Do I have diabetes or not?

[rosserk]

Hi everyone I am a confused newbie desperate for some advice to stop me going around in circles!

It's complicated so apologies in advance.

Several weeks ago a friend who's diabetic tested my blood glucose because according to her symptoms I was having were classic of someone with type 2 and I had been unwell and getting progressively worse. A random test was 7.6 and I hadn't eaten anything for at least three hours. I had a glucose monitor I purchased for my father that he didn't use so bought some test strips and starting testing my blood sugars regularly. I have had fasting levels of 15.2, 12.1' 10's and 11.2 and one at 25.0 and another at 26.5, which I thought indicated something wrong with the monitor. My sugars go up after I eat and don't start to come down until 2.5 hours after I have eaten. I have a constant headache, and difficulty focussing because my vision keeps going blurred, hot flushes, nausea and I drink constantly, my lips are permanently chapped. I wake every night about 3am and feel really poorly, I am constantly exhausted. On Sunday the 15th I felt really ill when I woke up and decided to go to the local drop in my blood sugar was 15.3 when I woke up it was 12.6 when I went to sleep and I had a really restless night.

I took my iPad where I had stored all my BS in an app and showed it to the doctor who said straight away with BS that high you are definitely type 2 diabetic, the BS were over a three weeks period. He gave me Metformin and told me to go to my local surgery and have a blood test. The surgery were not happy and said they were amazed he had diagnosed diabetes and I shouldn't be testing my blood sugars. Anyway after a war with the nurse they sent me to another drop in centre to have a blood test, the results have come back Hba1 5.6 HB a 1 c 38. I had a blood test for something else back in February and they did the same tests then which came back random BS 7.8 HBa1c Normal. They are apparently all normal and she has told me to stop taking the Metformin and stop testing my blood sugars, she said people with type two diabetes wouldn't test their blood sugars and I was wasting my time because the monitors can give false readings?

I did consider the monitor could be wrong so I tested my teenage daughter and my husband and it doesn't give high readings for them just me!

I have no idea what to do now, has anyone had a similar experience yes you are diabetic opps no you're not. I just ate some cereal two hours ago and my blood sugar was 6.7 and two hours 20 minutes later it was 8.4. I am really confused any advise would be appreciated

 

[brettsza]

A1c of 38 is non diabetic so relax
Just try to reduce some weight if you have any excess and go for walks or run if you can it should be fine.

 

[brettsza]

Also there is sometimes a big difference in when you test on monitors and the blood that comes straight from veins, you might not have washed your hands and the readings can be funny, also since your monitor is old, there could be a problem.
Reading of 5.8 and a1c of 38 is perfect.

 

[rosserk]

Thank you if I get any thinner I will break!

I understand that the tests are normal what I don't get is the difference in the monitor readings?

I am 5.11 and weigh 10st 10lb and wear a size ten so not sure I have a weight issue.

 

[Hairycamel]

I'm no expert, but the fact that I had some of your symptoms pre-diagnosis (i.e. blurred vision and thirst) would lead me to the type II diagnosis. However, your HBA1C reading is at the worst pre diabetic, so It's difficult to reconcile that with your high random readings.
Whatever the issue, one thing that you can take from this site is not to always take Diabetic Nurses at their word and their lack of current information is staggering sometimes.
I'd go back to your doctor with your IPad again and ask him to carry on investigating.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

 

[rosserk]

Thank you, I didn't add that my sister died last month from pancreatic cancer and I was her carer. She developed type 1 towards the end and I was testing her bloods regularly. I tested mine a lot of the time to bolster her along with 'her meter' and nine times out of ten my readings were higher. I am going to ask the doctor if he will do a glucose tolerance test because someone said that the HBa1c test can be wrong under certain circumstances?

 

[rosserk]

Also does anyone know what affect Metformin has on HBa1c test results? I was only taking it a couple of days before the test so unlikely but worth asking.

