Type 1 Do I need to take my bra off???

[KeepSmiling]

Hi new to the forum and touchy subject so please be nice.....


Recently, I had my first checkup with the consultant at my local diabetes clinic.

During the appointment i was asked to take off my top and bra so that the doctor could perform a heart examination.

So my question is....has everyone had to take their bra off for this examination? I tried to ask at my clinic if this was standard practice and was told that some doctors ask for bra off and others don't...?? This response has not made it clear to me if this examination was necessary, so i thought it would be great if i could hear from other female patients....

Did you have to take your bra off??

I've already been treated like an 'attention seeker' or 'crazy' or a 'drama queen' for talking about this subject ( so if thats your planned chip in, ive heard it)
In fact, i have found every part of the process (including writing this post) very scary and not enjoyable in the least, i also seem to have destroyed any chance of receiving fair and kind treatment from my hospital, so i find it hard to believe that anyone would ask these questions for a giggle....im not laughing!!!

 

[ButtterflyLady]

Hi new to the forum and touchy subject so please be nice.....


Recently, I had my first checkup with the consultant at my local diabetes clinic.

During the appointment i was asked to take off my top and bra so that the doctor could perform a heart examination.

So my question is....has everyone had to take their bra off for this examination? I tried to ask at my clinic if this was standard practice and was told that some doctors ask for bra off and others don't...?? This response has not made it clear to me if this examination was necessary, so i thought it would be great if i could hear from other female patients....

Did you have to take your bra off??

I've already been treated like an 'attention seeker' or 'crazy' or a 'drama queen' for talking about this subject ( so if thats your planned chip in, ive heard it)
In fact, i have found every part of the process (including writing this post) very scary and not enjoyable in the least, i also seem to have destroyed any chance of receiving fair and kind treatment from my hospital, so i find it hard to believe that anyone would ask these questions for a giggle....im not laughing!!!

It doesn't sound like standard procedure to me, and if it is, then doctors should change it. Patients have rights and one of them is to have dignity... another one is to have questions/concerns taken seriously.

Whenever I've needed to remove my bra for an examination I've been allowed to do it behind a curtain and put a gown on. The only time I didn't was when a female doctor performed a breast examination, and that situation is understandable.

If something like this happens again, you can say no and ask for a gown. If they refuse to offer one, then stand your ground.

Your hospital should not change their treatment of you based on you expressing your view about things. Often HCPs do, however. The system is slow to change. In the 1950s, people did as they were told and questioning a HCP was not socially acceptable. Over the decades, there has been a movement for change, where patients rights have been enshrined in codes and policies. In 2015, a HCP who treats a patient poorly runs the risk of consequences from their council (or whatever systems there are in each country). In NZ there is a Health and Disability Commissioner who investigates anything from an HCP being rude, to preventable injury or death. If people accept poor treatment then nothing will change.

 

[ButtterflyLady]

@KeepSmiling if you contact the people at this service:

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/pages/1082.aspx

they should be able to tell you what is meant to happen in such situations. You don't have to make a complaint if you don't want to, but you can find out what to expect in future. Maybe raising this issue might help others avoid problems.

 

[AndBreathe]

Hi new to the forum and touchy subject so please be nice.....


Recently, I had my first checkup with the consultant at my local diabetes clinic.

During the appointment i was asked to take off my top and bra so that the doctor could perform a heart examination.

So my question is....has everyone had to take their bra off for this examination? I tried to ask at my clinic if this was standard practice and was told that some doctors ask for bra off and others don't...?? This response has not made it clear to me if this examination was necessary, so i thought it would be great if i could hear from other female patients....

Did you have to take your bra off??

I've already been treated like an 'attention seeker' or 'crazy' or a 'drama queen' for talking about this subject ( so if thats your planned chip in, ive heard it)
In fact, i have found every part of the process (including writing this post) very scary and not enjoyable in the least, i also seem to have destroyed any chance of receiving fair and kind treatment from my hospital, so i find it hard to believe that anyone would ask these questions for a giggle....im not laughing!!!

Why not make an appointment with your GP and explain you have been unsettled by what happened, and ask if he/she could explain what the Consultant's rationale could have been? Were you and the Consultant chaperoned during the process, or were you asked if you would like a third party present, if there wasn't one?

I know when I've had a fairly routine breast examination, I have always been asked if I would like a chaperone present, even though my current GP is female.

