Could someone have a naturally higher blood sugar level?

[Buxtonstill]

Diagnosed a few years ago, and given metforminn 500 X 3. Off the rails? I never went on them. The only change I made was to give up smoking. Have basically eaten anything I wanted. I am seriously overweight and have decided to turn my life around before it's too late.
I have been doing the Atkins type diet, with no more than 30g or so of carbs a day. Eating salad and veg to make up the carb quotient.

The lowest I can get my blood sugar is around 11.5 which I know from these boards is way too high. It seems to be lowering by .1 a day. Will it take a long time for it to climb back down to normal levels, given that I have been eating willy nilly for a number of years? I thought the drop in blood sugar would be pretty quick, seeing as I am having very little carbs.

 

[Buxtonstill]

The last two days, I have been doing hourly blood readings.. The highest has been 15, yesterday.the lowest 11.1. Would it make a difference if I doubled my metforminn dose?. The next appointment free at my local diabetic clinic is 11 March.

 

[Brunneria]

Hi and welcome!

How long have you been Atkinsing?
- 2 week induction, or longer?
And how much meat/fish/eggs/cheese (protein foods) are you having?
Also, are you eating those atkins bars, shakes and stuff?

 

[Buxtonstill]

Thank you for replying. Just following atkins basic rules. Eating only meat fish eggs and cheese for protein, and the salad and permitted veg. Having no manufactured foods, with the exception of pork scratchings, which are very low carb. No bread potatoes pasta . Counting carbs and having no more than 30ish a day. Have been doing it for a week -10 days.

 

[Brunneria]

You may find that it takes a few weeks for your blood glucose to drift slowly downwards, or it may go down in steps. Some people get a drop in 2 days, others take 3 or more weeks.

The general rule is that if your bg rises by more than 2mmol/l at 2 hrs after eating, then there were too many carbs in the meal.
But if you are eating protein three or more times a day (as per atkins) then that 'rule' may not apply. There are a couple of reasons.
Firstly, it takes longer than 2 hours for protein to be digested. With me, i tend to peak at 2.5 hrs, because i very low carb.
Also, you may be breaking the unnecessary extra protein down into glucose (called gluconeogenesis).

Actually, i wouldn't worry about it too much at this point.

Your first post implied (apologies if i have misinterpreted) that your bg may have been high for a while before diagnosis?
If that is the case, then bringing your numbers down in a controlled drift is kinder on the body than the short sharp shock treatment.

You are clearly on the right track.

 

[Buxtonstill]

Thanks. Yes, my blood sugars were shocking before. It wasn't that I was in denial as such, more that I told myself that it wasn't making me feel ill, and my eye X-rays were fine then I need ent worry. I'm just impatient at my bloods taking so long to go down. You mentioned the Atkins shakes, are they very bad then? I picked up a couple in my shopping to use a couple of times next week when I literally have to eat on the run. The label says they are low carb on the nutrional information.

 

[Brunneria]

The shakes are definitely low carb, and lots of people happily use them. Same with the bars.
My experience (purely personal) is that they are so full of artificial sweeteners, flavourings and rubbish, that they don't deserve the title 'food'.

However, some people are using them for fast weightloss on the 800 cal a day diet, so they would clearly disagree.


We have also had a couple of people (a long while back) say that they found the bars block weightloss, but again, those are just personal viewpoints.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

Your situation is exactly why we need to do a better job, as a forum, of explaining the value of a LCHF diet.

The general mindset is "Carbohydrates spike your blood sugar so it makes sense to avoid them altogether right?" That's similar to burning your hand on a hot stove and consequently deciding never to cook again. It's taking a short-term cause/effect and assuming it automatically applies long-term. Science tells us that it doesn't.

A LCHF diet has a lot of benefits, and I'm low-carb'er myself. However, science tells us that long-term it's no more effective at reducing a1c levels for people with type 2 diabetes than a diet low in fat and high in carbs. That statement just made a lot of people angry so I'll explain it:

1.) It's a great gauge of how poor your old diet was- If all you ate was pizza, hamburgers, candy, and soda each day you're probably going to see a MASSIVE short-term drop in your daily blood glucose readings. However, if you ate very healthy before, you're probably not going to see very significant immediate results.

