Cardiac Calcium Scoring

[janabelle]

Hi,
I'd been attending a cardiac clinic as I'd been experiencing palpitations on & off for about 5 years. As I have a family history of heart disease and been type-1 for nearly 22 yrs, the cardiologist referred me for a Calcium Scoring CT scan a couple of months ago.
I was really expecting bad news and honestly amazed when I got the results today, which showed my score to be 0%. The doctor told me this is really good news and my risk of having a heart attack in the next 5 yrs is as no higher than any normal non-diabetic person! I think the doctor was surprised too!
There seems to be no obvious reason for these troublesome palpitations, but as they only started while I was on Lantus, I suspect it to be the cause- I was on it for 4 years and have since heard of many people suffering fast or irregular heartbeat while on it. Despite that, I'm relieved & thrilled with the news I had today, but unfortunately still bugged by the problem, which on days when the palpitations are frequent can make me feel pretty lousy.
Good day all in all though!
Any others had this test? I'd be interested to hear any of your views on the subject.
Jus
I hope this gives u newly diagnosed people some positive hope that it's not all doom & gloom- my BG control has not been perfectly controlled over the years, that's for sure! We can only do our best.

 

[mrburden]

Hi,
I've been diabetic for 33 years now and I had a cardiac catheter examination recently to see whether I had any calcification in the main arteries to the heart. I too expected to hear that I had problems, as I do have calcified arteries in my legs and high cholesterol levels. But, just like you, I'm all clear!
I put hte results down to healthy eating and not drinking or smoking.
Nice to get a bit of good news here and there, isn't it?

 

[janabelle]

That's great Mrburden!
I've never heard of that test, sounds quite invasive-was it uncomfortable? I was so surprised with my results, but can't put it down to living as healthy as you have! With diabetes, we all think doom and gloom, so it's a "phew" moment to have a bit of good news- we certainly deserve it!
keep up the good work
Jus

 

[Hobs]

Your scan was a non invasive form of angiogram via a CT scan (computer tomography) and it detects any calcium deposits that are starting to form on existing plaque (hard fats). It is not universally available so I think you are lucky to have been offered it instead of the usual NHS invasive procedure.
Does your heart flutter start at night or can it strike at any time? Also does it only start during a high BG reading?
I ask as my AF is greatly affected if a hiccup causes my BG to go above 9.5 usually after a liver dump or a heavy early strike of the dawn phenomenon.

 

[janabelle]

Hi Hobs,
My cardiologist told me the test I had has only become available on the NHS within the last year, and I'm very grateful it wasn't invasive.
With regard to the irregular / ectopic heart beats I experience. I've had a couple of 7-day ECGs over the past few years and they have shown them to be quite frequent but with no pattern. It doesn't seem to relate to rises or falls in my BG levels which are usually stable. I can feel pretty grotty when I've got a bad day of them, and the doc has offered me beta-blockers if I want them, which I don't at the moment.
I am convinced it's caused by Lantus; whether it's damage done by the drug itself or a mechanical prob caused by the lousy control I suffered on it for over 4 years, I don't know.
I'd be interested to know more about what your palpitations feel like, is it in your chest, or do you get a catching sensation in your throat? Do they make you feel unwell/tired?
Jus

 

[Hobs]

I'd be interested to know more about what your palpitations feel like, is it in your chest, or do you get a catching sensation in your throat? Do they make you feel unwell/tired?
Jus

I am very lucky in that most of my cardiac problems lessened when I started injecting Victoza.
I'd usually get a hint that I would experience the AF during the night by a rise in heart rate form my usual very slow 50 to 55 bpm and it could go as high as 85 to 90 by the time I hit bed. I would then struggle to fall asleep and would wake up between 02:30 and 3 with a sort of tingle going across my chest from shoulder to shoulder just under my neck. By the time I was fully awake and sitting up my heart rate would go above 100 bpm and the beats would become irregular with skips as much as 3 beats long and frequent rapid doubles. Body strength became barely enough for me to rise and make it into the sitting room and my comfortable chair. A finger test would usually show a 9.5 or higher despite a 6 or 6.5 when going to bed. The feeling across my chest would usually worsen and in a short time would also affect my breathing. Sometimes this would get worse and affect the ventricles giving me cold extremities at which stage my wife would summon help and a short sharp shock would be needed to put me back into sinus rhythm and eventually back home I would come. If the AF kept going for a prolonged period I would resort to a large neat scotch and that would block the erroneous signals and all would be well.
The Victoza, as well as giving me far better BG control, also increased my abnormal low heart rate and lowered a persistent systolic hypertension (diastolic normal) to the point that I can now safely take the beta blocker Sotalol and to some extent control the AF. My BP before Victoza used to struggle (even with drugs) around 145-155 over 75 and now its usually about 120/65 with a resting heart rate of 70.

