Suspect depression side effect?

[Giverny]

Just a quick note: Though the posts in this thread are written with your best interests at heart, it's very important to talk with your GP before taking any new vitamins or supplements. The users on this forum are not medical professionals.

 

[Beshlie]

Depression has something in common with vanity, obsession. In the case of depression it being obsessed with all the negative stuff in one life.

A simple remedied:- is to treat each day with a song in your heart and a smile on your face.

I shall pray for you.

I'm sorry Dr? Singh but, in my opinion you are talking through your bottom, and obviously have no experience of depression/bipolar effective disorder. If you did, you would understand how devastating depression is to someone's life. These illnesses are caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain which is beyond people's control. I have no idea where you get your information from!

 

[donnellysdogs]

So agree Beshlie. Sorry prayers are not the answer to depression. Sorry if that sounds anti religious-thats not my intention.
My hubby was asked to section me once, and he refused. I know how badly depression can be. My mother was admitted to a psychiatric ward and had ect treatment twice and 51 years on still suffers from it and has seen a psychiatrist again about it last year.
The psychiatrist basically told her to take up some hobbies to fill her thoughts more and because she rarely goes out she now takes vit D. (She's nigh on 80).
I smile a few times each day does help. Not looking in the mirror!-cos that will only make you think 'what have I got to smile about?'... But going out for a walk each day and smiling at people when you pass them by helps. A nice "hello" as you pass them by can lift you out of your thoughts.
I'm not medically qualified, but really have come out of the depths of beyond. I had actually thought about suicide and had planned it. My best friend in Wales stopped me.
Nowadays you would never know I had these very awful thoughts. I have completely turned my life and more importantly thoughts around.
Please can we keep prayers out of this posting. The correct counselling, tablets medical interventions, or supplements and finding things different to take thoughts away are the way to relieve the enormity that depression can have on one's life.
In addition folks, I have to add that I went jointly to a counsellor with my husband. The counsellor actually told him straight that he was the depressed one bringing me down!!! So wasnt that a turn up for the books....


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[GlazedDoughnuts]

I'm sorry Dr? Singh but, in my opinion you are talking through your bottom, and obviously have no experience of depression/bipolar effective disorder. If you did, you would understand how devastating depression is to someone's life. These illnesses are caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain which is beyond people's control. I have no idea where you get your information from!

And to play devils advocate here...

Actually the pair of you have a good point.

Chemical imbalance, yep can be remidied by medicine, but also through cognitive behavioural therapy. Which is techniques used to alter the way one thinks.

Neither is wrong or right here.

I've had a stint with citalopram, absolutely terrible stuff. I've never experienced such an altered state before...and I've had my err experiences.

So, op, ill say what Citalopram did for me, and how it affected diabetes for me. Please note my experience may have been one of the rarities, upon reading it just seems I was in that category of the 1 in xx/xxx who have a bad time.


- Increased apetite, craved chocolate and sweets.
- Loads of hypos, you'll become sensitive to insulin, may help in fact as you're T2; and I presume not on insulin. Although expect weight gain!!
- Mental state: a glee of fake happiness. Feels good at first, a bit like say drugs; alcohol.

Feels awesome at first but as you realise the mental state is indeed a chemical invoked one then novelty wears off.

You notice yourself smiling for no reason; it started to make me feel uneasy and somewhat crazy.

People around you notice your highs, smiling away for no reason. Apparently I also had real lows on it; so it had a yoyo effect for me.

3 months later I packed it in.

Since then, alright yeah, some other discoveries were made, but they're irrelevant.
Anyway ive changed my outlook on life.

Now I live for now, the moment. I live for the future because ive decided to make so many changes that im chasing a realistic dream and decided its no more a dream.

It'll became reality, or ill die chasing.

Sounds all a bit hippy and like im a quack...may be.

But, since then I've turned my life around. I've achieved a fair bit. More than I ever have before.

Still a long long road to go down for the ultimate goal. But hand om heart im so much happier, balanced, controlled - it's great.

With meds, a huge mental effort is needed.

It sounds like you're run down, and so, life is grinding at you. Add the stress of a new child, effects on relationship, lack of time etc. Its no wonder you're struggling and there is problems within your relationship.

Perhaps as well as enquiring about meds ask for some cbt; for both you and your partner.

 

[Osidge]

Totto

I would be interested in seeing the statistics that point to the fact that millions of patients with hypothyroidism are being prescribed antidepressants rather than levothyroxine.

Glazeddoughnuts

As a selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitor (SSRI) user when necessary, I do not recognise your experience of using citalopram. I find it a useful medication.

Regards

Doug

 

[Totto]

Totto

I would be interested in seeing the statistics that point to the fact that millions of patients with hypothyroidism are being prescribed antidepressants rather than levothyroxine.

Glazeddoughnuts

As a selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitor (SSRI) user when necessary, I do not recognise your experience of using citalopram. I find it a useful medication.