I'm assuming you are in the UK, and any other such interactions would have been in the same health system? I know other countries have different ideas about how to conduct some processes or procedures.

 

[KeepSmiling]

It doesn't sound like standard procedure to me, and if it is, then doctors should change it. Patients have rights and one of them is to have dignity... another one is to have questions/concerns taken seriously.

Whenever I've needed to remove my bra for an examination I've been allowed to do it behind a curtain and put a gown on. The only time I didn't was when a female doctor performed a breast examination, and that situation is understandable.

If something like this happens again, you can say no and ask for a gown. If they refuse to offer one, then stand your ground.

Your hospital should not change their treatment of you based on you expressing your view about things. Often HCPs do, however. The system is slow to change. In the 1950s, people did as they were told and questioning a HCP was not socially acceptable. Over the decades, there has been a movement for change, where patients rights have been enshrined in codes and policies. In 2015, a HCP who treats a patient poorly runs the risk of consequences from their council (or whatever systems there are in each country). In NZ there is a Health and Disability Commissioner who investigates anything from an HCP being rude, to preventable injury or death. If people accept poor treatment then nothing will change.

Thanks for response, good to hear from you. Seems the hospitals main concern is putting me on trial, to see why i would make this complaint. To be honest, im old enough and experienced enough to not let a pervy doctor get me down, however, im also aware that there are a lot of girls younger than me and more vulnerable that need to be protected.

@KeepSmiling if you contact the people at this service:

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/pages/1082.aspx

they should be able to tell you what is meant to happen in such situations. You don't have to make a complaint if you don't want to, but you can find out what to expect in future. Maybe raising this issue might help others avoid problems.

 

[Catlady19]

I concur with the above. It doesn't sound right to me! You should have had a gown and a chaperone - I don't understand why having a bra on would impede someone listening to your heart. I find it appalling that anyone has been mean to you about this, you shouldn't be made to feel uncomfortable during any kind of examination - hold your ground in the future! x

 

[ButtterflyLady]

Thanks for response, good to hear from you. Seems the hospitals main concern is putting me on trial, to see why i would make this complaint. To be honest, im old enough and experienced enough to not let a pervy doctor get me down, however, im also aware that there are a lot of girls younger than me and more vulnerable that need to be protected.

It's good that there are authorities independent of the hospital who can take them to task for mistreating a patient who makes a complaint. I think it is such a colossal waste of everybody's time when health providers do this. It's so much quicker to just admit they made a mistake, apologise, and move on.

The right to make a compliant without getting backlash for it is a key part of complaint systems in every country that has them.

I'm glad you weren't upset by this doctor - I'm sure lots of people would be, including women whose culture requires them to cover more than their breasts. I can't think of a medical reason why breasts would need to be visible to check the heart. Every doctor checking my heart has worked around my covered-up breasts.

 

[KeepSmiling]

I concur with the above. It doesn't sound right to me! You should have had a gown and a chaperone - I don't understand why having a bra on would impede someone listening to your heart. I find it appalling that anyone has been mean to you about this, you shouldn't be made to feel uncomfortable during any kind of examination - hold your ground in the future! x

Thanks for your responses. if nothing else i hope this post lets young girls know that they can stand up to pervy doctors.

I have made a formal complaint to the hospital, as that is what is advised online in the UK, from which i had a meeting with the hospital. I have just received the summary of the meeting and it has come back as a personal attack on my character. I have also been told that the doctor in question is highly respected and that no other complaints have been made against him.

All of which seems to pointing to me being called a liar. which is why i wanted to hear if others had been asked to remove their bras. All this questioning has made me question myself and at times i have wanted to cancel the complaint. however, hearing that others were not asked to take off their bras has renewed my belief that this complaint is valid and important.

Thanks again xx

 

[Emma158]

Hi new to the forum and touchy subject so please be nice.....


Recently, I had my first checkup with the consultant at my local diabetes clinic.

During the appointment i was asked to take off my top and bra so that the doctor could perform a heart examination.

Hi,
what sort of examination did the doctor perform if you don't mind me asking? If he was simply listening to your chest I am unsure why he would request for you to remove your bra and it does seem unnecessary. I am pleased to hear you haven't let it get you down but applaud you wanting answers and to prevent unnecessary embarrassment (or worse) for others in the future.

