Very frustrated

[2guns1687]

Started a very low carb ketogenic diet recently, overall it has worked very well my BG is pretty steady apart from a few highs (i think this may be due to hay fever) anyway i was on the phone to my dafne nurse and told her i was on a keto diet and explained the ins and out of the benefits etc and how ketosis is harmless as long as my bg is good, and she advised against it told me i should get my carb counting right and should have more carbs etc, basically disagreed with everything i said so basically it was a waste of time.

Is anybody else following a low carb or keto diet and how is it working out for you?

 

[Patch13]

That's not good news. I'm going to my clinic next Tuesday and now doubt they will ask how I have such good readings. I don't think they'll like the answer!

I find being very low carb has greatly improved my sugar levels, it keeps them more stable when exercising and I need less sugar if I have a hypo (and they feel less severe too). I'm also eating healthier and not eating huge amounts like I was before and not bingeing either (either during a hypo or at any other time).

I like my diet, but I bet the nurse and consultant won't ...


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[2guns1687]

That's not good news. I'm going to my clinic next Tuesday and now doubt they will ask how I have such good readings. I don't think they'll like the answer!

I find being very low carb has greatly improved my sugar levels, it keeps them more stable when exercising and I need less sugar if I have a hypo (and they feel less severe too). I'm also eating healthier and not eating huge amounts like I was before and not bingeing either (either during a hypo or at any other time).

I like my diet, but I bet the nurse and consultant won't ...


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Well if the results are positive i dont see what the problem is :s

 

[diadeb]

My DN and myself disagree about low carbing even though I have been on diet and exercise only for the past 5 years. She tells me to eat more carbs and I say no, low carbing keeps my BG levels on a more even keel. So do not expect your DN to agree with low carbing but do what is best for you by testing and HbA1c results, they don't lie.

 

[Patch13]

My DN and myself disagree about low carbing even though I have been on diet and exercise only for the past 5 years. She tells me to eat more carbs and I say no, low carbing keeps my BG levels on a more even keel. So do not expect your DN to agree with low carbing but do what is best for you by testing and HbA1c results, they don't lie.

I intend to keep doing it unless they can provide me with a study which finds low carb is dangerous for my health and will make my diabetes worse. However, I've found everything has got better since low carb, but as it is against NHS guidelines I am not expecting them to agree!

 

[Patch13]

That's not good news. I'm going to my clinic next Tuesday and now doubt they will ask how I have such good readings. I don't think they'll like the answer!

I find being very low carb has greatly improved my sugar levels, it keeps them more stable when exercising and I need less sugar if I have a hypo (and they feel less severe too). I'm also eating healthier and not eating huge amounts like I was before and not bingeing either (either during a hypo or at any other time).

I like my diet, but I bet the nurse and consultant won't ...


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Well if the results are positive i dont see what the problem is :s

Me neither!!

 

[Neil Walters]

I can see no downsides to low carb and have never felt so positive about the management of my diabetes since I started this approach in May.


Diagnosed Type II 1998 1 x 80 mg Gliclazide, 4 x 500mg Metformin and 1 x 100mg Sitagliptin - HbA1c - 48 mmol/mol

 

[SamJB]

I low carb - the best thing I've ever done with my diabetes. The only thing that has brought my HbA1c into the low 6s. Unfortunately, many health care professionals are blinded by the carb dogma that our society is in. I know someone who has been diagnosed a similar amount of time as me. He has had retinopathy laser treatment recently and his doctor told him to eat MORE carbs. The person in question cannot control his diabetes, so why tell him to eat more of the food type that will make his sugars go higher?

Carb counting, whilst working for some, is a complete let down for most. The National Diabetes Audit recorded the HbA1c of all diabetics in the UK and found that 94% of Type 1s aren't hitting the 6.5% target. That is a fatal and catastrophic failure of carb counting advice. I suspect that they are worried by eating more fats, but having a high HbA1c is much worse than having high cholesterol - that is a fact.