Regards

Doug

Believe me, there is a host of undiagnosed thyroid sufferers out there. I am one of them. The fact that thyroid levels are individual is proved beyond doubt again and again and that thyroid levels are stable in well people but not in hypothyroidism is disregarded by most endocrinologist who instead believe you can rule out thyroid problems with blood tests so long as the results are within the very wide and disputed range. Furthermore, in the UK doctors are encouraged to ignore even the range and not prescribe Levo until TSH goes above 10. Few people feel well with a TSH above 2.5. TSH is the favourite test and often Ft4 and Ft3 aren't even tested, so those with wacky pituitaries may not be found. A normal variation in TSH is up to 40-50%. If your normal level is 0.8 it has to go up with several hundred percent before any Dr will take notice. In the mean while you will be prescribed ADs for your depression or lacking depression you will get them anyway for tiredness and inertia, pain killers for your joint pain, statins for your high cholesterol, laxatives for your constipation, meds for your heart and blood pressure and your GP will send you to a dietician as no one will believe you when you say you eat next to nothing and still gain stone after stone. Then you start to loose your hair, your ability to walk because you are so weak, you loose your memory and they will suspect early dementia. But no thyroid hormones if your TSH is below 10. You are a bad mother and wife because of the overwhelming fatigue and you have lost your libido a long time ago.

I have nothing against Citalopram if used properly butI distrust GPs knowledge of how to treat depression.

 

[Osidge]

Totto

Many thanks for not addressing the question I asked.

Doug


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[catherinecherub]

Totto said:- I have nothing against Citalopram if used properly butI distrust GPs knowledge of how to treat depression.

Totto,

I don't think your distrust of Doctors is confined to their knowledge of depression. I have yet to hear you say anything positive about any health care professional.
Your knowledge of all health queries is amazing. Whether it is accurate is questionable and I am left with wondering why your bias. Do you know more than all professionals?


The OP has just started Citalopram and I am sure you know there is a time lapse of up to a month before they start working. Surely a more positive approach would be to wait and see the results before condemning all G.P.s The OP may benefit from her medication, she may have it changed if it is not working, she will be offered talking therapies, including CBT, if needed It is early days for her.
I feel that all this negativity from some posters is not helping the OP at all.

 

[mo1905]

Can I please mention one more time that we should not be advising anyone to go against the advice of their own doctor. I agree, there may be some poor GP's out there but we can't assume that all medical advice is wrong. By all means discuss what did/didn't work for you or offer support and general advice but please refrain from specific remarks relating to taking of prescribed meds.


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[Totto]

Totto said:- I have nothing against Citalopram if used properly butI distrust GPs knowledge of how to treat depression.

Totto,

I don't think your distrust of Doctors is confined to their knowledge of depression. I have yet to hear you say anything positive about any health care professional.
Your knowledge of all health queries is amazing. Whether it is accurate is questionable and I am left with wondering why your bias. Do you know more than all professionals?


The OP has just started Citalopram and I am sure you know there is a time lapse of up to a month before they start working. Surely a more positive approach would be to wait and see the results before condemning all G.P.s The OP may benefit from her medication, she may have it changed if it is not working, she will be offered talking therapies, including CBT, if needed It is early days for her.
I feel that all this negativity from some posters is not helping the OP at all.

This is a forum for patients, right? Where we share our experiences?

In my experience depression is a terrible disease even when not severe. The evidence for prescribing SSRI for light depression is unclear and have not shown better results than CBT so in most cases CBT is an better option and also has very few side effects.

In major depressions SSRI and other forms of AD are useful. As I said earlier, I have had some benefit from them when depressed. BUT I think it is unwise indeed to prescribe AD for anybody with major depression without proper care as the risk for suicide can be highly elevated.

So many times ADs are prescribed without proper evaluation: Is this patient really depressed in the clinical sense? Is there risk for suicide attempt? Is it probable this patient will benefit from CBT? Or SRRI? Or a combination?

And so far I haven't seen much effect fron SSRI when treating hypothyroidism. Depression is a common symptom but so are lethargy, fatigue, loss of appetite and inertia without depression. To work out if a patient is depressed in the clinical sense and what to do about requires a bit mor than five minuets with a GP.

I also think we all should make informed choices whether to take a prescribed drug or not. GPs are human too and while they are experts in the medical field we are experts on ourselves. We also are the ones who will have to live with the side effects and withdrawal problems.

And when it comes to hypothyroidism yes, I believe I know more about this than most GPs. I also know quite a lot about ADs and depression, unfortunately.

 

[Totto]

Totto

Many thanks for not addressing the question I asked.

Doug


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You are welcome!

 

[catherinecherub]

This is a forum for patients, right? Where we share our experiences?

In my experience depression is a terrible disease even when not severe. The evidence for prescribing SSRI for light depression is unclear and have not shown better results than CBT so in most cases CBT is an better option and also has very few side effects.

In major depressions SSRI and other forms of AD are useful. As I said earlier, I have had some benefit from them when depressed. BUT I think it is unwise indeed to prescribe AD for anybody with major depression without proper care as the risk for suicide can be highly elevated.

So many times ADs are prescribed without proper evaluation: Is this patient really depressed in the clinical sense? Is there risk for suicide attempt? Is it probable this patient will benefit from CBT? Or SRRI? Or a combination?