2.) Eventually, you get a better idea of how much insulin resistance you actually have- this addresses your question about how long it will take to lower your glucose readings to "normal." It could take a month, a year, or it may never happen without additional medication. It's different for each person and it's why some people can avoid medication with a LCHF diet, and why other people with Type 2 NEED insulin to survive.

In the Long-term:
-It's helping you to lose body fat which reduces insulin resistance in most obese patients with T2. However, that could be achieved with alternative weight loss diets.
-Many people find it easier to follow. A diet only works if you're able to follow it and sustain it. While most of us find that a LCHF diet is easy to follow others find it incredibly difficult to severely restrict their carb intake. Either way, that's subjective and each person is different.
-It can help to reduce medication. A recent study showed that people on a LCHF diet required significantly less medication than people on a HCLF (high carb/low fat) diet. Note: the two groups had nearly the same average a1c levels. Again, this is subjective and some people do not mind taking medication if it means being able to still consume carbohydrates.


Conclusion: it sounds like you're doing many of the right things, but it's unrealistic to expect everything to change overnight. It also sounds like you're seeing very steady (and significant) results. Don't get discouraged if/when your progress begins to slow. Whether it be blood sugar levels or weight loss, we've all had to overcome plateaus in reaching our goals.

 

[AndBreathe]

Your situation is exactly why we need to do a better job, as a forum, of explaining the value of a LCHF diet.

The general mindset is "Carbohydrates spike your blood sugar so it makes sense to avoid them altogether right?" That's similar to burning your hand on a hot stove and consequently deciding never to cook again. It's taking a short-term cause/effect and assuming it automatically applies long-term. Science tells us that it doesn't.

A LCHF diet has a lot of benefits, and I'm low-carb'er myself. However, science tells us that long-term it's no more effective at reducing a1c levels for people with type 2 diabetes than a diet low in fat and high in carbs. That statement just made a lot of people angry so I'll explain it:

1.) It's a great gauge of how poor your old diet was- If all you ate was pizza, hamburgers, candy, and soda each day you're probably going to see a MASSIVE short-term drop in your daily blood glucose readings. However, if you ate very healthy before, you're probably not going to see very significant immediate results.

2.) Eventually, you get a better idea of how much insulin resistance you actually have- this addresses your question about how long it will take to lower your glucose readings to "normal." It could take a month, a year, or it may never happen without additional medication. It's different for each person and it's why some people can avoid medication with a LCHF diet, and why other people with Type 2 NEED insulin to survive.

In the Long-term:
-It's helping you to lose body fat which reduces insulin resistance in most obese patients with T2. However, that could be achieved with alternative weight loss diets.
-Many people find it easier to follow. A diet only works if you're able to follow it and sustain it. While most of us find that a LCHF diet is easy to follow others find it incredibly difficult to severely restrict their carb intake. Either way, that's subjective and each person is different.
-It can help to reduce medication. A recent study showed that people on a LCHF diet required significantly less medication than people on a HCLF (high carb/low fat) diet. Note: the two groups had nearly the same average a1c levels. Again, this is subjective and some people do not mind taking medication if it means being able to still consume carbohydrates.


Conclusion: it sounds like you're doing many of the right things, but it's unrealistic to expect everything to change overnight. It also sounds like you're seeing very steady (and significant) results. Don't get discouraged if/when your progress begins to slow. Whether it be blood sugar levels or weight loss, we've all had to overcome plateaus in reaching our goals.

Personally, I don't believe it is this forums duty to better explain LCHF. I believe this forum is in place to provide support for those impacted by diabetes, and where appropriate, help those struggling explore better management options, whether that is self-management, utilising any particular diet or by a pharmaceuticals based regime.

We're not at the same, which doesn't mean to say that a way of eating with a reduced carbohydrate content doesn't help the vast majority of diabetics. It is my belief it does, but for some people, whether it be T1s who achieve excellent control, whilst eating an almost "normal" diet or for those starting out, it is important they have a vision of the options available to them, with pointers to a better future. One size doesn't fit all for diet, any more than my evangelistic all approach to remaining meds-free is appropriate to everyone either.

