What's the cause of diabetes again. Ie type 2

Sunspot

Active Member
Messages
39
Type of diabetes
Other
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Bad food, junk food, processed food.
My interest in diabetes comes via my interest in low carb. I've been reading some books and websites. I've been on a weightloss thing since January and another forum i've been on lead me to the low carb thing. I've been doing low carb for about six weeks.

Another poster on this site led me to ask this question. Actually they told me to read up on it, as i pointed out in my original post. Given the engagement with the question from other posters, it seems to interesting and relevant to everyone here too and surprising there hasn't been more discussion about it already. But in general i am interested in the causes of diseases in general. Just as a general interest.

My point about other races was just a point of interest.
 

Lamont D

Oracle
Messages
15,796
Type of diabetes
Reactive hypoglycemia
Treatment type
I do not have diabetes
Having had an open discussion with my consultant, there is no easy answer to why some people get diabetes and others don't. Visceral fat has an adverse effect on your endocrine system, too much and the body won't create the correct balance of cells and chemicals that influence your blood glucose levels. The emerging reason that some have trouble with weight is undoubtably to do with Genes, but having a fatty Liver, will cause the other organs especially the Pancreas, to restrict the amount of Insulin to help with BGLs, a new wave of thinking on diabetes, because of other conditions within the endocrine system is that diabetes is a Liver condition, rather than a pancreatic disease.
There has always been T2 diabetics, but the epedemic has evolved since eating habits changed after the Second World War when the so called healthy fats were introduced and way we cooked our food changed and then processed foods became the norm as living styles changed. It has been no coincidence that high carbs and high sugars in wheat produced products have increased the high rate of obesity.
Fast food and tele meals and cereals for breakfast are full of these bad or healthy carbs and sugars.
The food industry have a lot to answer for, the cheapest production costs and the bigger profits are made by persuading its customer to buy their products which are full of sugars that produce visceral fat. The population are becoming aware of the problem and things will change slowly. Most of the sport education is about diet and the quick energy products are being binned for longer low sugar and low carb diets are being adopted by our sport stars.
If we keep beating the low carb drum eventual the powers that be will listen.
 
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Sunspot

Active Member
Messages
39
Type of diabetes
Other
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Bad food, junk food, processed food.
The idea that the diabetes is a liver condition is new and interesting. thanks for sharing that thought.

With regards to the changes in diet since WW2. There is a really interesting british tv series called The Men Who Made us Fat and followed by the Men Who Made us Thin. If you haven't seen i highly recommend it and you can find it on you tube. It has persuaded me that the cause of the obesity epidemic is the food industry. It explores a lot of the issues and makes very compelling arguments.

I am also seeing more of this in books and so on. Right Now i'm reading In Defense of Food which raises some of the arguments but more sharply points out the dangers of processed foods which a lot of people are struggling to accept and go with. that is to say, whole foods are healthier so minimise all processed foods. For my part, apart from ice-cream and other obvious problem foods, i've been avoiding these processed foods for some time e.g. low fat milk products and any other low fat foods, as well always avoiding things like energy bars and the like. I was never persuaded by the low fat milk idea. It didn't ring true to me that a whole food that no longer tasted good could be healthier than the whole food version. That said, a certain degree of processing isn't considered a major problem but if you compare cornflakes and fruit loops it should be obvious which is the more unhealthy. Cornflakes at least does not loads of sugar in it. So common sense is required.

its good to know that the energy drinks and products for sport are being ditched. But really low carb is probably only very important for diabetics and insulin resistant people. It has other advantages for non diabetics etc,when dieting but its not essential i'm finding. I can lose weight on either diet. And i expect i can keep it on off on either diet too. The main advantage for high fat low carb is less hunger when dieting - because my body is providing the extra fuel, when there's a calorie deficit.

Yes i think we have to make our doctors read some of the books we're reading.
 
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Lamont D

Oracle
Messages
15,796
Type of diabetes
Reactive hypoglycemia
Treatment type
I do not have diabetes
The food industry wants you to have diabetic foods. Everyone knows that is rubbish. They also replace low fat products with more sugars. Milk is full of sugar and the low fat milk is replaced with more sugar. But worst is the breakfast cereals and bars. Even the low GI cereals like Special K, weetabix, porridge, all bran and the like are loaded with sugars And they are carbs, which turn into sugar for us.
You can get all the carbs you want from veg and fruit. We don't need that many carbs and bad sugars that are constantly hyped as 'healthy'!
 

Sunspot

Active Member
Messages
39
Type of diabetes
Other
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Bad food, junk food, processed food.
The natural sugars in milk should not be confused with the added i.e. refined sugar. The natural sugars in milk a) do not cause tooth decay and are not the same as the added sugars you'd find in say ice-cream. If you believe they are the same, then you also believe that carbswhich turn into sugars in vegetables are on a par. No all sugar is not the same. Refined sugar is the problem, not natural sugars.

"The food industry wants you to have diabetic foods. Everyone knows that is rubbish."