If I were you, I'd stick at it. I doubt very much that your DSN knows that having a high HbA1c is worse that having a high cholesterol, but you would think that this is the type of thing she should know about.

Low carbing is the way forward - if you're diabetic, don't eat things that raise your sugar levels. It's not difficult to understand, is it? In my opinion, if you get by on carbs then fill your boots. If you can only get great results by low carbing, then why would you change this?

 

[Northernangel]

Hi I'm confused?? Type 2 and on x2 metformin a day.. Last check HbA1c where coming back at around just over 7?
DN wants to change my meds, I've asked to give me one last chance to improve .. I've been low carb for the last 8 weeks and I thought that is what we are suppose to do?? I'm now confused because your saying your DN is saying no? Why? What's wrong with it? And can you explain please.
Thanks


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[Thundercat]

After seeing the incontestable results of a low carb diet on my own diabetes I wouldn't change it for anyone or anything. All those doctor visits of trying to find answers to spikes at random times of the day when the answer was so simple. It's not reassuring when a doctor says 'let's try this' but you know they are just shooting in the dark. Thie approach not only doesn't fix anything it makes things worse and increases the risk of hypos. It seems completely crazy now that anyone would think that approach could possibly work consistently.

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[Patch13]

Hi I'm confused?? Type 2 and on x2 metformin a day.. Last check HbA1c where coming back at around just over 7?
DN wants to change my meds, I've asked to give me one last chance to improve .. I've been low carb for the last 8 weeks and I thought that is what we are suppose to do?? I'm now confused because your saying your DN is saying no? Why? What's wrong with it? And can you explain please.
Thanks


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Low carb is against NHS guidelines. They advocate eating a diet with a lot of grains/ carbs so a large proportion of doctors tell diabetics to eat LOTS of carbs. Your DN might be happy with you doing low carb because you are type 2 or perhaps because they believe in low carb for all diabetics.
Being type 1 I get told I NEED carbs, which as I have found out is untrue and without them my sugars are better.


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[2guns1687]

I was trying to explain to my DN that ketosis is toally fine as long as my blood sugars are perfect it is only when they go high it will become ketoACIDosis but all i got in reply was "who told you this" "where did you do your research" basically trying to belittle me to an extent, she also said that even if my blood sugars are fine but i am producing ketones my blood will be acidotic and that is dangerous :s

 

[Patch13]

I was trying to explain to my DN that ketosis is toally fine as long as my blood sugars are perfect it is only when they go high it will become ketoACIDosis but all i got in reply was "who told you this" "where did you do your research" basically trying to belittle me to an extent, she also said that even if my blood sugars are fine but i am producing ketones my blood will be acidotic and that is dangerous :s

Tell her to read Dr Richard Bernsteins diabetes solution. He's lived in ketosis for a very long time (i think more than 20 years) and he's just fine!

I believe (if I've remembered this correctly) the presence of ketones just shows the break down of fat which occurs when you don't eat carbs.

You are absolutely right about ketoacidosis occurring if you have high BS so you just have to make sure your BS are good. Besides if I was in ketoACIDosis instead of ketosis I would be dead now as I've been in ketosis a while.

I think most DNs just panic at the thought of low carbing as they don't understand it and it is against everything they've been taught.

 

[Northernangel]

Crikey that is more confusing..firstly thank you about the advice re the carbs!! Now the problem is I'm doing low carb but not testing? Is this dangerous then doing low carb and not testing because I won't know if I have high BS?? I'm just trying to get BS down? My theory right or wrong is my metformin isn't doing the job and I don't want to go on anything else.. So cut carbs in effect is cutting sugar??
So I may be at risk of KetoAcidosis if I don't test???
Have I got that right?
Thanks guys


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[Northernangel]

Sorry guys me again how many carbs is usually ok in a diabetic? It don't you guys have any?


