understanding spikes

[Spiral]

And no, I don't mean my small orange cat who's behaviour can be a bit perplexing at times.... This is really all about me :wink:

Since I started testing I have found a couple of spikes, but not every day. The hhighest I've had has been about 9.6, most of teh time my readings are between 5.something to 7

I'm not sure I'm missing spikes because of the time I test - I did test several times today, but at odd times because of my commitments, and suspect I had a spike this moring after breakfast, I tested after just over 2 hours after I'd eaten.

What is the best time to test for spikes? Do I need to test specifically for a spike or can i assume that a higher than normal reading about 2 hours indicates that what I have eaten has made me spike?

 

[graham64]

Hi Spiral,
I used this site lots of excellent information on testing.

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045621.php

Cheers
Graham

 

[kegstore]

Admittedly I'm testing 6-7 times a day as a T1, but I quite often encounter the unexplainable...

This morning on waking I tested at 5.3, which is perfectly acceptable and a normal reading for me. Decided not to have breakfast and felt absolutely fine. 2 hours later, after 2 cups of coffee with a dribble of semi-skimmed milk, I test again at 11.6 - disaster, plagues of locusts, rabid frogs and pestilence throughout the land etc.

Unfortunately I just have to put it down to some of the weird stuff that diabetes occasionally throws into the mix, for no apparent reason it seems. But it's no less infuriating for that, grrrrrr... :evil:

 

[Spiral]

And how high is acceptable to spike?

I have managed to test about an hour after I'd eaten over several times over the last few days :shock: :shock: :shock: and have had spikes of 8.4, 8.2, 8.9 and 9.7! reassuringly, I seem to have a pretty good second phase insulin response and my readings return to under 6 with 2-3 hours, difficult to tell as my testing at work is a bit erratic.

I also think I'm getting a clearer picture of the things making me spike and some of this is portion size and guess what... carbohydrates! Oats seems to be okay, and some pasta but potato seems to be a big nono :?

 

[Spiral]

Just to clarify, I also need to keep my post meal spikes as low as possible, even tho I seem to have a fairly healthy second phase insulin response?

It is the post meal spikes that I think I really need to get to grips with to help me make the changes I need to make and I will miss them if I don't test after an hour.

 

[kegstore]

Remember, someone without diabetes can hit 8 just 1 hour post-meal, but will be way back down at the 2 hour stage, normally...

 

[squirrel]

Hi, what is a normal acceptable spike for a dieabetic, i tried low carb and never had spikes at all but i never lost any weight, im now doing scottish slimmers and the weight is flying off but as soon as i eat bread/toast my sugars can jump right up to 14 before coming back down.

thanks mark

 

[carlos]

hi have been testing about eight times a day and mostly 4.8 to 7.0 most of time but do still get the odd high one as high as 9.8 now and again but i do one hour then two hour but find with some foods you can be ok for 1 hour then spike at 2 the main time for me is morning this seems to be the worst for spiking but still check throughout the day hope this helps

 

[squirrel]

Hi, do you eat bread or are you low carbing

 

[cugila]

Hi, what is a normal acceptable spike for a dieabetic, i tried low carb and never had spikes at all but i never lost any weight, im now doing scottish slimmers and the weight is flying off but as soon as i eat bread/toast my sugars can jump right up to 14 before coming back down.

thanks mark

Hi Mark.

Great to hear that you are losing weight now.
As for your Bg levels, If you spike like that (14) after your bread/toast then I should think you need to eat something else that won't elevate your Bg levels so much.
I spike alarmingly after eating anything other than a low carb bread. There are other foods which can do the same to me too. I only found that out by testing often.

Ken.

 

[Reetpetite]

Ken,

Relative newbie here!

Just out of interest what low carb bread do you use? I've tried several breads now but haven't found one I am happy with - can only manage half a slice of rye bread without my numbers going up - not dramatically but up - 7.5 one hour after breakfast - then 6.0 after 2 hours. Is this good or bad? Most of my other numbers are in the 5's.

I've given up all the other 'naughty' carbs but would like a slice of bread every now and again if that's possible.

Rita :?:

 

[cugila]

Hi Rita.

I make my own low carb bread with mixes from one of the mods, Fergus. If you pm him and ask for details I am sure he will respond. The bread is very tasty and filling. It has a negligible effect on Bg levels. There are various flavours. You wont need to eat much. He also sells the whole loaves.

As for your Bg levels, these are the guideline figures for aT2 in Feb 2009.