As someone who surely deals in risk (albeit of a different nature) every day of his professional life, you must accept that different people set their "risk dials" to different comfort levels, dependent on their attitude to risk in general, age, overall lifestyle and to an extent how deep their pockets are. If there was one way only none of us would need to be here and we could all just view a handful of YouTube videos on diagnosis for the true way forward.

Clearly there are instances where we may become frustrated by others' life choices, but they are just that, their choices.

Sorry to derail the thread a bit @Buxtonstill .

As @Brunneria suggests, if your levels have been running rich for some time, our body's regulatory system will be trying to utilise all it can to maintain the comfort zone you have been in. Over time it should improve, provided you do keep up the decent dietary and lifestyle changes you appear to have made.

This is a marathon, not a sprint.

 

[TorqPenderloin]

@AndBreathe, I read your post several times and still have no idea what your point is. The best I can tell, you're arguing exactly the same thing I am: people deserve to be aware of their options and we should stop blindly recommending individual treatment options to new members. What works for me won't necessarily work for other people.

I chose to speak up because in this case, I believe the forum as a whole has created unrealistic expectations for what a LCHF diet offers. When I say that we should do a better job of explaining an LCHF diet, it is to say that we should explain it is ONE possible approach, but it certainly isn't the ONLY possible approach.

 

[Stallen]

@Buxtonstill you will have to use up the stores of glucose that you will have previously amassed eating high carbs, it took me a month and a half to get down to reasonable BG numbers, started off at 22-35 when I dropped all my Medication after a month I was at 13-15 then it went down to 8s after around 2 months in I was in the 5-7 range, other than when I've picked up a cold it's been pretty stable.

It can be done, you just need to stick to it, even when it looks like nothing is happening your body will be busy using it's glucose reserves up.

 

[DaveNN]

That's very true Buxton. Others ate loads of pasta, bread, fruit juice, curries etc and still came down with DB. That said Torq also made some very valid points, regardless from whom they came. To answer your initial question, of course someone can have a naturally high blood sugar levels, usually caused by a combination of lifestyle, stress levels, levels of obesity etc. ...and this naturally high blood sugar level could be slowly destroying you...the silent killer it is.
the problem with the Atkins diet ( I did it ten years back) is that it is incredibly boring. BUT if you're going to low carb, then REALLY go for it.
Pls also consider that, as noted above, your body is breaking down fats and proteins in order to provide the additional energy required...which your body is struggling to regulate due to a potential issue with your endocrine system.
I would advocate trying the pukka or modified Newcastle Diet....it may just work.
One thing, elevated blood sugar can also effect ones mood....just saying ;-)

 

[Shar67]

Personally, I don't believe it is this forums duty to better explain LCHF. I believe this forum is in place to provide support for those impacted by diabetes, and where appropriate, help those struggling explore better management options, whether that is self-management, utilising any particular diet or by a pharmaceuticals based regime.

We're not at the same, which doesn't mean to say that a way of eating with a reduced carbohydrate content doesn't help the vast majority of diabetics. It is my belief it does, but for some people, whether it be T1s who achieve excellent control, whilst eating an almost "normal" diet or for those starting out, it is important they have a vision of the options available to them, with pointers to a better future. One size doesn't fit all for diet, any more than my evangelistic all approach to remaining meds-free is appropriate to everyone either.

As someone who surely deals in risk (albeit of a different nature) every day of his professional life, you must accept that different people set their "risk dials" to different comfort levels, dependent on their attitude to risk in general, age, overall lifestyle and to an extent how deep their pockets are. If there was one way only none of us would need to be here and we could all just view a handful of YouTube videos on diagnosis for the true way forward.

Clearly there are instances where we may become frustrated by others' life choices, but they are just that, their choices.

Sorry to derail the thread a bit @Buxtonstill .

