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Fasting with LCHF diet?

Discussion in 'Fasting' started by Debmcgee, Dec 31, 2015.

  1. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Hi guys

    I've not had much time lately to properly look into this but I've read somewhere that fasting and doing LCHF is a great way to reduce BG and I believe lose weight. I want to do both, so have any of you had any experience or advice to share with this method?

    I used to do 5:2 diet and managed ok on it before my diagnosis but not sure how to do it properly as a low carber if that makes sense?!

    Thanks in advance
    D xx
     
  2. TorqPenderloin

    TorqPenderloin Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Depends what is important to you. Some people say fasting is great for diabetes (and to an extent I agree).

    However, fasting is terrible for (healthy) weight loss as there is a strong potential to lose significant muscle mass. Combining that with a low carb diet may further magnify the situation if you maintain a protein deficiency throughout the day.
     
  3. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Again not read enough but I think fasting for 18 hours isn't enough to lose muscle...but seeing as I've got nothing but flab I want to gain muscle, not lose it :)
     
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  4. Protea

    Protea Type 2 · Member

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    LCHF should not mean low protean. My breakfast this morning was 2eggs, 3 pieces of bacon,
    1 small thin round of seeded pure rye bread followed by a bowl of double cream plain yogurt
    with more cream added. All high quality products from market, German butchery and bakery,
    and Woolworths. (Our equivalent of M&S.) Try to miss out out on high carb products. Drink
    a lot of water. No commercial fruit juice - squeezed limes and oranges. No cereals.

    70 day average blood glucose in the morning is 7.4. Not too bad for a T2.
    Main problem is the temperature which is now at 30 deg C. Heat exhaustion or heat stroke is
    a real danger.

    Over the years my GI has remained much the same with the exceptions of visits to UK when it
    can rocket up. Slight weight loss but I have never been more then a little overweight and I don't
    want to become under weight. Should I have a GI lower then 7.4 ? Have never had medication
    and don't want to start.
    Bye for now. May the force be with you !!
     
  5. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    What's a GI of 7.4? If that's your morning fasting bg then I'd say it's too high. When I low carb my bg rarely goes above 6 - even an hour after food, so 7.4 seems a bit high for me.

    I definitely eat a lot less on low carb. It's so much more satisfying!! X
     
  6. TorqPenderloin

    TorqPenderloin Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    It's a widely debated topic and unfortunately there isn't a definitive answer.

    However, it's difficult to see how you could remain in an anabolic (versus catabolic) state after going 18 hrs without any sort of protein consumption.
     
  7. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

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    Hi @Debmcgee

    I fast intermittently!
    I have also fasted for about 36 hours, but that is too much for someone who is new to fasting.
    I once had a fasting test that lasted 80 hours in hospital.

    I am on an intermittent fast today, I have yet to have anything to eat today and water and black tea to drink. I will not eat till I have my tea today around about 6pm.
    I only fast once a week, when not working.

    You can also start a fast at midday if you want to and then break fast when you wake the next morning.

    The reason I do it is because it gives me and my endocrine system a rest from constantly eating so many meals a day. It is also a good way to keep me in ketosis. So it saves a problem, not to eat and it does help you lose weight.

    Always, keep a track of your blood glucose levels, to see if you can fast. Or you feel awful doing it. Always start slowly and I wouldn't do really strenuous exercise or work if fasting.

    Doing a 5:2 diet is just as good if you are comfortable, but always low carb and drink enough water to keep you hydrated and if need be add salt to water if you are hot.

    Always, have full fat when eating your first meal after fasting.
     
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  8. britishpub

    britishpub Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I have started Fasting once a week or so recently.

    It has helped restart a slow weight loss that had stalled, although I am now only a few Llbs away from my target.

    I usually go from evening meal to evening meal, and usually choose a day when I'm not hungry when I get up, and my FBG is above 5.

    I just drink gallons of H2O during the day.
     
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  9. Mafat

    Mafat · Well-Known Member

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    The answer is-One Meal A day +LCHF +Exercise-HIIT. Since last June I started eating one meal a day & all other strategies which brought my A1C down to normal range. I am going to make this regimen as life style.
     
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  10. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    How's your muscle growth/sustainability?

    Hit is out for me due to bad back but I can still do some sort of exercise. Wish I could go back to the gymx
     
  11. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Oracle

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    I have been fasting three days a week for the last month and it certainly helps to bring my BG down. I just drink tea and coffee with Alpro wholebean Soya milk (v low carb) on my fast day. From what I have read there is a lot of disagreement over the muscle mass question so I won't give an opinion here but for lowering BG levels especially in the morning it's very good, my dawn phenomenon almost disappears.
     
  12. Mafat

    Mafat · Well-Known Member

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    For Muscle growth...I do weightlifting & I am back in shape.
     
