinner and again before bed. I realised that I ate at least 6 times per day but always thought that it was my metabolism and it could not possibly be any other way.
Fortunately as an engineer I travelled a lot around the world to different countries and experienced a lot of “off the beaten track life with the locals”. I was a regular visitor to China where I would often spent anywhere between 2 to 6 weeks at the time. When in China, they looked after me very well and this meant a lot of dinners-Banquet style. I always enjoyed the Chinese food that was somewhat exotic at times and as I was always a good eater I ate a lot. One thing I noticed on return to Australia that China was the only country where I mysteriously lost my weight at the rate of about 1kg per week despite eating large quantities of food. Also I never really felt hungry but still ate anyway as the food was always very nice.
What did I eat in China? Well not the usual Chinese food that one gets in any china town. As one of the Chinese delegates visiting me in Australia (from Beijing) said to me: ”you eat a modified Chinese food in Australia”. The origin of the western style Chinese food (Cantonese) comes from Southern China where rice is a staple food. It is not the case in most other parts of China, especially up North where the climate is cold and the rice does not grow. Therefore traditionally, most of the Chinese people (in China) do not eat much rice. Actually their food is almost never sweet and their desert consists of dumplings with non-sweet meat of vegetable filling in a very thin pastry. The only other carbohydrates that they consume are the occasional rice noodles and some fruit.
So, when you go next time to Beijing and stay in the western hotel together with all the westerners you will be served rice, bread, toast, sweets, fries .... because that is what the westerners ask for. On the other hand if you go off the beaten track where you do not see a white face, you won’t be able to buy: bread (chinese do not eat bread, cheese, sweets etc.) I tried once to look for a bar of chocolate or a similar snack, but gave up after a few hours of shopping. These western goodies are only available where the tourists go. For those non believers that chinese people do not eat rice regularly, listen to this: Once we had a banquet style dinner in a large restaurant (about 100 guests there) in a smaller town. I felt a bit off colour and after not eating for some time I decided to order a plate of plain boiled rice only. The waiter came back from the kitchen and apologised telling me that they do not have any rice. So I resigned myself to not eating, but the rice actually came after about more than half an hour. My interpreter said that they sent a girl to some shop to buy a packet of rice for me. When I asked “don’t you eat rice here” the reply was “sometimes”.
From my observations, chinese people eat very little of carbohydrates, lots, lots and lots and very wide variety of vegetables, a great deal of protein (meat of many parts of animal – you’ll be surprised what they eat sometimes) and some fruit usually together with some non-sweet dumplings at the end of the dinner.
Now I know why the chinese people are so slim! This experience taught me a very good lesson what to eat at home. My wife was not very impressed with my demands of meat and vegetable diet but she realised that I was serious when I started to cook for myself. After that I stumbled on to Atkins diet and I bought his book for $5 at the book market. After reading a few pages I realised that Atkins was basically conveying the same knowledge in a bit more scientific manner.
After being on the high veg & protein diet for a few months I took myself to the doctor following the blood test. At that stage I only wanted to lose some weight. When the doctor saw my blood test results on his computer (sent over the net) he said: “ Holly dooly, what have you been doing?” I panicked, thinking that something was wrong, but he quickly assured me with “No – your test results improved dramatically”. My blood sugar was almost normal, the cholesterol was half of the previous figure and when he measured my blood pressure – for the first time in many years it was normal! What’s more I noticed when exercising in the Gym while doing exactly the same thing on the treadmill for many years, my pulse that the machines measure, showed consistent reduction of 10 to 15 heart beats per minute for the exactly same exercise setting. So, on the low carb food mirroring the chinese experience my health has improved dramatically, I lost weight and at last I am now never hungry and do not crave for anything!!! So when dining in the Chinese restaurant, ask for more vegetables and forget the rice.
In the nut shell: If any western dietician tells me that I may be doing something wrong I can reply with confidence: “Go to China to learn - 1 billion of Chinese people that are on the Atkins diet cannot be wrong!!!!!!!
Jan

 

[Yorksman]

1 billion people on low carbohydrate diet in China cannot be wrong.

China is estimated to have a higher incidence of type 2 diabetes than the UK, roughly 6% cf. 4.5%

 

[LittleWolf]

Don't they have a generic predisposition like Afro Caribbean people? But is that caused by their diet ? I mean an ethnic chinese bred a couple generations in a country with a lower carb diet would have the same risk? Does that figure count each of China's dozens of ethnic groups from different regions individually?


But I definitely think the 'Chinese food' we get over here is higher carb and not so good for you..


Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

 

[Anonymous]

Don't they have a generic predisposition like Afro Caribbean people? But is that caused by their diet ? I mean an ethnic chinese bred a couple generations in a country with a lower carb diet would have the same risk? Does that figure count each of China's dozens of ethnic groups from different regions individually?


But I definitely think the 'Chinese food' we get over here is higher carb and not so good for you..


Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

Depends on the process of natural selection which is rather slower than two generations and whether 'low-carb' is a favoured trait (in life v death terms). Unfortunately (or fortunately), eating a low-carb diet does not alter an individual's genes. I don't pretend to think we are eating 'Chinese' over here. I've tried to select dishes which don't include the 'gunky gravy' which is quite difficult. A big plate of starters is, for me, a better option, e.g. lamb wrapped in lettuce, tempura fish & veg. etc.

 

[catherinecherub]

There was a similar discussion here in 2012.

Scary stats for Type2 in India and China.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=29420&hilit=china+statistics

 

[Anonymous]

There was a similar discussion here in 2012.

Scary stats for Type2 in India and China.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=29420&hilit=china+statistics

I think we have to think wider than our pancreas as well. There are many other working parts that require energy and nutrition. China, for example, has a lot of scope for improving the overall nutrition front.

Diabetes ("to pass through") was observed by the ancient Greeks apparently. So it's been there just waiting for the right trigger(s).

 

[spaceman]

well me and my partner are both type 1 , we both enjoy a chinese takeaway, my partner gets a chicken curry and egg fried rice, i get a spanish ommlet and which c/o shrimp,chicken, onions,peppers,corn, we always use the same chinese takeaway.

 

[stuffedolive]

Depends on the process of natural selection which is rather slower than two generations and whether 'low-carb' is a favoured trait (in life v death terms). Unfortunately (or fortunately), eating a low-carb diet does not alter an individual's genes..

Not quite true. Recent epigenetic research has shown that heritable gene changes can occur within a single generation from things such as dietary changes and even physical and mental activity! Very interesting stuff.

 

[Anonymous]

Depends on the process of natural selection which is rather slower than two generations and whether 'low-carb' is a favoured trait (in life v death terms). Unfortunately (or fortunately), eating a low-carb diet does not alter an individual's genes..

Not quite true. Recent epigenetic research has shown that heritable gene changes can occur within a single generation from things such as dietary changes and even physical and mental activity! Very interesting stuff.

If that's true then it's only of value if the gene(s) is passed on through reproduction which is the only path (other than GM), so it will only be passed on by people with that gene who are still knocking out offspring and whom have offspring themselves etc. etc. That rules out (usually) people of a certain age (except for Des O'Connor perhaps). If it is passed on then, without the pressure of natural selection, it will hang around doing nothing of any 'value', or be deleted.

 

[Mr Happy]

Jan, I read and absorbed all of your information but my mind keeps saying mmmmm prawn toast!

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

 

[stuffedolive]

... so it will only be passed on by people with that gene who are still knocking out offspring and whom have offspring themselves etc. etc. That rules out (usually) people of a certain age....

It doesn't rule out any males unless they've had the 'snip' :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

... so it will only be passed on by people with that gene who are still knocking out offspring and whom have offspring themselves etc. etc. That rules out (usually) people of a certain age....

It doesn't rule out any males unless they've had the 'snip' :wink:

8) and remember 'Beer helps ugly people to have sex!'

 

[Yorksman]

Recent epigenetic research has shown that heritable gene changes can occur within a single generation from things such as dietary changes and even physical and mental activity! Very interesting stuff.

But even a beneficial mutation such as the Lactase Persistence allele takes hundreds of generations to be propagated throughout a population. Lactase is an enzyme produced in all humans until they are in their teens. It allows infants to digest the sugar, lactose, found in milk. Production is switched off in the teens and most adults don't produce it.

In northen europe, one mutation known as 13910 C/T or LAC P allows continued production. This mutation will have occured in a single human at some point in the past and was passed on to any of offspring who in turn passed it on to their offspring. It's a dominant genetic trait and so will propagate itself faster in a population where there is a selective advantage than a recessive trait. Nonetheless, for milk drinking to become commonplace in northern european countries took hundreds of generations over a few millenia.

This synthetic animated map models the propagation of the 13910 C/T mutation in Europe. The number of generations lapsed is given in the top right.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File: ... 1.s015.ogv

 

[stuffedolive]

This mutation will have occured in a single human at some point in the past and was passed on to any of offspring who in turn passed it on to their offspring. ...., for milk drinking to become commonplace in northern european countries took hundreds of generations over a few millenia.

That ain't necessarily so! As I said epigenic research has shown heritable traits can be gained and passed on in a single generation. The interesting point is that if an environmental change causes a change in behaviour (such as diet) then epigenics is now telling us that that heritable trait can be gained by numerous individuals simultaneously (because they are all subject to the same pressure) which shortens the timescale for the trait to be widespread within the population.

 

[Anonymous]

This mutation will have occured in a single human at some point in the past and was passed on to any of offspring who in turn passed it on to their offspring. ...., for milk drinking to become commonplace in northern european countries took hundreds of generations over a few millenia.