And so far I haven't seen much effect fron SSRI when treating hypothyroidism. Depression is a common symptom but so are lethargy, fatigue, loss of appetite and inertia without depression. To work out if a patient is depressed in the clinical sense and what to do about requires a bit mor than five minuets with a GP.

I also think we all should make informed choices whether to take a prescribed drug or not. GPs are human too and while they are experts in the medical field we are experts on ourselves. We also are the ones who will have to live with the side effects and withdrawal problems.



And when it comes to hypothyroidism yes, I believe I know more about this than most GPs. I also know quite a lot about ADs and depression, unfortunately.

Share your experiences by all means but questioning whether Citalopram should be taken, I think you said something like "do you really need them?" puts a question into the mind of someone newly diagnosed with depression. The OP is having treatment for her thyroid.

I am sure the Dr. knows the family history, has done an evaluation as to whether there are risks, may have spoken to husband, involved other agencies, has decided whether the depression that the OP is experiencing is of which type,
http://www.beyondblue.org.au/the-facts/depression/types-of-depression
None of use were involved in the OP's assessment so we really do not know why the antidepressants were prescribed do we? We also don't know the conclusions that the Dr. came to.
I think you need to take a step back when it comes to deciding what is best for the patient and anyone suffering from depression other than relate your experiences.
I do know a lot about depression but would never advise what is right for a person via a forum other than refer them back to their G.P. and give them some encouragement and support and explain some possibilities.

 

[GlazedDoughnuts]

Glazeddoughnuts

As a selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitor (SSRI) user when necessary, I do not recognise your experience of using citalopram. I find it a useful medication.

Regards

Doug

That's great, and unless you're in the research field or a medical practitioner who works with SSRIs I wouldn't expect you to.

This is exactly why we share our experiences.

Im neither saying op should use or not, simply stating my experience.

 

[Osidge]

Glazeddoughnuts

Why might I find it a useful medication but researchers or HCPs would not? Incidentally, I am a co-applicant for 2 clinical research grants.

Yes this is a sharing space but your post did not come over solely as a sharing of your experiences but as what would happen to anyone else taking an SSRI. Perhaps it is your writing style?

Totto

I guess you are unable to provide the statistical evidence making your posting possibly a wild exaggeration.

Catherinecherub and others

Thanks for trying to bring some sanity into this thread so that it will actually be helpful to the OP.

Regards

Doug

 

[GlazedDoughnuts]

Glazeddoughnuts

Why might I find it a useful medication but researchers or HCPs would not? Incidentally, I am a co-applicant for 2 clinical research grants.

Yes this is a sharing space but your post did not come over solely as a sharing of your experiences but as what would happen to anyone else taking an SSRI. Perhaps it is your writing style?

Regards

Doug

Perhaps its your reading style, and you overlooked these two sentences.

"So, op, ill say what Citalopram did for me, and how it affected diabetes for me. Please note my experience may have been one of the rarities, upon reading it just seems I was in that category of the 1 in xx/xxx who have a bad time."

 

[Beshlie]

Sometimes it takes time to find which treatment/drug may suit us, in whatever illness we have, so no drug/treatment suits all. I would never recommend a treatment that works for me to someone else, that is up to their own Dr.

 

[Osidge]

Perhaps its your reading style, and you overlooked these two sentences.

"So, op, ill say what Citalopram did for me, and how it affected diabetes for me. Please note my experience may have been one of the rarities, upon reading it just seems I was in that category of the 1 in xx/xxx who have a bad time."

I have not overlooked those sentences. They were like people saying "I don't mean to offend" and then saying something offensive! You said that it was just your experience and then wrote it in a way that implied it was a general experience.

I am still interested as to why your comments about myself, the research community and HCPs were made - particularly as I am in 2 of those categories.

We are here to share and help but not confuse.

Regards

Doug

 

[GlazedDoughnuts]

I post my experience you say its nothing you've experienced.

I say I wouldn't expect you to, or any other person for that sake, unless you're in the field documenting experiences.

You reply to state you're in the field, great.

Then you say I made a generalisation despite me stating it was my experience.

I state perhaps its your reading style, in response you ask why I mentioned those in the research field. ..wasn't this answered by my second response.

Im not sure what more can be said. Almost feels like you're posting for the sake of having something to say and be right.

To be blunt, im not interested in what you think or know, a question was posed I shared my experience, end of story as far as im concerned.

If that offends...well, then great, offended you are.

 

[Osidge]

I post my experience you say its nothing you've experienced.

I say I wouldn't expect you to, or any other person for that sake, unless you're in the field documenting experiences.

You reply to state you're in the field, great.

Then you say I made a generalisation despite me stating it was my experience.

I state perhaps its your reading style, in response you ask why I mentioned those in the research field. ..wasn't this answered by my second response.

Im not sure what more can be said. Almost feels like you're posting for the sake of having something to say and be right.

To be blunt, im not interested in what you think or know, a question was posed I shared my experience, end of story as far as im concerned.

If that offends...well, then great, offended you are.

 

[Osidge]

Many thanks for your reply. It has enlightened me. I am not, however, offended and never said that I was.

Regards

Doug