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  13. Robbity

    Robbity Type 2 · Expert

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    I agree... I don't believe that unless you're not eating properly to start with that short term fasting is going to cause your body to start cannibalizing itself. It's surely going to use energy from food you've previously, eaten, then any glucose reserves, and then stored fats before it finally starts on muscle. The only dangers I can possibly see might be if you were eating a very low carb, low fat diet and had no body reserves to start with, or were possibly an althlete or body builder who would be likely to be using masses more energy than our "normal" low carbing diabetic.

    Robbity
     
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  14. Roytaylorjasonfunglover

    Roytaylorjasonfunglover Family member · Well-Known Member

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    Fasting is okay in type 2 as long as You discuss with your doctor beforehand
     
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  15. Chook

    Chook Type 2 · Expert

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    I enjoy fasting (how bizarre that sounds coming from someone who loves food as much as I do!) Usually I do a dinner to dinner 24 hour fast at least once a week and sometimes I'll do another 18 hour fast depending on my work rota. I never fast on work days. I always test my BG every hour and have broken my fast (or don't fast) if I feel at all unwell in any way. When I finish my fast I always eat (what I consider to be) an ultra healthy meal of about 450-500 calories - usually some kind of oily fish or roast meat / steak with hot green veg.

    What it does for me now:

    My BG seems to naturally want to be 5.5 to 7.5 even when I'm eating less than 25g of carbs per day. When I fast my BG comes down in to the low 4s then when I go back to my usual less than 25g of carbs per day it will, over the next week, slowly climb back up until I fast again.

    I wouldn't say it does much for me in the way of weight or muscle loss nowadays. It certainly used to, though, and if I fast for two days I might lose an extra pound if I'm lucky. I do it because I like the BG control and I actually quite enjoy the whole fasting thing because it feels like I'm doing something positive for my health.

    What it did for me before:

    My BG used to be up in the late 20s / early 30s and a combination of LCMF and fasting has brought it down to the numbers I have now. In the process I have lost 4st but weight loss has virtually stopped over the last 4 weeks (Christmas might be a factor in that ;) )

    I really do recommend reading Jason Fung's blog and watching his videos on Youtube.
     
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  16. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    @Chook. Thank you! I saw Jason on diet doc and he was interesting although didn't have enough detail for me to start it so I'll go back and google him.

    What I'm thinking is this:
    Mon to fri stop eating at 7pm and skip breakfast but have coffee with double cream. Eat at 12.45 a normal low carb meal then nothing again till dinner.

    Would that work? Is that an example of a diabetic intermittent fast?

    I used to be really confident with dieting but now feel the pressure to get it right. I've had days where I've unintentionally fasted by missing breakfast so I know I can do it but wonder if doing that daily is too much? If it's not, it's save me a load of hassle with breakfast solutions!

    Thanks
    D x
     
  17. Chook

    Chook Type 2 · Expert

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    I don't think that would work for me. I literally don't eat anything for 24 hours when I fast. I drink either water or redbush tea, neither of which contain calories.

    Actually, what you describe is what I do nearly every day on the days that I'm not fasting. The point of fasting is to give your system a rest from processing food. Jason Fung explains it very well. Also there is a YouTube Horizon programme about fasting featuring Dr Michael Morley, it was as a result of researching that programme that he hit on his 5:2 diet, I think.

    Hope that helps :)
     
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  18. Charles Macdonald 1954

    Charles Macdonald 1954 Type 2 · Member

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    Hi Deb McGee. Information that I think would answer your questions about the benefits of combining intermittent fasting with low-carbohydrate high-fat diets can be found at either of these two sites: dietdoctor.com. The first of these two is the work of Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt and the second features and profiles the work of Dr. Jason Fung. Fung has appeared as a guest on diet doctor and these two positions have combined their expertise and knowledge to provide very beneficial information for the treatment and reversal of type 2 diabetes. Hope this is helpful, best of success in 2016!
     
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  19. Debmcgee

    Debmcgee Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    So far from what I've seen, skipping breakfast is a way to fast so I'll do it Monday to Friday as its more convenient. I think it'll be ok but won't know till I try it I guess.

    Thanks for sharing all your experiences xxx
     
  20. AloeSvea

    AloeSvea Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I think my doctor is hugely relieved I no longer discuss the details of my food and activity treatment, which includes periodic no-food fasting :), and the use of various supplements. She was very nice about it when, at the beginning, I did what everyone, and supplement bottles suggested - consulted with my GP due to my chronic illness. But as wonderful as she is, diet and exercise regimes are not her thing. Which is rather common I would have thought!

    I guess you only need to discuss it with your health professionals once?

    And then really only, I would say, if you are taking medication. Or have a complication or other health issue that might be affected. (For me it was my gall bladder and the gallstone.)
     
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