Can't be a hypo

GOM

Newbie
Messages
3
I have type 2 'controlled' with metformin + gliclazide. After the tablets in the morning I normally have breakfast 20 min later. I am also trying to lose weight. So I decided to delay breakfast by 1 hour an went to the shops. Felt great then suddenly felt very odd and the legs gave way. I had collapsed but I don't think I lost consciousness. Passers by lifted me to a chair, I thought about a stroke but ruled that out. After 10 mins I went to get some chocolate. A chemist says it sounds like a hypo. Is that possible with type 2? my fasting BG that morning was 9.7

I managed to see a Doctor who just said you should have had breakfast - a hypo can be induced by gliclazide. By the way this happened once before whilst I was driving. Fortunately I managed an emergency stop and then lie down. Luckily there was no other traffic around.

Any comments?

Other things have started happening this year - burning in one leg, numbness in the leg, p&n in the hand.
 

Marvin

Well-Known Member
Messages
196
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Non-insulin injectable medication (incretin mimetics)
Of course Type 2's can have hypos..... I'm type 2 on Metformin (2x 500mg with breakfast and 2 with evening meal) and Gliclazide (80mg with breakfast), and I tend to get low late morning. Its the glic that does it... squeezing more insulin out of the pancreas, and if you take your glic at breakfast its going to lower your blood glucose during the morning.
Its very important that you test your blood glucose before you drive, and if you are driving for any length of time test again every hour or two. I find that a biscuit with my mid-morning coffee usually restores the balance, though I can still get well below 4 if I'm doing a lot of physical activity (mowing the lawn, etc).
If you are on Gliclazide you should be getting test strips on prescription (though you may only be given enough to do one or two tests a day.... if the doctor/DN refuses, stress the need to test before driving for safety reasons).
You might try taking your glic WITH your breakfast, rather than before it... that will ensure you don't "forget" to eat after taking it, which, of course, was why you had the problem in the first place!
Don't assume that a morning reading of over 9 means you will stay high all morning..... this is probably the dawn phenomenon: I'm usually up around there first thing, too, but regularly get on the edge of hypo by late morning.
ALWAYS carry some Glucotabs/jelly babies/whatever with you to take immediately if you get shaky.... the biscuit treatment isn't fast acting enough to deal with a hypo...it only stops you getting low enough for one.
 

GOM

Newbie
Messages
3
Many thanks for you comments. I will not be able to see the Doc till mid April to get the prescription changed. However I saw the nurse yesterday about the burning in my leg. She says that it is D. Neuropathy. I read that if this is the case it could explain why the hypo had no early warning signs.

I have got the glucose tablets now and carry them with me and will have a low GI sandwich afterwards if it happens again.
 

))Denise((

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,580
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
I've fainted a couple of times, the last time was on Saturday. I'm also on Gliclazide. I treated it as a hypo (I drank some full sugar coke), but I think it may have been low blood pressure.

I'd not eaten or drunk much the day before (I'm also trying to loose some weight) and my fasting BS was 5.2 that morning, I'd eaten breakfast as usual and I fainted about 4 hours after I had eaten. I was in a large indoor shopping centre. I had warnings that I didn't feel too good and wanted to sit down, but fainted before I found a seat. Had to get rescued by my OH as I was in no fit state to drive home.

I tested my blood pressure when I got home and it was 111/66 and I had a headache for the rest of the day. I didn't have my BS testing kit with me, so don't know what my levels were. I think I was dehydrated and thats what caused me to faint.

You could have been dehydrated and not hypo. I think I need to put a BS testing kit in the car.
 

daisy3174

Well-Known Member
Messages
136
Hi, yes sounds very much like a Hypo and Type 2,s can Hypo even without medication.You need to get a meter, call your diabetic nurse and tell her you think you are having Hypos, this is how I had my meter for testing the lows rather than the highs as I was going Hypo while driving.If she wont give one it is certainly worth you buying one, make sure you carry Lucozade or Glucotabs with you at all times x
 
C

catherinecherub

Guest
GOM said:
I have type 2 'controlled' with metformin + gliclazide. After the tablets in the morning I normally have breakfast 20 min later. I am also trying to lose weight. So I decided to delay breakfast by 1 hour an went to the shops. Felt great then suddenly felt very odd and the legs gave way. I had collapsed but I don't think I lost consciousness. Passers by lifted me to a chair, I thought about a stroke but ruled that out. After 10 mins I went to get some chocolate. A chemist says it sounds like a hypo. Is that possible with type 2? my fasting BG that morning was 9.7

I managed to see a Doctor who just said you should have had breakfast - a hypo can be induced by gliclazide. By the way this happened once before whilst I was driving. Fortunately I managed an emergency stop and then lie down. Luckily there was no other traffic around.