As @Brunneria suggests, if your levels have been running rich for some time, our body's regulatory system will be trying to utilise all it can to maintain the comfort zone you have been in. Over time it should improve, provided you do keep up the decent dietary and lifestyle changes you appear to have made.

This is a marathon, not a sprint.

Hit funny button should have been agree

 

[viktoria]

Diagnosed a few years ago, and given metforminn 500 X 3. Off the rails? I never went on them. The only change I made was to give up smoking. Have basically eaten anything I wanted. I am seriously overweight and have decided to turn my life around before it's too late.
I have been doing the Atkins type diet, with no more than 30g or so of carbs a day. Eating salad and veg to make up the carb quotient.

The lowest I can get my blood sugar is around 11.5 which I know from these boards is way too high. It seems to be lowering by .1 a day. Will it take a long time for it to climb back down to normal levels, given that I have been eating willy nilly for a number of years? I thought the drop in blood sugar would be pretty quick, seeing as I am having very little carbs.

Hi, I've been very low carving for 5 weeks now and m bg still run high. I don't eat bread, pasta, rice, root veg, sugar ,fruit, milk. I was an avid baker but have learnt to be without , as have my family, be without cakes, pastries etc. I have always been overweight, I now need to loose 6 stone but have only manage to loose 8 lbs. I am fairly immobile as I have been for past year after shockingly having a stroke age 47. Need to lower bg and loose weight but whatever I try its doesn't seem to work. I will stick to low carb. Currently less than 20g a day.

 

[viktoria]

Hi, I've been very low carving for 5 weeks now and m bg still run high. I don't eat bread, pasta, rice, root veg, sugar ,fruit, milk. I was an avid baker but have learnt to be without , as have my family, be without cakes, pastries etc. I have always been overweight, I now need to loose 6 stone but have only manage to loose 8 lbs. I am fairly immobile as I have been for past year after shockingly having a stroke age 47. Need to lower bg and loose weight but whatever I try its doesn't seem to work. I will stick to low carb. Currently less than 20g a day.

Ps. Sorry, I am type 1

 

[tim2000s]

Hi @viktoria, sorry to hear about your stroke. I hope you are on your way to mending.

What's your total Calorific intake per day and how much insulin are you using? Many of us who have lost weight eating low carb have had to run a calorie deficit in order to lose weight. In addition, if you are immobile, it's likely you will also be using a higher insulin dose.

Are you using a Basal/Bolus regime and if so have you checked your insulin levels and confirmed they are correct (e.g. Basal Tested https://mysugr.com/basal-rate-testing/ and understand you Insulin Carb ratios http://www.bdec-e-learning.com/).

How immobile are you? Would you, for example, be able to use hand weights or something similar to do a low level of exercise while seated? This would also help with insulin sensitivity.

Feel free to ask questions as much as you like!

 

[viktoria]

Hi @viktoria, sorry to hear about your stroke. I hope you are on your way to mending.

What's your total Calorific intake per day and how much insulin are you using? Many of us who have lost weight eating low carb have had to run a calorie deficit in order to lose weight. In addition, if you are immobile, it's likely you will also be using a higher insulin dose.

Are you using a Basal/Bolus regime and if so have you checked your insulin levels and confirmed they are correct (e.g. Basal Tested https://mysugr.com/basal-rate-testing/ and understand you Insulin Carb ratios http://www.bdec-e-learning.com/).

How immobile are you? Would you, for example, be able to use hand weights or something similar to do a low level of exercise while seated? This would also help with insulin sensitivity.

Feel free to ask questions as much as you like!

Hi Tim 2000s,
I am bolus basal and I take 10 units novo rapid and 30 units lantus at the mo. I have managed to reduce this since low carving from 16 and 40 units. I have a calorie intake of about 900 to 1200 per day which I get from protein veg eggs meat salad etc. I can walk short distances about 100 meters with a stick, slightly less without! I have to use stairs at home. Thank you for the suggestion of weights, we have some in the attic I think! I will definitely give that a try and will also look at the links you posted. I am constantly scouring the internet for information about lchf, diabetes and why the stroke could have happened.many thanks.