AF runs in my family and the only real cure is Atrial Ablation, but occasionally that can cause more problems than it cures. Also my cousin died during the procedure and my mother died shortly after (but she was 82), so I'm very reluctant to undergo it myself. If the Victoza had not given me such advantageous side effects, my cardiologist was considering implanting a small automatic defibrillator in my chest as an alternative to the ablation. Also since Victoza my appointments in cardiology have been decreased and after my next on Nov 3 I'm hoping I will just get an annual check over as mooted.

 

[janabelle]

Hi Hobs,
Thanks for your reply. You've been through the mill with your heart problems, great that Victoza has helped you and long may it continue
I can see why my cardiologist has been quite laid back with me and told me not to worry, my problems are minor in comparison to yours.
I was taken to hospital about 3 times during my time on Lantus, with chest pain and unexplained episodes of rapid heart -rate,once I was woken with it being 140bpm, and my husband called an ambulance. I couldn't get any control of my BGs on Lantus, up to 15mmol/l most days, sometimes higher, and hypos every day, diabetes consultant told me my control was fine as my Hba1c was within the normal range! I've been type-1 since 1989, so I didn't swallow that nonsense.:evil: Maybe the high BG levels are to blame, though I don't have that problem now , I am left with these troublesome ectopic heart beats that started when I was on Lantus.
I'm going to try and get on with my life and try not to worry about it.
Very best of luck with your appointment in November Hobs, and thanks for sharing your experience.
Wishing you well
Jus x

 

[Hobs]

Hi Hobs,
Thanks for your reply. You've been through the mill with your heart problems, great that Victoza has helped you and long may it continue

I should have added that it is not just cardiac and BG that Victoza has helped me with. I used to suffer very bad headaches and took Pizotifen to help with partial control, also an SSRI for getting thoroughly pis*ed off with everything and life in general. Victoza has removed ALL degrees of bad heads and lifted not only my moods but also my outlook on life. What ever Victoza is made from, my body must have been short of those chemicals for years. Oh yes, and I have also thrown all the sleeping pills away ... its just a pity it can't overcome arthritis :wink:

I hope that the specialists can get to the bottom of your heart problem and also something more suitable that Lantus is found that will give you good control with out inducing other problems .. good luck with your particular struggle :!:

 

[janabelle]

Hi Hobs
Thanks for that, though I should have mentioned I ditched Lantus 2 1/2 years ago, and changed to Porcine Insulin. Felt better immediately,and it's enabled me to gain the best control of my diabetes that I've had on any insulin treatment.
Great that we've both found a treatment that's improved our lives
Jus

 

[mrburden]

That's great Mrburden!
I've never heard of that test, sounds quite invasive-was it uncomfortable? I was so surprised with my results, but can't put it down to living as healthy as you have! With diabetes, we all think doom and gloom, so it's a "phew" moment to have a bit of good news- we certainly deserve it!
keep up the good work
Jus

Hi,
Sorry for the delay in replying.
The test sounds far worse when I describe it than it really was! It did involve an overnight stay in the cardiac unit but only as a precaution. It's done under local anasthetic so the diabetes doesn't suffer at all. They made a really tiny cut into the artery on my right wrist, fed a minute hollow "wire" through it and up to my heart, then put a dye through the wire. They (and the patient) can see where the dye spreads via an x-ray screen. They move the wire to the entrance of each heart chamber to get an overall picture of how clear the blood vessels are. When they've finished they put a wristband on the cut and pump it up, then over about an hour or so, they let it down slowly and that's that. The proceedure took about 20 minutes and I never felt anything apart from a bit of pressure on my wrist.
They did the test to decide whether I was fit enough to be considered for a kidney & pancreas transplant. The test proved that I am fit enough...but since then my kidney outputs have improved so now I don't need to be on the transplant list!!
Hope all's still good,
Mark

 

[janabelle]

That's excellent news Mrburden!
I can only imagine how relieved you must be feeling about your kidney function, here's hoping it continues!
You may have heard already about the Warwick university study on Thiamin (vitamin B1) in Diabetes, if not this link might interest you. http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/newsandevents ... /thiamine/
all the best
Jus

 

[Gjimmy]

I used to use the liquid poison called Lantus. But now take the porcine insulin.
I've been struggling to find out why Lantus is so destructive to the body and have had only partial success. The fact that it has a 600% affinity to the IGF-1 receptor could be the biggest probable cause. Many independent scientist claim any level above 100% is unacceptable.
I don't understand the link between the various different kinds of cell damage throughout the body and the IGF-1 receptor issue.