 

[Daibell]

Hi and welcome. The HBa1c test is very reliable and indicates overall you don't have diabetes but it may be that you are seeing the beginning of spiking that may or may not get worse. Currently you have nothing to worry about but may be very occasionally checking with the meter 2 hours after a meal will see if there is an ongoing trend. As you are thin if anything is happening it may be you are producing just a bit less insulin than normal. The Metformin will have had very little if any effect on your HBa1C. I would adopt a diet with low'ish carbs and adequate protein and fat as this will reduce the impact of any spiking. May be one day you will move into the full diabetic range but your meter will guide you. The fasting figures would indicate diabetes but due to the liver's overnight glucose dump can be confusing. Use the 2 hour after a main meal as the guide.

 

[rosserk]

Daibell thank you that is very helpful. Kind regards everyone and thanks for the advice.

 

[DeejayR]

Hi and welcome, @rosserk. Very sorry to hear of your loss.
Your experience is all very confusing for you and us actually, but what stands out to me is this bit
" I have a constant headache, and difficulty focussing because my vision keeps going blurred, hot flushes, nausea and I drink constantly, my lips are permanently chapped. I wake every night about 3am and feel really poorly, I am constantly exhausted."
So you're really not very well, apart from the stress and grief of losing your sister. As a diabetic (not a doctor) I'm thinking that along with those high readings you took it has to be considered that you are diabetic, regardless of the usually more reliable HbA1c. Would you consider working on that basis and trying a low-carb diet as described on this forum?
As pointed out above, your "expert" NHS advice is hopelessly muddled and diet is something you can manage yourself.

 

[rosserk]

Just as an aside to above, since I began taking the Metformin my fasting glucose has not gone above 6 and my highest reading over the last two days has been 9. So the Metformin seems to have rectified the monitor or is helping to keep me in the normal range. Think I will stop taking the tablets and see if they go up again just to be sure if they don't I will relax. Feel a terrible fraud when people are living with this horrible disease I'm stressing about it because someone may have made a terrible mistake

 

[DeejayR]

I'm told metformin doesn't alter BG much. But you never know.
You are not a fraud.
Repeat
"I am not a fraud"
Good.

 

[rosserk]

Hi and welcome, @rosserk. Very sorry to hear of your loss.
Your experience is all very confusing for you and us actually, but what stands out to me is this bit
" I have a constant headache, and difficulty focussing because my vision keeps going blurred, hot flushes, nausea and I drink constantly, my lips are permanently chapped. I wake every night about 3am and feel really poorly, I am constantly exhausted."
So you're really not very well, apart from the stress and grief of losing your sister. As a diabetic (not a doctor) I'm thinking that along with those high readings you took it has to be considered that you are diabetic, regardless of the usually more reliable HbA1c. Would you consider working on that basis and trying a low-carb diet as described on this forum?
As pointed out above, your "expert" NHS advice is hopelessly muddled and diet is something you can manage yourself.

Sorry we posted at the same time. Yes very good advice, if my husbands and daughters BS were high when I tested theirs I would not have concerned myself with my readings but theirs were 4.9 and 5 respectively whilst mine came in at a whooping 15.2! Last night I had fish and salad with puy lentils and they were 6.8 two hours after eating which is ok I assume? They have definitely come right down with the Metformin which I won't take tomorrow. The doctor I saw at the drop in centre seemed to know exactly what he was talking about its just the diabetic nurse that's not happy with the diagnoses.

 

[DeejayR]

OK, that's beginning to fall into place.
Assuming the fish wasn't battered, the lentils should be ok (I prefer puy since they don't mush up in cooking) and they raise my BG just a bit. 6.8 is diabetic, but acceptable (well, I would say that because it's around my post-meal level lately).
Need to know more about what you eat. Sensible for non-diabetics is not altogether the same as sensible for us.
Do you need to lose weight?
*EDIT* Sorry, missed your post about being thin

 

[rosserk]

Hi no I'm not over weight I'm 5.11 tall which for a woman is tall and I am a size ten which some would say is under weight for my height. I don't like cakes, biscuits, puddings or sweets and I can't abide chocolate. I like savoury foods and eat a lot of meat, whole meal or whole grain bread never white, Special K for breakfast. I would say my diet lacks vegetables if anything I do like fruit yogurts but that's my only indulgence.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Hi,

No wonder you are confused. Your readings are high and show diabetes is likely, despite your normal HbA1c. I think you need to see your GP and insist on an oral glucose test. HbA1c tests can be skewed if you are anaemic or have similar issues with red blood cells. Metformin does very little to decrease general BS levels - it won't stop the post meal spikes for example. It does help to a limited extent with morning fasting levels as it discourages the liver from sending its own glucose into the blood stream. (Dawn Phenomenon or liver dump).