That ain't necessarily so! As I said epigenic research has shown heritable traits can be gained and passed on in a single generation. The interesting point is that if an environmental change causes a change in behaviour (such as diet) then epigenics is now telling us that that heritable trait can be gained by numerous individuals simultaneously (because they are all subject to the same pressure) which shortens the timescale for the trait to be widespread within the population.

That's jogged my memory. I forgot about retroviruses as a means of passing on modified DNA to others through body fluids etc.

 

[Anonymous]

This mutation will have occured in a single human at some point in the past and was passed on to any of offspring who in turn passed it on to their offspring. ...., for milk drinking to become commonplace in northern european countries took hundreds of generations over a few millenia.

That ain't necessarily so! As I said epigenic research has shown heritable traits can be gained and passed on in a single generation. The interesting point is that if an environmental change causes a change in behaviour (such as diet) then epigenics is now telling us that that heritable trait can be gained by numerous individuals simultaneously (because they are all subject to the same pressure) which shortens the timescale for the trait to be widespread within the population.

It's certainly true that the same mutation can occur by chance in multiple living organisms in a single generation or at different times in different organisms in different parts of the world, e.g bat and bird wings .. very different structurally but both adapting to flight. But the mutation can't be passed between two living organisms, with the exception of retroviruses where the modified DNA with the imbedded coding to reproduce the virus can be passed from organism to organism through body fluids etc.

It still has to been passed on to offspring and subjected to natural selection. If the trait (say change of diet) is critical to survival in a particular environment, e.g. the only food available is that in the diet because everything else has been eaten, then the offspring of those without the trait cannot survive or have to move away leaving the population with the trait to grow. Until, of course, there are so many that there is insufficient diet food to go around.

 

[Yorksman]

Single Nucleotide Polymorphisms, for example the C => T transition at 13910 Kb which causes lactase persistence are rare for any a specific locus, of the order of 1 mutation per 1,000,000,000 generations. It is why they used to be called Unique Event Polymorphisms because they occured only once in the lifetime of a species. It is only because we have billions of SNPs, that at least one of them will mutate every 3 or 4 generations but the chance of an SNP mutating twice or in two people at the same time is exceedingly small.

It's why we share something like 30% of our genes with onions - because all life shares a common ancestry. The record of our past is still there, though inactive. If you stand barefoot on the lawn, your toes won't root, but your appendix is a reminder of your leaf eating days.

As I said epigenic research has shown heritable traits can be gained and passed on in a single generation.

Epigenetics does not involve a change in the nucleotide sequence. Polymorphisms are not involved. It means 'above genetics' and is the study of how genes are expressed through a process of methylation or histone modification. At conception a single cell is created with the nucleotide sequence which will remain static throughout every cell in your body for the rest of your life. Some of those cells will become skin cells, others will become blood cells and so on. They all contain the same DNA sequences. The epigenome determines what it will become and it is the epigenome which is subject to environmental factors such as diet, climate, viruses and so on and, in some cases, these epigenomic changes can be passed on.

Whilst there are four known separate mutations which cause the lactase enzyme to continue to be produced in adulthood and those adults can drink milk and are lactose tolerant, most of the world cannot but the degreee to which they are lactose intolerant is variable. Some can drink a glass of milk whilst others would get sick licking an ice cream. This aspect is may be regulated by the epigenetics.

 

[Finzi]

I am not diagnosed diabetic.

Had some fried wantons, rice, shredded pork, duck slices and a little sweet n sour sauce

1 hour 8.3, 2 hours 9.

Meh. It was a nice treat I hadn't had for a long time. Friends birthday party. Maybe i could have it more often if I reduced portions...


Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

Or just avoided rice and sweet & sour sauce. Two things I would NEVER have at a Chinese - but don't be disheartened, there's lots of things you probably can have. I say probably because we're all different. Theoretically won tons should be bad because they're a sort of pasta, but they've never touched me. I find Chinese a great way to have extra/different veg that's a bit of a change from our boring old English veg . I'd add to that some nice chicken with ginger and spring onion, or prawns in black bean sauce.


Type 2 on Metformin, diagnosed Jan 2013, ultra low carber, Hba1C at diagnosis 8% (11mmol), now between 4.5 and 5.5 mmol. 20kg lost so far

 

[LittleWolf]

Rice is a staple part of my diet >_< Being a Trini and eating a lot of Indian food. SCREW IT

10.8 now after curry. Starting to get ****** off with this. Is it wrong to be jealous of my friend with T1 who injects then eats whatever? I keep bringing it up but it does frustrate me.

I hate the spaced out, tiring feeling of hyperglycaemia but.. Ugh. Guess I can either complain or do something, but my family get offended if I cook separate meals. I don't even have an excuse because officially nothing is wrong with me. I learned to like rice growing up. Guess it's time to ditch it again. *sulk*




Sent from the Diabetes Forum App