Fasting (waking)..................between 4 - 7 mmol/l.
2 hrs after meals.................no more than 8.5 mmol/l.

Stay within those numbers and you won't go far wrong. Obviously the lower the better.

Ken.

 

[Reetpetite]

Thanks Ken - I'll pm Fergus.

 

[Spiral]

I'm starting to experiment with different foods to see what they do to me.

I found 200ml cloudy apple juice made me spike by 1.7 after 1 hour in the morning and 100ml created a spike of 0.6, so I guess the glyceamic load with portion size is quite important here. I love cloudy apple juice, especially the Aspalls range...

Where can I read up on differnt responses to glyceamic load during the day? Or is this insulin resistance varying throughout the day?

I think I will continue my occasional experiements with apple juice, all in the name of science.

 

[whatashock]

Am I still not understanding this properly.

I do not test after every meal.

i test in the morning when I get up, and I am usually between 6.5 and 6.9. My doctor has told me that realistically I cannot do anything at night to bring this down.

Since Jan (three months prior to diagnosis) I have lost 2 stone, now down to about 15.5 stone.

I do not test at lunch time as I typically eat and then go into meetings, so would not get good test results.

Prior to dinner, I range from 5.0 to 6.5 dependant on my day.

If I am eating something new (going out for dinner) I will test 1 and 2 hours after. If it is a 'usual' dinner I will just test 2 hours after.

My 'Spikes' are typically up by 2, 2 hours later, whcih I have been told is acceptable.

I have had instanced, for example where I have gone to 12.0 having eaten Sushi, and this is now off the list, but I have been made aware that even if I go up by 3 after an hour, a non diabetic could do that as well, and the important thing is to get back to a near pre dinner reading at around 2 hours.

This does seem to work for me, and I am just eating loads more healthily

 

[cugila]

Hi whatashock.

I'm not really sure what it is you are not understanding ?

You seem to be doing well and have used your test regime to work out what foods have a bad effect (Sushi).

You mention your morning Bg levels, do you know what the readings are before bed the previous night ? That gives a clearer picture of the overnight levels. There may then be a way to get the morning Bg figures to reduce, despite what your GP says.

Ken.

 

[Spiral]

I have been a bit lax with it over the last week, but exercise gets those numbers down for me. I exercise in the evenings, after work and my son has gone to bed. I do around 30 minutes on my exercise bike and my blood sugar numbers fall considerably and are still low the next morning.

A programme on the telly a couple of weeks ago (I watched it on BBC iplayer), with a title something like "10 thinks you didn't know about dieting" was very revealing. Exercise has an afterburn - where you body keeps on burning the calories for about 24 hours after exercise.

I think the point of exercise is to get a bit breathless and sweaty rather than aiming for complete exhaustion. I don't do huge amounts of exercise, but one of the other things on that program was how little exercse you needed to make an impact and that you could get a lot of this simply by moving around while you do your chores.

I think this could be a method to enable me to indulge in slightly larger qualtities of cloudy apple juice 8) :roll: I think I owe it to myself to experiement.

 

[Dobbs]

This is a really useful thread - thanks, Spiral, for starting it.
My understanding, based on what I got from reading Jenny Ruhl's book, is that, ideally - IDEALLY - we'd never go above about 7.8 at ANY time, and that going above 7.8 is the definition of a spike. But it seems not everyone agrees on these numbers. Ken, you mentioned "no more than 8.5... two hours after meals", which seems much more lax than what Jenny recommends - that could mean that one hour after eating the number could easily be 9.5 or thereabouts. Could you tell us where this guideline comes from?
On the subject of testing times, I've experimented with re-introducing brown rice into my low-carb world and have had some intriguing results. After a chick pea curry with a small amount of brown rice the other night (one of my absolutely favourite foods) I was 7.3 an hour after, and two hours after I was... 7.3! Made me wonder if it continued rising for a while after the one-hour mark, then came down again. Normally I'm a good bit lower two hours after eating than one hour after.

 

[belinda_b]

I try, and usually manage to keep bg levels under the guidelines I read on here....somewhere...

Under 8 - 1hr after meals, and under 6.5 - 2hrs after meals.
Fasting (wake up) bg is usually 5 - 5.3

 

[cugila]

Hi Dobbs and Belinda.

The guidelines I am always posting are the (NICE) National Institute for Clinical Excellence (UK) guidelines which were last updated in February 2009. They are for T2 Diabetics.

They are not my figures. I personally always try and kep well inside those figures for tight control.

Belinda your figures look good to me.

Ken.