Any comments?

Other things have started happening this year - burning in one leg, numbness in the leg, p&n in the hand.

Hi,

Glad you were not on your own when it happened.
Anyone can hypo, diabetic or not, medication or not, I can testify to that. I am not on any medication but you are on Glic and that is known to produce hypos. Please be sure to eat regular meals or you are asking for trouble. Not having breakfast on time will do nothing for your weight loss. You were also lucky that you could pull over when you were driving and it occurred. It doesn't bear thinking about what could have happened if you had passed out.
You will read on here that some Type 2's go very low and do not feel the symptoms of a hypo. That is what happens to them but does not mean it will be the same for you. A hypo is debilitating as you have found to your cost so it would be wise to take something suitable to eat or drink with you each time you go out so that you can take the necessary action.
Hope you are more aware now of what can happen,

Take care.

CC.
 

claymic

Well-Known Member
Messages
503
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Insulin
On the box of my Metformin it says to have the pill with or after food. I think it was the same for the Gliclazide. I think it is better if you have your pills just after you have breakfast.
 

xyzzy

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GOM said:
So I decided to delay breakfast by 1 hour an went to the shops. Felt great then suddenly felt very odd and the legs gave way

Taking glic on an empty stomach could certainly cause the effect you got. A hypo condition is not only determined by blood sugar levels but just as importantly if your sugars are falling rapidly so taking glic and then not eating could certainly cause what happened. The moral of the story is to eat something with your medication! Think about what could have happened if you had decided to drive to the shops, you got away quite lightly imo.

daisy3174 said:
Type 2,s can Hypo even without medication.

Yes that may well be true but so can non diabetics. Being a Type 2 diabetic does not cause hypos. Hypos are caused by the medication you take or the insulin you inject. A Type 2 on no medication or just Metformin is no more likely to hypo than a non diabetic. It's the reason you do not have to report that you are a diabetic to the DVLA in those cases.
 

fionahey

Newbie
Messages
2
I am fairly newly diagnosed type 2 four months ago. I had a fright about 3 hours after eating dinner where I collapsed, though not passing out I couldn't speak or move. Is this a hypo? My doctor said he didn't know as he wasn't there. Also I noticed if my blood sugar level is less than 6 I feel ill. It has gone from 10+ to 8 and my doctor says it should be 6. I am very confused.
 

xyzzy

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fionahey said:
I am fairly newly diagnosed type 2 four months ago. I had a fright about 3 hours after eating dinner where I collapsed, though not passing out I couldn't speak or move. Is this a hypo? My doctor said he didn't know as he wasn't there. Also I noticed if my blood sugar level is less than 6 I feel ill. It has gone from 10+ to 8 and my doctor says it should be 6. I am very confused.

Hi Fiona

An average non diabetics sugar level is between 3.8 and 5 so your doctor is right to try and get you to lower yours to around 6.

The symptoms you describe as feeling ill are quite common for people whose bodies have got use to running at high sugar levels. They will gradually subside within a short time as you reduce your levels. They can certainly make you feel ill but you are running risks with your eyesight, loosing your limbs and a lot of other nasty complications if you run your sugars at high levels. The recommended and generally accepted safe levels are under 7 but are allowed to rise a bit to 7.8 at two hours after eating. That 7.8 level is where research has shown all those nasty effects can start from. I'm afraid those risks of complications are real and do happen frequently so I would try and take your doctors advice.

A rapid fall in blood sugar levels can cause the collapse you said you had especially if you are on some of the more powerful diabetic drugs (not just Metformin). Given that you are running your sugar levels high it is more likely you suffered what's known as a false hypo rather than a real one. False hypos occur mostly in people who run high blood sugars when their sugars fall quickly for whatever reason and again the way to sort the problem out is to try and get your sugars down permanently into a safe range.

Unless you are on very powerful diabetic drugs (not just Metformin) then you have no more chance of having a real hypo than a non diabetic person. Diabetes does not cause hypos only the powerful drugs or insulin used to treat it can do that in the vast majority of people.

The best way of getting your sugars back into a safe range is to adopt a good diet. Cut out eating or drastically reduce anything with plain sugar in it, cakes, biscuits, pure fruit juices etc. Next significantly cut down of starchy foods like rice, pasta, potatoes, bread, cereals and anything else made with flour. Replace with extra meat, eggs, cheese and especially vegetables. Change those starchy foods you have left to brown rice, brown or tri color pasta and wholemeal bread.