 

[rosserk]

Hi,

No wonder you are confused. Your readings are high and show diabetes is likely, despite your normal HbA1c. I think you need to see your GP and insist on an oral glucose test. HbA1c tests can be skewed if you are anaemic or have similar issues with red blood cells. Metformin does very little to decrease general BS levels - it won't stop the post meal spikes for example. It does help to a limited extent with morning fasting levels as it discourages the liver from sending its own glucose into the blood stream. (Dawn Phenomenon or liver dump).

That makes sense because whilst I say my levels have got better since I started taking Metformin I think I was also watching what I ate (I was scared stiff) yesterday for example as well,as the fish I had Special K for breakfast didn't eat lunch because my BS was 12 after 2 hours it came right down after 3 pm and I had a couple of slices of cheese and it stayed fine, then of course I had dinner which was fish and salad. What I really need to know is can I trust the meter readings or not?

 

[Bluetit1802]

If you are intending to eat like a type 2 diabetic, at least for the time being until you get a proper diagnosis, I am afraid you are going to have to change your habits a tad. Special K should be on your "never eat" list. It is very high in carbs and sugar. That is what will be causing your spikes, particularly if you have it with milk.

Type 2s need to reduce all carbs to as low as they can manage. All carbs convert to glucose once in the system, not just sugar. We also have to be careful with milk and fruit as they are also full of sugar. Cereals (all cereals), potatoes, rice, pasta and bread (all bread) are the worst culprits, also anything made with flour such as pastry and gravy. Any of those foods are likely to cause spikes. The good news is that you can eat as much meat, fish, cheese, eggs, dairy (except milk), full fat yogurts, oils, butter, cream, most vegetables, and salads as you wish. Many of us have a good old fry up (bacon, eggs, tomatoes, mushrooms) for breakfast, or eggs cooked any which way, or a full fat plain yogurt with a few berries added. (strawberries, raspberries, blackberries, blueberries).

Missing meals is also not a good idea for us. It is best to have 3 meals a day, as evenly spaced as possible. Any snacks should be as low carb as possible, such as cheese or a small handful of nuts.

Test immediately before you eat, then again at 1 hour and 2 hours after your first bite. If the rise is above 2mmol/l there are too many carbs in that meal and you need to adjust the portion size or do without. Ideally, any spike should be on its way down again by 2 hours (sometimes 2.5hrs depending on what you have eaten) Don't worry about any 1 hr spike - everyone will spike after eating carbs, including non-diabetics. The trick is to get back down again by at least 2.5hrs.

I think you can trust your meter readings as it works on members of your family. Remember to wash and dry your hands first.

 

[sanguine]

Hi @rosserk, welcome.

I agree that whilst the HbA1c of 38 is fine, your high spikes on the meter may indicate that some tipping point is near. An OGT as Bluetit suggests would help determine what is happening.

As for meters, there should be a test strip with it that just checks that the electronics are working and that it is within specifications. Other than that they are never fully accurate but +/- 10% is normal so those high readings you got are definitely high (unless you had a bit of dirt or grease on your finger which can affect them significantly, make sure hands are spotless).

Either way, a low(er) carb diet would help. Have a read of the top item linked in my sig below and keep in touch.

 

[DeejayR]

What I really need to know is can I trust the meter readings or not?
Yes, just as we do. We know they have a wide variable (about +/-15%) and you can get different readings from different fingers but we really do find the meter useful until we get to know what's ok for us.
Excuse me, got a stir fry on the go