 

[KeepSmiling]

Hi,
what sort of examination did the doctor perform if you don't mind me asking? If he was simply listening to your chest I am unsure why he would request for you to remove your bra and it does seem unnecessary. I am pleased to hear you haven't let it get you down but applaud you wanting answers and to prevent unnecessary embarrassment (or worse) for others in the future.[/QUOTE

It was my first check up with a doctor after being diagnosed with type 1 diabetes, all i know was that it was a heart examination...?

 

[satindoll]

Whilst this is not what I would call a usual request, I was asked to do this when I first went to see the consultant but for me there was a good reason, having had heart and other surgery I have a number of scars of various sizes and the consultant said she wished to check they were in a healthy condition as high blood sugars can cause problems with old and new scars.
But I agree you should have had the choice and your concerns should have been addressed at the time and a reasonable explanation given.
Next time they ask just refuse unless they can give you a good reason, perv Dr or not it could be classed as assault.

 

[Emma158]

Sorry all I meant was that unless you were having an ECG where they have to attach multiple wires to your chest then I have never been asked to remove my bra.

 

[KeepSmiling]

Sorry all I meant was that unless you were having an ECG where they have to attach multiple wires to your chest then I have never been asked to remove my bra.

no need to say sorry....really appreciate you getting in touch, ecg has been the only other time i have been asked to remove my bra, and for that i can see a clear reason, thanks again xx

 

[BeccyB]

You can report the hospital to the Care Quality Commission who regulate services (similar to Ofsted for schools) - they welcome any feedback (good or bad) - here is their page on complaining about services : http://www.cqc.org.uk/content/complain-about-service-or-provider

This is an interesting section on the fundamental standards they should be meeting: http://www.cqc.org.uk/content/fundamental-standards

 

[ButtterflyLady]

Thanks for your responses. if nothing else i hope this post lets young girls know that they can stand up to pervy doctors.

I have made a formal complaint to the hospital, as that is what is advised online in the UK, from which i had a meeting with the hospital. I have just received the summary of the meeting and it has come back as a personal attack on my character. I have also been told that the doctor in question is highly respected and that no other complaints have been made against him.

All of which seems to pointing to me being called a liar. which is why i wanted to hear if others had been asked to remove their bras. All this questioning has made me question myself and at times i have wanted to cancel the complaint. however, hearing that others were not asked to take off their bras has renewed my belief that this complaint is valid and important.

Thanks again xx

They've just added another reason for an external complaint to be made. It doesn't matter how "respected" the doctor is or whether any other complaints have been made. This is all usual stuff, excuses, that are used when people don't know how to handle complaints. Sigh.

 

[BeccyB]

They've just added another reason for an external complaint to be made. It doesn't matter how "respected" the doctor is or whether any other complaints have been made. This is all usual stuff, excuses, that are used when people don't know how to handle complaints. Sigh.

Absolutely - There are a lot of 70s TV celebs that were "highly respected" until people started speaking out!

 

[MargJ]

The only time I have been asked to remove my bra was for the MRI scan. I was diagnosed type2 earlier this year and had a whole lot of tests done at once but the only clothes that had to come off were my socks! Doc asked me if he could place the stethoscope inside my top. Mind, I am an older woman so even a 'Pervy ' doc wouldn't be interested in my bare flesh. I think you are right to have concerns.

 

[satindoll]

Having reconsidered this there would be one another sensible reason for this request and that would be if the patient was Ahem well endowed, lots of breast tissue can muffle the sounds and being able to watch the bosom/ rib cage move can assist in respiratory counting.

 

[Mep]

That sounds odd to have that happen... unless they've having to do some sort of monitoring on you? The only time I have that happen to me is when they're needing to do ECG's. I've lost count how many of those I've had. But because I get tachycardia when I'm really sick they always check because I also usually have high BP readings as well. I don't like having to strip either and often I've got people lifting my breast to get the electrodes (stickers) positioned. But I have to admit I'm usually feeling so unwell that I just don't care about what is happening at the time as I just want to get better. But I am a very private person and I can understand why you'd be uncomfortable. I don't like this type of thing either. I'm grateful my GP doesn't get me to strip unless he is checking something in particular. But at my surgery they do have a rule that ladies have to see the female doc for anything about female issues. My GP sees me about everything else pretty much.

 

[noblehead]

Can't see why even listening to your heart using a stethoscope would require you to remove your bra, I know if my wife has to visit her gp (male Dr) and it means removing items of clothing they always ask that a nurse is in attendance.