If you want more advice just keep asking questions. Lots of forum members started in the same way as you are now and have successfully controlled their sugar levels and made themselves safe.
 

Ali H

Well-Known Member
Messages
790
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Insulin
Was always told to take gliclazide 20 to 30 mins before food, metformin in the middle of the meal. You want the glic to start the insulin production in time for the food rather than much later to stop peaks. But you must of course eat, not go out on an empty stomach with glic in your system! Taking it with food inhibits its efficacy apparently.

Ali
 

hunnybunwales

Newbie
Messages
1
xyzzy said:
fionahey said:
I am fairly newly diagnosed type 2 four months ago. I had a fright about 3 hours after eating dinner where I collapsed, though not passing out I couldn't speak or move. Is this a hypo? My doctor said he didn't know as he wasn't there. Also I noticed if my blood sugar level is less than 6 I feel ill. It has gone from 10+ to 8 and my doctor says it should be 6. I am very confused.
Hi Fiona
Yes it was probably a hypo you had. I know when I was 1st diagnosed last year, I was told I had probably been diabetic for a while. My readings at fasting were 18+. I threw myself into healthy eating & losing weight & my sugar levels fell dramatically like yourself to 7s & 6s, but started getting light headed feeling sluggish, almost intoxicated. Although 6 isnt low as a normal reading, it is if you have sustained a high reading for a substantial length of time, so fools your body into a hypo. This will settle as your body becomes used to lower readings. So much so that I now know without testing if my sugar has gone up by how i feel. Good luck with everything
Hi Fiona

An average non diabetics sugar level is between 3.8 and 5 so your doctor is right to try and get you to lower yours to around 6.

The symptoms you describe as feeling ill are quite common for people whose bodies have got use to running at high sugar levels. They will gradually subside within a short time as you reduce your levels. They can certainly make you feel ill but you are running risks with your eyesight, loosing your limbs and a lot of other nasty complications if you run your sugars at high levels. The recommended and generally accepted safe levels are under 7 but are allowed to rise a bit to 7.8 at two hours after eating. That 7.8 level is where research has shown all those nasty effects can start from. I'm afraid those risks of complications are real and do happen frequently so I would try and take your doctors advice.

A rapid fall in blood sugar levels can cause the collapse you said you had especially if you are on some of the more powerful diabetic drugs (not just Metformin). Given that you are running your sugar levels high it is more likely you suffered what's known as a false hypo rather than a real one. False hypos occur mostly in people who run high blood sugars when their sugars fall quickly for whatever reason and again the way to sort the problem out is to try and get your sugars down permanently into a safe range.

Unless you are on very powerful diabetic drugs (not just Metformin) then you have no more chance of having a real hypo than a non diabetic person. Diabetes does not cause hypos only the powerful drugs or insulin used to treat it can do that in the vast majority of people.

The best way of getting your sugars back into a safe range is to adopt a good diet. Cut out eating or drastically reduce anything with plain sugar in it, cakes, biscuits, pure fruit juices etc. Next significantly cut down of starchy foods like rice, pasta, potatoes, bread, cereals and anything else made with flour. Replace with extra meat, eggs, cheese and especially vegetables. Change those starchy foods you have left to brown rice, brown or tri color pasta and wholemeal bread.

If you want more advice just keep asking questions. Lots of forum members started in the same way as you are now and have successfully controlled their sugar levels and made themselves safe.
 

fionahey

Newbie
Messages
2
Thank you both for your replies which are helpful. I am on 4 metformin glucophage sr 500mg per day. I am also suffering bunions and vitamin D deficiency for which I know have tablets. Just to let you know my stomach problems have been less since taking the chalky vit D tablets and I have a bit more energy. I dont know if the conditions are related so it would be interesting to see if others also have these combined conditions.
thanks again for the chat and helpful advice.
 

hanadr

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It's rare for Metformin to cause hypos, but Gliclazide does it easily.
Hana
 

anna29

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Hi All.
Yep - glic 'CAN' cause hypo's ... I suffered 2 [one in halfords] both times I hadn't eaten enough to cover the effectiveness
of the drug !
I quickly learnt to eat enough to cover the action of gliclazide.
Having said this it FAILED to reduce my blood sugar levels generally, ended up on animal insulin to successfully reduce my
constant high blood sugar levels.
Anna.x :)