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[Patch13]

Crikey that is more confusing..firstly thank you about the advice re the carbs!! Now the problem is I'm doing low carb but not testing? Is this dangerous then doing low carb and not testing because I won't know if I have high BS?? I'm just trying to get BS down? My theory right or wrong is my metformin isn't doing the job and I don't want to go on anything else.. So cut carbs in effect is cutting sugar??
So I may be at risk of KetoAcidosis if I don't test???
Have I got that right?
Thanks guys


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Ketoacidosis can happen in type 2's but is relatively rare. It is more associated with type 1s.

Yes cutting down the carbs in effect cuts down on the sugar you are eating (as carbs convert to sugar). Eating less carbs should bring your sugar levels down (it has mine) and may make you more responsive to your medication (for instance I now take less insulin).

It might be useful to read a bit about low carb diets, for example http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diet/low-carb ... -diet.html

Dr Richard Bernsteins Diabetes Solution book (sorry everyone I am recommending it again :roll: ) is good for understanding a low carb diet. This is useful for type 1s and type 2s.

As you will see form the above link (Diabetes co uk) how much and what is eaten on a low carb diet is very much up to the individual. Some people find it helps just to reduce their carb intake so they need to produce (or take if you are on injections) less insulin to cover it. What your body can tolerate will vary from person to person.

My carb intake is less than 30g a day which is the extreme end of low carb. I get this amount of carbs from vegetables mainly and I weigh everything to calculate the amount of protein and carbohydrate in my meals so that I can in turn calculate the amount of insulin I need (thus eating is like a maths lesson in itself!) .
The typical things I eat are: vegetables (not root ones) and salad, meat, cream, cheese, creme fraiche, linseeds, eggs, butter, sugar free jelly (the one sweet thing I eat :thumbup: ) and there is probably a little more, but I can't think of it right now.


Sorry I can't be more help but hopefully someone more helpful will be along soon!

Patch13

 

[Northernangel]

Thanks for that Patch..
Yes that has made more sense.. I don't inject just on x2 500mg metformin a day. I will only know if its worked on my next HbcA1?
I've been low carb for a couple of months now, lost nearly 2 stone..go back to be re checked in a couple of weeks.. So fingers crossed.. Yes that's pretty much what I'm eating but for a few eggs now and again and a slice of Burgen bread a day..I've bought some Atkins bars I have on the odd day for breakfast when I'm struggling :-(


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[Patch13]

Thanks for that Patch..
Yes that has made more sense.. I don't inject just on x2 500mg metformin a day. I will only know if its worked on my next HbcA1?
I've been low carb for a couple of months now, lost nearly 2 stone..go back to be re checked in a couple of weeks.. So fingers crossed.. Yes that's pretty much what I'm eating but for a few eggs now and again and a slice of Burgen bread a day..I've bought some Atkins bars I have on the odd day for breakfast when I'm struggling :-(


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Awesome - well done for losing weight! It will be great to see what happens with your next HBA1c. Frustrating you can't see the immediate effect (I can because my sugar levels immediately got better when low carbing). Stickwith it if its going well and you feel good and hopefully that will be reflected in your hba1c.

I have found that making linseed crackers is good for breakfast as this is the one meal I really struggle not having carbs for. I make mine with a dehydrator and eat them with cheese on. You could always see if they do any low carb crackers in the supermarket.

Another alternative is oopsie bread from the diet doctor website. Not as good as bread, but good to have something to put meat in between!

 

[Northernangel]

Hi thanks for that., that's why I got the Akins bars for breakfast because that's the one meal I realy struggle with., all my life I've had cereal or toast which is the things I miss the most., most people suggest porridge but when I looked its high in carbs so didn't bother..I know they say there good carbs but to me a carbs a carb


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[SamJB]

Great explanations there patch. For what its worth, my breakfast at the mo is natural yoghurt with blueberries, mixed seeds and coconut shavings/nuts. Low carb and really tasty!

For recipe ideas, there's loads in the Bernstein book recommended by patch (a must if you low carb) and Low Carb Gourmet by Karen Barnaby (available on Amazon). Some great recipes and a few good breakfast recipes in there too such as omelette, low carb porridge, LC waffles, LC pancakes.