Many of the people with heart problems, eg Lone AF, who take Lantus claim that it could be the Lantus causing the problem. I think it is unlikely to be just the Lantus. It's probably a combination of the Lantus breaking down the cellular integrity combined with bad blood sugar control.

The cause of the heart flutter in many diabetics could be damage to the vagus nerve which controls a number of endocrine systems throughout the body including the heart and stomach.
The vagus nerve would be damaged over many years of bad blood sugar control possibly being enhanced by the Lantus.
Speaking for myself when I was on Lantus , I suffered from a condition known as the "Dawn Phenomenon" This is where the Liver dumps sugar into the body in the early hours of the morning.
Now that I am on the animal insulin I no longer suffer from this early morning problem. This could point to the Analogue insulins such as Lantus creating an almost brittle liver control mechanism in the body.
Other damage caused by the Lantus and poor BG levels in my case is retinopathy.
I won't bother going into the other damage that the Lantus has caused on this post, suffice to say it is extensive and permanent.
The symptoms from the damage caused by Lantus seemed to take about 3 years to develop.
Of course I could be completely wrong and my bad health is a complete coincidence. But pigs might also fly and I don't think they do.

 

[janabelle]

Hi Gjimmy
"Other damage caused by the Lantus and poor BG levels in my case is retinopathy.
I won't bother going into the other damage that the Lantus has caused on this post, suffice to say it is extensive and permanent."
You'd be doing the forum a huge service if you posted about your experience on Lantus, especially for patients who haven't yet made the link.

I've heard about a possible association between Lantus & retinopathy, though whether this is simply down to poor BG control is unknown, time will tell. I know people who've suffered side-effects on Lantus, but reluctant to change as their BG control is so good on it :? .

I've said it before and I'll say it again; I'm convinced Sanofi Aventis are well aware that there are problems & dangers with Lantus, and probably have done since day-1. It's their biggest-selling product, and until they produce a similary lucrative alternative, i'm sure they've no qualms about keeping the truth from unwitting patients. :evil:

Hope things are better for you on Porcine insulin, despite the damage done by Lantus, which I can totally relate to; I have other things going on/feelings that I didn't have before I went on it, and I live in hope that these will fade as time goes on- or are those pigs taking flight again
Jus

 

[Digglesthedog]

I'm a 42 year old insulin-dependent diabetic in Australia who has been well-controlled for 25 years - in the last 3 years since going onto Lantus I've developed severe retinopathy problems (I have both forms) whereas all eye checks beforehand showed no problems at all. I have no cholesterol problems, have maintained an active lifestyle etc but have just been dumbfounded at the appearance of the retinopathy, for which I have had extensive laser treatment (and have been informed that I can't have any more). The only reason I even knew I had retinopathy was that an opthalmologist suggested I see a specialist because she thought I had what she called 'minor sun damage' to my eyes, *I always wear sunglasses and don't go out in the sun a lot!*, which puzzled me so I went to the specialist who pronounced "I would go blind", which left me devastated and confused. I sought a second opinion and was able to find a specialist who dealt with the growth of the blood cells in my eyes by aforementioned laser treatment. Given Lantus' links to cancer (ie producing abnormal cells) that have been mentioned here and in other places I've been looking around the web is there any hard data/lab tests that don't follow the usual company line and show a link to retinopathy? I've only had bleeds in my eyes post laser treatment, incidentally, ie I had no visual problems prior to laser and would not have known I had any eye trouble, despite eye tests each year etc.

May I also ask what is the accepted HBA1c level for development of retinopathy? Is there actually such a thing as an agreed consensus on the matter? I only ask, as my brother who is 20 years my senior has the same sugar levels and has no retinopathy and is not on Lantus. Also, where are websites that show tests linking Lantus to cancer in tests? Any help would be greatly appreciated as my life has been really messed up.

 

[Digglesthedog]

sorry I also forgot to ask how is it humanly possible for anyone to have porcine insulin? I have been told it is not available/not being manufactured anymore? I would love to go back on it if possible!