I'm Not sure what you mean here. Are you trying to contradict me or are you saying something else? Anyway i didn't say the food industry " wants you to have diabetic foods". The food industry wants to make money and doesn't care how it achieves it.

I do not believe in "hating on carbs". That's an insupportable position. No scientist would support this position.
 

Brightside

Well-Known Member
Messages
106
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Diet only
The natural sugars in milk should not be confused with the added i.e. refined sugar. The natural sugars in milk a) do not cause tooth decay and are not the same as the added sugars you'd find in say ice-cream. If you believe they are the same, then you also believe that carbswhich turn into sugars in vegetables are on a par. No all sugar is not the same. Refined sugar is the problem, not natural sugars.

"The food industry wants you to have diabetic foods. Everyone knows that is rubbish."

I'm Not sure what you mean here. Are you trying to contradict me or are you saying something else? Anyway i didn't say the food industry " wants you to have diabetic foods". The food industry wants to make money and doesn't care how it achieves it.

I do not believe in "hating on carbs". That's an insupportable position. No scientist would support this position.

Agree totally.
If you look at demographics certain tribes that don't have refined sugar in their diets don't suffer a high incidence of diabetes! However when these people partake in a modern lifestyle then they too become insulin resistant. Is it the sugar or is it obesity? Probably both .... Ie they eat more sugar and get fat doing so.

Oh the sugar industry ( coke Mars Cadbury Kraft etc etc ) will lobby against this sentiment just as the tobacco industry lobbied against cigarettes and cancer.

However if you look at how diabetes is growing you have ask why and what has changed.

It's obvious 5-6 generations ago sugary sweet products were a real luxury! Go back another century and the only sweetener there was, was honey!

Now add to that mega carbs in the form of bread, cereals, confectionary, ice cream, and let's not forget the fruit juice we so happily drink because "they're healthy" but full of fructose (sugar).

Plus our screwed up life style of being changed to the desk 8 hrs a day and then doing the pub and a few beers, it's no wonder we are becoming sick!

Obesity is a big problem in our society and refined sugar has a large part of the blame to carry.

It looks as though evidence is rising to show that sugar is to blame for cholesterol too!

Don't get me wrong.... I'm not saying we should ban sugar, but I think it's time we took a good close look at what is fact and what industry wants us to believe.
 
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Lamont D

Oracle
Messages
15,796
Type of diabetes
Reactive hypoglycemia
Treatment type
I do not have diabetes
For non diabetics, carbs are fine, everything in moderation. The build up in high carbs and sugars that are nothing else but bad only create the basis of bad health. The fats debate and the sugar debate should be joined by the diabetic carb debate. If you join all three together it won't matter how you dress it up. It's a recipe for disaster.
I have a very full and active life. Never say behind a desk! Big family.
It was the chips cooked in polyunsaturated oils with everything that led to my being diagnosed with high glucose levels. Overrating and snacks full of carbs and sugars, never thinking it would affect me this way!
The visceral fat that non diabetics never think would bother them. It has become the worlds biggest conundrum. The world is a capitalist haven. The global businesses don't want to know social problems and goverments are cajoled to go along with them. Supermarkets are again in a price war. To see who can peddle the cheapest food for the biggest profit. The cost to the nation doesn't worry them. They keep churning out new ways to feed us based on flour and sugar. Who gives a monkey about you and me except our family's?
What's worse is the health trade, interested in making a profit and all about dogma and political favours.
We have to keep banging the drum. We cannot let our kids and grandkids go through this!

Sorry! Turned into a rant!
 

donnellysdogs

Master
Messages
13,233
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Pump
Dislikes
People that can't listen to other people's opinions.
People that can't say sorry.
Non diabetics don't seem to do carbs in moderation, at least the friends I have eat them in glutinous amounts and one I particular needs to see his GP ref diabetes. The vast majority of these persons around me are overweight. In fact I honestly only know one person that is slim and she eats low carb and runs 10km everyday. So,personally I don't see any non diabetic eating carbs in moderation and will they end up diabetic.. Probably.
 
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Scimama

Well-Known Member
Messages
942
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
Treatment type
Diet only
That's an insupportable position. No scientist would support this position.


This made me laugh, have you read many scientific journals, seen who pays for the research? It is not uncommon that in published papers the full findings are not disclosed.
Authors should (!!) disclose their funding for the research but often it can be via a 'third - party' so isn't always obvious. typically a question is posed that already has a biased outcome!!
I have spent over 25 years as a 'research scientist / academic" the way research funding has changed over last 10 years has led to very limited 'truly independent research' in this country. But funding issues etc is a whole different forum :)
 
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Lamont D

Oracle
Messages
15,796
Type of diabetes
Reactive hypoglycemia
Treatment type
I do not have diabetes
An obvious question to anybody interested in diabetes diet control is - If you eat a bacon, lettuce and tomato sandwich, what is the unhealthy part of it?


Answers on a postcard to the following,
NICE, health secretary. Prime minister, and all the food industry bosses!